Winchester Ammunition has just released a game changer in the straight walled cartridge marketplace, the 350 Legend. Claiming to be the fastest straight-walled centerfire cartridge in the world, the Legend is offered in six different options.
The author sending some rounds downrange.
“The 350 Legend is a high-performing, straight-walled cartridge that dominates in velocity, energy, recoil and affordability, all of which are vital to our customers,” said Matt Campbell, vice president of sales and marketing for Winchester Ammunition.
“Winchester innovation began decades ago and it’s paramount that we continue to deliver meaningful, technology-driven products that have a tremendous impact on the hunting and shooting sports industry,” added Campbell.
Some notable features of the Legend Cartridge include:
- More energy than the 30-30 Winchester, .300 Blackout and the .223 Remington.
- Approximately 20% less recoil than the .243 Winchester with 20% more penetration.
- Less recoil than the 450 Bushmaster.
- Winchester advertises the effective deer hunting range up to 250 yards all while delivering more energy than the 5.56mm, .300 Blackout and the 30-30 Winchester.
It utilizes a modified straight walled .223 Remington shell casing and a .357 diameter bullet. The cartridge is also compliant in states that allow straight-walled cartridges for deer hunting.
Various offerings of the Legend.
Despite the significant ballistic improvements, the Legend has a very manageable recoil and allows the shooter to get back on target quickly, allowing for follow-up shots on big game or thinning out the local rabbit population.
Click here for more information.
2019 350 Legend Ammunition Offerings:
- Symbol Sub Brand Bullet Description
- X350DS Deer Season XP® 150 grain Extreme Point
- X3501 Super X® 180 grain Power-Point
- X3501H Hog Special 180 grain Power-Point
- USA3501 USA White Box 145 grain FMJ Flat Nose
- X3501BP Power Max Bonded® 160 grain Bonded JHP
- SUP350 Super Suppressed™ 265 grain Open Tip
I just made up one in an AR M4 platform. Mainly for a first deer gun for my 9-year-old Grandson. AND mainly due to the light recoil and muzzle blast. Damn thing shoots less than 2-inch groups off-hand at 100 yards. Deer are almost always bigger than that. Rabbits as well!!!
THEN I saw a Youtube video where they cut one down inch by inch and chrono-ed the result. It lost almost nothing as it got shorter. Was still firing 100 yards, small groups of 180-grain spitzers at well over 2000 fps. from a ten-inch barrel! So decided I really did need an AR handgun made up for Minnesota deer hunting where the longest shot would be 100 to 150 yards. AND of course, since I have made other fun ones, the cost is really cheap to do another upper to play with; since I do have a 300 blackout and 6.5 Grendel in the handgun configuration. If you already have a tricked out lower it is like having a whole new fun-gun to play with for way less than $200.00. If you put the parts together yourself. And any heavy-footed monkey humper without much mechanical aptitude can do that in about 15 to 20 minutes. I can only imagine how much fun that 4.5-pound piece would be strolling through the brush looking for the next pig-roast.
Can’t believe that the 350 legend can come close to the 45 raptor. Have used the raptor for 2 years shooting 10 deer with it. Only two have taken a step after being shot. Getting 2750 fps with a 200 gr Hornady ftx on hand loaded shells.
It is not supposed to be! It is supposed to just be something that kills pigs and deer at less than 200 yards. And by the way, I have seen kids miss deer at that distance because they were afraid of the recoil from a 30-06. After shooting one with a 300 blackout at about 100 yards I am sure a 350 will kill one pretty good. And believe it or not, a dead deer is just as dead after properly shooting them at 100 yards if it is with a 350 Legend as it would be using my 300 Weatherby. That Weatherby I laugh about killing on one end while crippling on the other. 🙂
I can see this possibly being a Police carbine . As for hunting it will work but there better and proven cartridges out there .
My straight-walled 45-70 kicks the crap out of the 350 “Legend”. Buffalo Bore produces one of the hottest .45-70 loads commercially available with a 405 grain jacketed flat nose bullet propelled at 2000 feet per second for a tooth rattling 3597 foot pounds of muzzle energy, and I have loads that are a little hotter. Yes, the recoil may hurt a bit, especially as my age advances, but so much for the “more energy” than any other straight-walled cartridge claim made by Winchester.
The statement was highest velocity straight walled cartridge. Not most energy. I beleive they are speaking of ar 15 size cartridges which the 45-70 isn’t.
For those of us that don’t reload (yet) the 45/70 is dang near cost prohibitive. Also 350 legend has less recoil and easily found for about a third of the cost as a box of 20 rds 45/70 .
No one gives a shit about your 45/70.
I just checked Winchester site their ballistic charts it shows on the Deer Season 150 grs. That the 30-30 has more energy than the 350 Legend. Just wondering?
