  The Zastava PAP from Century Arms (bottom) is an AK-47, with some important changes that make it a much nicer gun overall. Notice the long and fat Yugo M70 sized forend, and the full length stock. These are brand new guns made from 100% new parts, made in Serbia. The PAP is only sold by Century Arms.  The internals of the PAP are just like a standard AK, but you can see that they are not crude like the Romanian and Chinese guns. The PAP is different from many Zastava guns because the receiver is straight cut, not slanted.  The furniture on the PAP is made from stained maple, not laminated plywood, and it is very pretty, as AKs go.  The front barrel and gas assembly replaces the generally unused bayonet lug with a cleaning rod and sling mount.  The dust cover release has a special button that holds it in the open position. This eliminates the frustrating method of forcing the dust cover down to close it, which is usually a wrestling match.  The AK-47 is not a target gun by any stretch of the imagination, but we managed to get it into the Lead Sled regardless. Don’t try this at home we ended up bending a magazine.  Very few people shoot high end ammo in an AK, and this Winchester white box, really just cheap range ammo, was the best we could get. Most shots fell within 5 inches or so, using a Nikon 1-4 scope mounted on the rear, and somewhat wiggly rail. You would have to put a quad rail on the front and mount a scope-type scope on it to see what the best accuracy would be, probably around 3 MOA.  The safety on the PAP is easy to engage and disengage with one finger. It throws the brass forward right, about 30 feet, right into the drainage pond. Hmmmm. Drainage pond… AK-47.  The safety is unique among factory AK-47s. Unlike most AKs that don’t have a bolt hold open, the PAP safety has a notch for the charging handle and it is easy to “show clear.”  This was the first trip into the pond for the PAP, trying it just with water.  Even though we let the water drain, shooting it produced a visible spray of water on every shot. When the gun was later taken apart the gas system showed no signs of ever having been wet, so this may have been the source of the water.  After dunking and draining the gun several times, we covered it with sand and muck from the pond.  You wouldn’t think that even an AK-47 could sustain this kind of gunk in it without failing.  We did what you would do in real life, dunk the gun in the water to clean the muck off, then shoot it. We used the magazine and ammo that was in it for the tests.  You can see that the gun was still dripping when we shot the picture for this. Overall, the gun ran. Every several rounds the sand in the magazine would cause a failure to feed, but it was easily cleared, and the gun stayed in the fight. The accuracy quite as good, but the scope faired a lot worse than the rifle and is still fogged up today. Electing to leave the PAP dirty and wet was a great idea, because that is what would happen in real life. Nobody carries a gun cleaning kit in their ready bag, or grabs one when the flood waters start coming through the front door. With all of the new legislation keeping the government from taking our guns in the event of natural disaster, it could be a week or more before the gun is no longer a requirement. Almost all of the sand and much fell out of the PAP when we shot it, and though the trigger has some scratch and the bolt feels scratchy, the gun looks and works like brand new.  When the bubbles clear, you can be sure that your AK-47 is completely full of water, but don’t worry, it will probably still work just fine. |
Century International Arms
https://www.centuryarms.com/
If you could make a list of all the things wrong with the AK-47 platform, what would it be? First off, you would probably say the stock is too short, the trigger is lousy, and you never know if you bought a gun made of old, worn out parts. There are also little annoying things, like getting the dust cover back on once you take it off, and it is a pain to shoot an AK at the range because the bolt doesn’t stay open. The AK is also known for not being accurate. “It’s a spray and pray gun.” All of these things are true to some degree, and all of them have been fixed in a new Zastava PAP build of the AK-47 currently being imported by Century Arms. It is still an AK-47 of course, but we found this gun to be the absolute best of the AK bunch, and it held up to legendary AK reliability when we threw it in the pond and covered it with muck. The $700-800 street price Zastava PAP from Century is a brand new gun made from brand new parts, and is about as much gun as you are going to get in a true AK-47. In the wake of the floods of Isaac, if you are going to strap one rifle to your back, the Zastava PAP is a good option.
All that floodwater from Hurricane Isaac brought a lot of people back to the aftermath of Katrina. It makes you reconsider the AR-15 as the ideal “ready rifle.” Most ARs these days are built for the best accuracy you can get from the platform. Most of us will never shoot at anything besides targets, and everyone likes to hit what they are shooting at. Accuracy comes at a price though. Accuracy equals tighter tolerances equals less tolerance for foreign matter, and a more finicky gun. We have all seen “AR-15 Torture Test” articles, but these are generally done with high end ARs from companies with big ad budgets. The AR-15 is known to be finicky, and I’ve always questioned the veracity of such tests. Reliability in extreme conditions has always been the home of the AK-47, and few would argue that there is gun more able to withstand even the worst of what our Creator has to offer.
The ultimate question on this Cadillac of AKs comes down to cost. The Zastava PAP is an expensive AK-47 in comparison to the generally well under $500 Romanian AKs that Century also imports, and that generally work fine. There are also plenty of MAK-90 Norincos (another Century contribution) out there in the market that also work just fine. Is a high end AK-47 worth roughly the cost of a low end AR-15? Depending on where you live, and what extreme emergency you may have to face with only a rifle on your back, an AR might be fine. But if you really, honestly, feel that you need a gun that can really, honestly, fight after being slogged in water, mud, sand, whatever, then the AK-47 is the gun for you. This high end AK from Century addresses a lot of problems with the standard AK-47 design.
The PAP is made from all new parts, including the U.S. made compliance parts. That means you aren’t shooting a pieced together parts gun that was disassembled in another country and put back together here on a US made receiver. Everything, including the barrel and every last little spring and pin, is new. The stained maple stock is longer than a standard AK stock, with a 13 1/2 inch length of pull similar to most deer and sniper rifles. Zastava made the famous Yugo M70, and these rifles have forends the same size. It is bigger and beefier than a standard AK and requires different sized furniture if you plan to upgrade the gun with a quad-rail. The PAP is also called the M70, to be clear that the UTG and other quad rails made for the Yugo M70 also fit this gun. Century also has a polymer thumbhole stock version of the PAP as well, including a low-cap version for New York state, but it also has a wooden forend. For heat resistance, most people prefer the traditional wooden forend. The alternative is a quad-rail with a front grip.
The Picatinny rail on the dust cover is stable enough for close quarters battle optics and sights, but is not rock solid stable enough for real optics. It wiggles, which is nearly unavoidable, so if you want a genuinely stable optic to get the most accuracy out of the gun possible, you will want to buy a quad rail and forward mounted scout-type scope. There is also a nifty catch button on the dust cover clip that allows you to remove and replace the dust cover much easier than you can with a standard AK. We mounted a 1-4 Nikon .223 scope on the PAP and while we were able to hit a man sized target easily at 100 yards, the gun would probably do much better with a stable scout scope on the front. A real AK is never going to be thought of as a great long range weapon, even with optics, but we were able to get 4-5″ groups at 100 yards with good repeatability even with the dust cover mounted Nikon.
Probably the coolest feature on the gun is the safety. We have all been to the range with our AKs and had to stick a spent round of brass in the gun to “show clear.” The folks at the Zastava factory, in today’s modern Serbia, built a notch into the safety on the PAP to hold the bolt back, like a real gun. It still doesn’t have a last round hold open, but at least you can put the gun on safe with the bolt open and drop the bolt on a fresh mag, just like an AR. The safety is also not at all stiff like your standard Romanian AK. You can reach forward with one finger without releasing your hold on the pistol grip to both engage and dis-engage the safety, which is a huge tactical advantage often thought to be the biggest weak point of the standard AK.
Soooo, that brings us to “why did we throw the Cadillac of the AK-47s in the drainage pond?” The answer is simple – if you make a better AK, with tighter tolerances, where the safety doesn’t stick and the trigger actually breaks clean, do you sacrifice reliability under the worst conditions? The only way to answer this is to thrown the gun in the pond, repeatedly, which we did, then cover it with muck and step on it, underwater, which we did. And then of course we have to shoot it again, which we did. It worked pretty well, actually. Everyone loves to see what could be an urban myth proved out in person, and the no-matter-what reliability of the AK appears to be not a myth at all.
The results were surprising and real. What we found was that it isn’t like Rambo coming up out of the water shooting and the gun works perfectly. It did fire, with a spray coming out of the receiver on every shot, but the muck and sand in the magazine hung the PAP up once in a while. These were easily cleared, and then the gun continued to run. The steel cased Russian Tula ammo didn’t fail, and downrange, the shots were on target, but not grouped well. The Nikon scope didn’t fare as well as the gun. It is still cloudy. Probably should have just dunked the gun on that one. Live and learn.