It looks like something the AR people might like but a poor design in a bolt action, lever gun or single shot. No thanks.
this 350 is going to be a hit,,,,i am not much on most newer cartridges of late,, but this one has a purpose,,,,
10 years ago, leverevolution 160 gr 30/30 400 more ft_lbs at 200 yards..
I would like to see something like a revolver or a lever action that could chamber the 350 legend, .357 mag, and .38 special.
It’s called a Dan Wesson 357 Remington maximum, no longer produced
I know most comments here have been black-gun based, and that’s fine, but I have a different angle. I think that Remington should jump on this with their 7400 and 7600 rifles. Seems they are a perfect platform for this cartridge. They already have made .35 caliber barrels (would require correct chambering) for these guns, and have made a .223 breech bolt for them back in 64′, add a .308 recoil spring and you’re in business. Heck, their magazines should even work with it. Not much Engineering to it. I think deer hunters would snap them up! I still don’t understand why Ruger hasn’t re-introduced their .44 carbine re-vamped to shoot the .450 Bushmaster.. I think it would be a seller too. Suggested it to Ruger over a year ago, haven’t seen anything yet.
From my understanding and little experimenting , the ruger 44mag deerstalker was designed /tuned and set up around one weight of ammo . IE wouldnt function as reliably with other weights or brands. The 450 bm has a pretty wide variation between ammo manufacturers so needless to say unless they built one with an anjustable system , it is likely it’d be hit or miss on function.
I think I’ll stick with my 460 revolver more of a challenge and a heck of a lot to shoot
I agree with Jeff, hunting with my 460 7 1/2 “ Performance Center is the bomb. Tough to outdo this hunting handgun out to 200 yards.
Had another thought on this. Wish Winchester had used a 9mm, 0.355″, bullet rather than a 0.357: bullet. Why? There are lots of barrel manufacturers already turning out 9mm barrels for ARs. Shifting to this cartridge with a 9mm bullet would simply require those barrel manufacturers to bore a different chamber. Making an AR barrel for the 357 would require a new setup for the barrel bore and rifling., meaning the new barrels would be rare and expensive at first. I have to wonder if Winchester did this on purpose to keep from competing with all these little manufacturers. Bad enough for Winchester that all us reloaders are going buy very little of the manufactured cartridges, but also cutting the volume of firearms they sell would leave them wondering they bothered trying to do this.
Better variety of hunting bullets in 357
so its a modern version of the 38.55? sweet!
So, your telling me that its got more power than the 45 Raptor? I’ll go head to head with my 16” barrel any day.
MY 35 REMINGTON WILL BEAT THE 35 LEGEND, BUT IS NOT A STRAIGHT WALL.
MUST HAVE SOME VERY HIGH PRESSURE .
I have handloaded a single round of 150gr spirepoint ammo, followed by a mag full of normal round nose/PMC Starfire in a 30-30 for years. Gives me a first shot usable range around 225 yds before bullet drop gets too much for my eyes and peep sights.
Lately I’ve been using the Hornady Leverevolution with great results also.
Neat Idea, but it doesn’t really get me excited. That being said, the Mad Dog Weapons System 30GPC tossing a 150gr bullet at around 2700 from a standard AR15 upper does get my attention. Waiting on one now.
Okay, despite all the hate on this. I’m going to like 350 Legend. It like having a .358 Yeti but not having to make your own brass. Now I can’t wait for an upper for my AR to try it out.
So basically 100 fps faster than a 450 bushmaster with 100 grain less bullet. All I have looked at so far takes comparisons from this gun and then camparison from another so it looks like something if your going to do comparisons do it straight across the boards not picking this and that so you look good.
So why would anyone want this over a .450 bushmaster upper? Besides the price and recoil 450 wins all day with more ft lbs and a larger diameter bullet with the same trajectory.
Because some states require a straight walled cartridge case to legally hunt.
The .450 Bushmaster is a straight walled cartridge, sir.
A whole lot less recoil than a 450 BM is a good thing! Deer aren’t that tough to kill and they certainly do not require a 45 caliber bullet.
Yawwwwn.Streeeech. Um, a new 35? Based on the pipsquek .223 case ( whic h I love)No thanks.My
Custom shop Model 7 in 350 Magnum does it all.Load it up for Elk.Load it down with cast bullets for anything else. But hey the marketeers main goal is to make us unhappy with what we already have.Theres the door Sir!
Your 350 Mag is a fine cartridge but you can’t use it in straight wall restricted states!
I think you have that backwards. the restriction wouldnt be against the 350 Mag it would be against using a straight wall cartridge for big game. Your State will be Yes bottle-neck, Yes straight-wall. Or Yes bottle-neck, No straight-wall.
Let me rephrase that. The 350 Magnum is not allowed in areas that are restricted to straight wall only. I know of no state that is restricted to bottlenecked cartridges only!