As you can see from the pictures, we did let most of the water run out of the gun before firing it, which is what most people would do in a real life situation. The water did not permeate the gas system apparently, even though it was left underwater for several minutes, several times. Water may have actually gotten in there, but was blown out completely when the gun was fired. The soot inside the gas tube where the push rod goes looked to be undisturbed, however.
Once you throw your rifle in the pond (oh yea, Century will probably want us to buy this gun), you might as well just let it air dry and see what happens. This is what we did, and the results were shocking. Not one speck of rust formed anywhere on the gun, and besides a little bit of sand here and there, you would never know that gun had been dunked. The rails and Tapco trigger group will eventually be detailed with Q-Tips to get the sand particles out, but look at the picture. It doesn’t seem to be any worse for wear at all. The bolt assemblies on the PAP are chromed, which is why they didn’t pick up any surface rust, but seeing it in action isn’t like reading it in theory. If you need it to fight after you just swam away from your house, the Zastava PAP will be ready today, and tomorrow, even if you had to stay on the go and couldn’t sit down and get the gunk out.
As extreme as all of this may sound, we must all remember that these situations happen. You won’t see an AK-47 standoff between a business owner and a gang of looters after a flood. The anti-2nd Amendment media wants us all to believe that only drive by gangs and terrorists own AKs. But the reality is, this stuff happens all the time, everywhere. A regular, Romanian or Norinco AK-47 is the most affordable and reliable firepower on the market, but if your budget allows it, these Zastava PAP guns from Century might be a better, Cadillac style option. Brand new, they cost what a used, bottom of the line AR-15 costs, and while they won’t give you perfect one inch groups at the range, they are brand new, reliable, and ergonomically better than most AK-47s. It is hard to ever recommend an AK-47 to someone who plans to shoot a lot punching paper or clanging steel, but when it is you and a gang of looters, there is no better friend than a ready to rock AK-47, and the Zastava PAP from Century is the best AK-47 on the market.
Century International Arms
https://www.centuryarms.com/
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What are the core or basic lessons taught Writing classes? One of the first things I learned about was Freytags Pyramid. I was told that isn’t an across the board learning device. So what is? I’m really curious. In poetry I was taught, ‘if it means too many things to too many people it misses it’s mark’. I have since learned that good writing tends to bring out different reactions in different people and different interpretations. How can learning about creative writing (creativity is so individualized) be standardized?.
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I have a MB70AB2 underfolder as well, mine also states the DC Inds and is a RPK style 1.5mm thick reciever, its a “NODAK SPUD” reciever and I believe you are tight those are 100% USA made, already cut for double stack mags and also have the US barell which is not chrome lined, mine runs like a champ, I am happy these were not recievers that were touched by Century, I have a newer Pap M70, like the one in the review, and the older one is better, seems better made and better put together, the: MB70AB2 shoots like a dream, very smooth action, cheekweld was fixed with a Samson cheek riser, expensive at $71 but worth it, also I ordered a wood handguard from Apex gunparts with slight blemish for total shipped for $29, and sanded it and stained it with a dark orange wood color. If you can find another MB70AB2 used but in good condition with a US made reciever which I think the new ones are as well get thatm the recievers look like they are cut straight and are oveall very tight rifles, I agree with other posts the mags in both recievers in these rifles whether the MB70AB2 US Nodak or the Pap M70 newer ones all have mag fitting issues, some fit some dont, but these are Century rifles you cannot expect them to perfect.
This is a bit of topic, but I recently purchased a a used MB70AB2 underfolder, black front grips, bought it from a friend of a friend that needed money really bad,so I got it for approx 1/3 of what a new one costs, it was a bit rusty and needed some cleaning but I got it back into diesent condition plus I know it was not shot that much and just sat there, mine as per CA was a 2007 or left the CA that year, the reason I bought was because these have a Ndak spud recieved and a US made barell by DC inductries I believe and this reciever is not touched by century and is a good one at 1.5mm thick RPK type as well, so if I can have one thats not cut out by the Century monkeys I am all good this idea, this rifle shoots good, much better than the Wasr and also I had a pap m70 all wood like the one in the review above and that one was 1st gen and was good, single stack bolt, uneven cut magwell, and all the rest of the fucked up fixins you can or heard of about the problem Paps, also the thing that pissed me off was that I couldnt use all type of mags and also guess what this: MB70AB2 same thing, but at least some plastic mags fit like the polymer bulg and the Tapco fake bakelite and ofcource “most of the metal ones. Other than that this one or the MB70AB2 shoots great and is very nice, little have and the underfolred sucks I knew that before buying, now a cheek rest and all is good.
The new ones I saw are better, but still no “CADILLAC” to me, anyone defending Century products doesent really understand quality guns period, they are getting better and thats way overdue especially years and many many years of customers shitting in them, Centuris cath-up game is long overdue and they are kind of loosing the battle unless they prove themselves with the new C39 Milled USA made AK and make the PAP better by listening to peoples complaints and issues, otherwise their reputation will never change. I do not preffer their fireamrs especially ones imported and have to be opened up for 922r comp, they do not do the job correctly and it looks like shit.
Ar’s are not better by any means than a “properly” built AK, I own both, I have a Spikes and a DD, and shoot my friends BCM AR as well, they run almost flawlessly, here and there a hickup from shitty ammo or just a lack of cleaning after many shooting trips to the range, —BUT—-, I tried the DD a $1550 Ar and my Arsenal 7.62×39 fixed stock plane jane AK and didnt clean them for 6 months, I shoot approx 3-4 times a month, roughly about 150-200 rounds per each rifle via each trip to the range, DD started to malfunction (started with a cleaned/lubed, etc…) with Brass PMC/Lake city ammo at approx 600 rounds, the AK took/takes WOLF steel which is already a mis-match (shooting steel in an AR is like shooting charcoal brickets through your AR) , and this is with a Spikes heavy buffer and a Chrome Silicon spring (and no those arent the issue, I tried with factory springs/buffer back in there and same results 50 rounds later), The AR needed a cleaning, The Arsenal ran and keeps running at over 1500+ rounds now (I stopped counting now), I love the Ar’s for better accuracy, ergonomics, lighter in most setups, etc… SO compared to **MY particular** AK , the AK is gonna be more dependable and will not need maintenance as the round count continues to pile on. Now the accuracy can be fixed, get an 5.45×39 or a 556 AK, stick a better muzzle break (those are avail from many companies now and they work wonders approx 20-30% less muzzle rise) and you have just as accurate rifle as an AR, Russians switched to 5.49X39 many years ago and they are just fine, So the AK is a better Platform when it comes to being able to shoot it without constant maintenance, there is better accesories coming out for the AR’s like better BCG with very slick finishes, better springs, and the single piston AR’s as well (which is a seperate discussion), My AK is the 1st rifle I will grab in a situation where I would need a rifle, AK along with my glock In an Urban “defend you home” type of situation this is all I would need and I think this is all anyone alse would need, AK can hit things at 100yard range (fairly well), where I live there alot of buildings they are all within max 20-75 yards apart so I personally wouldnt need anything beyong that, I am also not a sniper and this is not Iraq, “thank god !!!” so all I worry about is ammo, LOL.
* Now as far as the PAP, I saw them on the shelves and heard mostly not so good reviews and they were like approx $850+ ish? (they were going for more at one point also) I bough a Russian Arsenal at $915 before the panic prices so this was not worth it to mee, plus I am not a magician but I knew or had a slight Idea that prices will eventually come down so I didnt panic but a rifle without the ability to accept all AK type Mags, no 2nd sling, sometimes fucked up sights, no chrome lining in the barel (which is not a total deal breaker, BUT* good to have), no scope attachment and no ability to mount normal stocks withou funny attachments that stand out like sore thumb, and a few more other “features” that CA should have done right. I mean I get it, surplus mags are avail now and are cheap again at $10 average so if you have the 1st one and thats all you like and dont need a scope, then youre in the clear. Plus Echo93 has an 2nd sling attachment for the PAP as well, in this case I can understand. Now I do hear good things about the C39 so far and they made improvements on the 2015 models as well, Nitride barels, and everything is done and finished better, and they are Milled. So if CA is improving their quality then thats great for the consumer, my 1st AK was a WASR and it was a piece of shit, anything and everything was fucked up, I am not going to list what it was, everyone knows those slapped together POS rifles, yes there are plenty that happened to be slapped together and run fine and I understand this but mine was SHIT!!!