Everyone has to keep developing new cartridges to be relevant. We now have a 75 to 250 yard deer rifle when we are setting in that shooting house with that range of view. If we are in the other shooting house that we can only shoot out to 150, we will use out 44 mag. IF we are in the one that we can see 400 yards, we will use our 308. My gun safe isn’t large enough.
Looks like Winchester updated the old .351 SLR cartridge (.351 dia. bullet, 180 grs, ~1800 fps). Hope that some fool does’t try to shoot this new .350 in an old model 07.
The 350 cartridge is way too long to fit in a model 7.
since .223 parent brass and no shoulder it must chamber on the case mouth. not my favorite method, but it works. reloaders will have to monitor brass length closely.
Being it is a Straight Wall case, it will probably “grow” very little. Case length is important, but cases should be good for a few reloads b4 trimming.
BFR, I want one, hang it next to the 357 max Blackhawk in the safe. Call it my 357 Rimless Super Snappy Maximum!!!
With a good extractor design, it is still possible for it to headspace on the extractor, not the case mouth. It would be like when you shoot .40SW in a 10mm Glock 20.
This would also be like shooting .380 ACP in a 9mm Beretta PX4, which apparently headspaces on the extractor (rim) also. The .380 doesn’t cycle the slide, but its’ quieter than 9mm.
I am glad to see development in this way. Not long ago we have been able to hunt with a rifle in Ohio. A lot of older cartridges are really good. But recently I have been using a 357 mag rifle loaded up hot with a 125 gr bullet. It is unbelievable what it will do to a deer in a rifle. I feel they are on the right track to something good.
Can you home make it from 223 brass?
The case is supposedly 1.71″ long. That works out to be 43.434mm. The .223 / 5.56×45 brass is 44.7mm in overall length, but that includes the shoulder and neck. So, you would need to be able to reform that shoulder and neck area to the diameter of the rest of the cartridge. Anneal it and fire form it might work, but trying to expand it straight from range pickup brass will probably result in some split necks. Of course, any necks that do split can be recycled as .300AAC, .22TCM, or .38 Super Cooper brass.
Reforming the .300AAC from 5.56×45 brass is a bit more reliable since you start off by cutting the brass down with a rough cut right at the shoulder, so you aren’t having to try to expand the shoulder and neck back to the full case diameter.
With a case length of 1.71″, it’s going to be pretty similar ballistically to what you can get with the .357 Maximum which has a case length of 1.605″. With a max loading, you can probably get a bit more out of the .350 Legend since there should be slightly more case volume and the cartridge is rated for higher pressure.
If this can be made to work in the AR platform and the brass reformed from .223 / 5.56×45 brass, it might end up being more popular than the .300ACC.
An interesting cartridge, but similar to an existing wildcat, the 357 AR. This 350 appears to use about 1.71” case, compared to 1.6” for the 357 AR, which was designed to feed from slightly modified AR15 mags. It is likely that the new 350 will be too long to feed in an AR.
More data is available from Mad Dog Weapon Systems, and the associated forum Modern Sporting Rifle Evolution. Primary credit for development of the 357 AR is due to a guy from MI that goes by moleman.
CMMG already has a AR to fit the 350 Legend. They are going to have uppers and barrels for it too.
Basically, Winchester has reinvented the 30-30 in a straightwall cartridge. Shoots the same weight bullet around the same velocity and has around the same muzzle energy out to 200 yards. (despite the claim the 350 has better 200 yard energy, there are lots of 30-30 cartridges with a similar energy) On the other hand, if I was trying to sell a close quarters submachine gun to the military, you’ve got the right cartridge. Roughly twice the energy of the M855 cartridge in short barrel configurations with a cheap to manufacture cartridge and easily works with the current M4 lowers. Plus, there is no way some idiot can accidentally chamber this cartridge in a 5.56 barrel. Being the military, would need to invent a way to keep that idiot from chambering the 5.56 in the 350 barrel, but at least he isn’t going to kill himself doing this. Hmm?
Chambering a 5.56 in a .350 barrel is not going to be a big deal. It will fire, the bullet will leave the barrel and it might even hit the target if it is close enough. Accuracy will suck and velocity will be reduced, but it’s not going to get lodged in the barrel. It might not cycle the action though. When he looks at the brass after firing it, he’s going to see it probably fireformed to .350 Legend (although maybe with a split neck in the process).
When is the expected release date to vendors also is this only offered in a bolt gun?
It’s claimed to be the fastest straight wall cartridge. I have a straight wall that is 2790 fps. My question is it faster than mind?
According to “Winchester.com” it leaves the muzzle a little over 2300. 100yd zero its about 2,5″ low at 150, 7.6″ low at 200, Approx 17″ low at 250. I would call this a 200yd round it really starts dropping like a rock after that.