WASRS are not better than these, but these are no Cadillac of AK`s are you fucking kidding me here? Cadillac? No, Arsenal is a Rolls Royce then huh? Anyway, as a starter ak its ok for the price it is now and even better at $500 or below, and as a company CA has make their reputation better by making better product overall, the 1st ones of these were shit, and after all still no 2nd sling attachment, fucking retards! And yes when SHTF situation ak is the way to go over an ar, yeah the ars can run good too but those cost more and require more maintenance sooner than an ak will, that makes the ak more superior, and within or up to 100-150 yards its all you need in an urban situation.
“Modern well built AR-15’s are actually more reliable than AKs, all issues compared, ”
Have helped too many folks unjam pricy AR’s at my local range to take this to seriously.
I own one of these OPAP’s and when the looters show not all of us can just “pack up
and leave” and if they arrive in numbers you will need rifle caliber firepower and it’s
doubtful any shots will be farther then 100 yards. Weapon like the OPAP gives you
options if the bad guys arrive in a vehicle and it’s “good enough”.
For anyone reading this to find solid information about the serbian ak’s or any other ak for that matter LEAVE NOW. The people who posted this article know about as much about ak’s as your Joe Blow average american. I also doubt they know much factual information about any gun for that matter. First off if your paying $800 for a Zavasta PAP M70 or M90(very similar gun) your either living in a gun crisis or your being ripped off. You can currently buy an M70 for $525 or maybe less. This gun in my opinion is even more of “starter” ak than a wasr. Seeing as the furniture is not standard ak it is difficult to customize. Not to mention I think the wood is a blan brown color. A wasr stock can easily be stained and coated to look better. To say that a pap is the “cadillac” of the ak market is extremely ignorant. The Pap has no chrome lined bore. The inside of the barrel may be coated, but I’ve never heard of this. Also the rails they put on the dust cover are worthless because dust covers move. These guns are one of the heavier variants of ak. On the plus side the have a heavy rpk receiver, new parts, and after all it is reliable. This would not be enough to persaude me to buy one though. If you wanna research higher level ak’s take a look at the Romanian wasr10 or m+m10, hungarian ak’s, chinese polytechs, Saiga’s, polish ak’s, veprs, and bulgarian builds. Lastly I’m not biased in the ak vs. ar debate I have both and I like them both.
You must be fucking joking if you’re throwing the chink polytech into the mix. That a massive steaming fucking pile bro. I have a ton of AR’s and AK’s, including the CA PAP with the thumb hole. Who fucking told you it was hard to modify? Maybe if you’re Stevie Wonder. I have a dust cover rail that’s rock solid and MAGPUL front end that married right up. Don’t dis others when you sound as fucking stupid as they do.
The PAP is just ok for the $550-$650 range now, just ok. Its better than the shitfest Wasr, that they still to this day CA shafts people with, its just ok, for an entry level Ak its not bad.
I agree, my past experiences with century are not good, the ak are glued together waste, this one looks great from a distance, up close not so much, fuck century, fuck em, fuck em…
****Cymond*****
I saw some of your replies to people venting on here, do you have nothing better to do other than filter peoples shit on here? I have a job and way too busy to be a fucking retard to filter peoples shit on here, so people do not like this POS rifle, so fucking what? So fucking what? Are you employed by CA? Is that what this is? If so then suck a big fat dick for me please because Century arms is a the most cock sucking company I have ever, ever had the experience of dealing with. Faggot…
I saw this rifle, didnt like the quality, was missin sum stuff that a complete full quality rifle should have, and i hear it dont fit any tapco or some other plastic mags, def not my 1st choice when it comes to an AK. You like it you get it..good luck.
Century arms has terrible customer service, from what i have seen and felt while shooting a friends WASR and another family members PAP when they first came out was enough for me to see the shit magwells, canted sights, over cut magwells, wobbly mags, not all mags fitting, shittiest of the shit customer svc based on ther peoples reviews, etc..et…No thanks, AK’s are supped to be a work-horse, stick a mag in, rock back and go, less maintenance or almost none, can use shitty ammo without too many or no issues (in general), great penetration, the worlds greatest battle rifle ever made especially within 20-150 yeard range, which almost fist any urban environment and I live in an urban area, so CA can suck a shiny dick with the products they sell, my money will go to normal builds and importers or either Bulgarian and or Russian AK rifles, if I have to pay more I will, I am not that rich to spend on shit, when i get something I want it to be worthy of how hard I work for my money. The end…
I had one before, was a piece of shit conversion by the non other than the dickheads at CA, sent it back, (not gonna list what was wrong, but it was, plenty issues listed by others already and above), got it back without them fixing anything, note saying use surplus mags and there are plenty other accesories you can get yourself, i wasnt asking these cunts to buy me accesories but to fix their bullshit job, but no, sold it, got an Arsenal product, took me a while to save for one but I did, Happy is not the work when it comes to Arsenal Bulgarian ak I have, its perfect. went to a local gun store last week, they had the new models I think its the N-Pap, not 100% sure though, same looking shitty magwell, no 2nd sling, one rifle good sights and next one no, shitty, I mean shitty action, same BS from the same cunt of a company, nothing less and nothing more, these should be $300 and not a penny more, I am not cheap and know and understand what quality costs, this is not quality, its mediocre stuff at best, its slightly higher than a shitty WASR would be. I dont care about anyone that has a good one, I am happy for you, enjoy your rifle and happy shooting, I dont like em, to me these rifles are shitty CA product.
I purchased a MP 85 PAP. This gun was sold to me as a 223/5.56, but after several trips to the the range with 223 and buying another mag I found something. This gun would jam with 223. I was ask about what ammo size was printed on the gun. 5.56. My MP85 PAP, ONLY works correct with 5.56 ammo! Not sure if this is true with others? Love the gun now, but found the 223 vs 5.56 issue the only problem.
I had one 1.5 years ago, shitty magwell, I mean uneven. didnt accept any plastic mags, none. I had a tapco, Bulg, Us-palm, none of those fir other than the metal surplus. Which is somewhat ok. No 2nd sling ring which should be on the buttstock, no, nothing. How do you send something like that out of your factory, plus the sights were so fucking off!! Just in total to me it was just an ok rifle and nothing special. I got a real ak, an Arsenal Russian AK, now thats a nice AK and its what an AK should be. I bought mine used, in very good shape and this was before the ban, cost was $850. I am not rich but the diff between $665 for the new PAP then and the used Arsenal Russian for $850 I take the Arsenal any day!!! I would take a Bulg Arsenal over the Pap as well, and no it doesent have to be the most expencive SAM7 model either. I hope someone like Arsenal takes these rifles or PAP’s and starts to properly cut the magwells out and making a proper AK. Otherwise I would rate this AK at $450 range max, thats what they are worth. But to some as long as the shoot it doesent matter, thats not quite me…
No matter if some one searches for his vital thing, so he/she desires to be available
that in detail, therefore that thing is maintained over here.
What do you mean 5 inch groups? And with a scope??? I am shooting a simple red dot sight using both golden bear and silver bear ammo and getting 3 inches or under. Guns brand new with the side mount, not top rail. Side mount is more secure which may explain it.
It seems like a LOT of the criticism of the PAP here are sock puppet accounts. I started calling them out one-by-one, but it was just too much. Look at the wacky punctuation with a lot of periods, commas, exclamation points, question marks, and the CONSTANT misspelling of “decent” as “diesent”.
Here are some examples I fear may be sock puppets for the same person: alex, james, coreyc, bensonb, websterbb, Bfalconi, bigbear, BillieGunz.
Some of them are less obvious than others. There are some more who only use the weird punctuation, but not the tell-tale misspelling “diesent”. I’m sure a close reading of their choice of words, phrasing, tone, and style will show more similarities.
Go Patrol some other thread, you are likely a Century Troll Patrol employee, do you own a Century Troll Badge? Century Sucks, their Wasr pos rifles are and were shit, maybe the new ones are just ok but are no where near the cost, they should be $250 Max and these Pap’s were complete POS whgen they came out, took 2 newer models to start solving the issues, and yes like eveyone else on here already stated, still no 2nd sling attach, still uneven cut magwell with some still having issues with them, etc…Dont you monkeeys listen to people or give a fuck? You worthless Century cunts!!! I had one of these Im gonna call “misfortunes” you cunts call “rifles” and its better than a WASR but no fucling Cadillac, I saw this review and it pissed me off, yeah it shoots, Im fucking happy for you!!! Its no fucking Cadillac!!! And to reply and talk shit about people saying they do not like this firearm/rifle, wtf!!! They dont like it its for a fucking reason you fucking Century police! Century sucks dick, their customer svc was the worst I have ever dealt with as far as guns, didnt have any issues with Glock or Ruger or Arsenal in LV, NV they all were quick and very, very nice throughout the process, Century in VT sucks dick, they gunsmiths are worthless and so are the sluts working there for cust svc giving you your status of the fix and the shipping, and when you get your rifle back you get a notice that they didnt do or fix shit and basically go suck your own dick youre beat bitch!!! SO FUCK YOU, YOU FUCKIN CA TROLL BITCH!!!!
There is a lot of criticism concerning Century Arms and some toward the yugo PAP itself. Can’t speak for anyone else but Ive had good experience with Century and never had to deal with sending rifles back etc. Got a CETME from them way back when and it functioned flawlessly as long as I had it. Sold it after hearing the stories of how crappy it was.. replaced it with an FAL also made by Century which was also flawless (And a sweet babe to have on one’s arm!) To the AK issue, I have and have had several Yugo AK’s. They arent exactly spec with other ComBloc AKs, BUT they are indeed a “Cadillac” and my most accurate AK’s but with a flaw or two… The lack of chroming the bore and bolt and carrier pieces annoys me and is a glaring fault. I am given to understand that the lack of chrome in the bore is the key to the Yugo’s accuracy (!!!??). True or not, I would rather have the chrome bore… but the Yugos have never to my knowledge issued chrome bore rifles. Collectively they are a bunch of bad ***es and they know the point where the rubber touches the road gun and battle-wise.
I dunno about these rifles or Century service- but I do know a few good rifles I bought from them. I might should check and see if they have any good Rommys left… Heh, come to think of it, the dressed-out MAK-90 next to me was also marketed by CAI years ago… It’s one of my present-day fave carries.. its lean, clean and fast, and for it’s chromed bore my favorite AKs.
5 inch shot group?
I was browsing the internet to see if i could get a different foregrip and I found this.
I recently purchased a Zastava and bought a rail attachment to fit in where a regular optic would. I have a sight mark holo sight and I was able to zero it within centimeters with no problems. While I was prone unsupported.
So what the ef’ are you guys doing?
For a lot of which is natural hpv mainly because of the Warts
there are still choices available to buy. Manage goal this is to stop some of the sexually transmitted disease hpv warts not necessarily the main Warts virus.
Remedies feature: topical ointments products, eliminating
inside the genital warts, or cool each warts through fluid nitrogen.
A little bit of healthcare may also should process to remove typically the genital warts.
I won’t comment on the brand of AK just the optics mount. I would rather have the side mount for any optics on an AK, not on the top receiver cover you have to take off every time you clean it…! The side mount doesn’t interfere with cleaning & it has never lost it’s zero. Change your trigger before you put on a side mount or you’ll have to re-zero your optics. Stay safe, hogs have attitudes.
I own a OPAP that my girlfriend bought me as a Christmas gift, first off I took the furniture off and buffed it with about 25 coats of gunstock oil, then literally ripped off about 500 rounds through it with NO failure to feed or misfires with Tulammo. I believe it’ll eat whatever I feed it. I too was worried about the Century name but they didn’t build it, Zastava built it. Love this gun, thank you Karen!
I own a OPAP AK that my girlfriend, yes girlfriend bought me as a Christmas gift. First thing I did was sand down and hand rub about 25 coats of gunstock oil in it. I put it back together and preceeded to literally rip through about 500 rounds of Tulammo with absolutely no jams or misfires, I really believe it’ll eat whatever I feed it. I really love this gun, I too was concerned abuot the Century thing but they didn’t build this one, Zastava did and they did a great job.
I bought an NPAP with a tapco stock, foreend, and pistol grip a few days ago. Put 300 rounds through it with no hiccups out of tapco and metal surplus mags. It has a side mount for the scope as well. The trigger isn’t horrible and the accuracy was acceptable at 150 yards over the iron sights. Seems solid, doesn’t have any excessive rattle or play. For 600 bucks I am very happy with this rifle. I was leery with it being from Century, but they have no role in the build at all on the newer ones.
I heard about the Pap’s being somewhat better now, i had a terrible experience with mine, I sold it after about a 2 month period, had a few jams, it didnt take any mags other than the surplus metal ones, why should I need to buy crap for a 2nd sling attachment, wtf is that? I personally do not think I will buy another one, unless I see all of those improvements changed, when i see a magwell thats not gutted and un-even, fits all mags like my Arsenal SGL, has normal sling attachments, and as far as aftermarket stuff these are kinda hard to put accessories on, if you are into these kind of things. when I see the feedramp look like a normal piece of steel that has been cut out by a gunsmith and not a factory monkey, then maybe, therwise CA can suck my ass for their fucked up guns!
I just picked up a 2nd Gen N-PAP from a local dealer. Whatever CA did wrong with the early versions of the PAP & N-PAP seem to have been made right on this build, all the way down to the proper double stack bolt and a nice magwell. This is a clean, solid, quality rifle. Next to my WASR the difference is night and day.
I have not yet tried aftermarket mags but will update if/when I do. The N-PAP is rather heavy so anything to save weight will be nice. One thing to consider is that aftermarket upgrades are more limited, but at least with the straight cut receiver on the 2nd gen N-PAP you’ll have some options available.
The only drawbacks for me at this time are : 1) weight- it’s heavy 2) length- longer than standard AK 3) hand guard- not contoured to fit palm 4) Only one sling mount- I’ll have to modify to add a 2nd point.
Overall I am happy with my purchase.
Same here, the N-PAP I have came with a tapco mag that fits better than the metal one, and has a double stack bolt. It seems like it’s a good middle ground between WASR and Arsenal, it doesn’t look like it was hammered together by gypsies and it also doesn’t cost an absurd amount of money.
Some of these comments are downright retarded.
If you’re looking at a PAP M70, get the “O” model. These come straight from Serbia with the proper double stack magwell and bolt.
The feeding problems with early PAP models was due to the magwell and bolt lower lug being set up for single stack mags from the factory. The magwells were milled out to double stack by Century, but the single stack bolt did not feed reliably.
New O-PAP models also have a standard AK side rail to mount optics, rather than the flimsy top cover rail.
Serbian AKs are some of the highest quality in the world.
I don’t know if it was asked but where can I buy that Picatinny dust cover from ?? and Is it reasonably priced?
bought a bushmaster and that thing sucks constant jams. Bought a sig m400 5.56 love it, light ,fast, accurate .Was never really into AKs then one day just got the itch to buy one found a used romanian wasr at a good price and i LOVE this gun and to all those who say they are not accurate that is not true at all, is it as accurate as the AR in my personal tests it comes pretty close i can hit a full size body target at 400 yards no problem ,and its built like a tank . dont get me wrong im not hating on the AR I love mine, but if i was in a when crap hits the fan scenario i would hands down grab the AK.Remember less parts =s less problems and those who always talk about AK inaccuracy need to watch travis haleys video on youtube about the lie of Ak inaccuracy because it is simply that and he is a huge AR fan..But i say with whatever platform you chose just learn your weapons twitches and your accuracy will improve ten fold whether its AR or AK!!!!!!
Century Arms is not a good company, their reputation has always been known for importing and making rifles such as Ak compliant and then them having numerous, I mean numerous problems!!! As mentioned above, there is better variety out there, sometimes there is less avail then you might want, but thank god that for now if you look hard enough and long enough you can get something that is quality!!! This is not quality, not by a gunsmith’s standards!!! NO!!!!
I had one of these and it ran ok as well, the action was extremely sluggish, magwell was ugly cut like the rest of the reviews, and it did only take metal mags or surplus ones, also no 2nd sling attachment neither?! Century is not known for making a very high end product, so this aint no Cadillac Gunsamerica!!! Not by Far!!! Its heavy, more than average AK’s, due to the heavier barrell and reciever at 1.5mm? I sold it, I didnt have problems feeding I just didnt feel like it was high end, and it cost me $250 less than high end Ak, for Ex: Arsenal Saiga AK, those are the best, Real Russian AK, this one is at about 98% of what a real russian AK used by the Army is, aside frombeing semi auto ofcource. Same reciever, chrome lined barrell, same akm muzzle break, legit AK!!! Pap would be ok if the double stack build was done orig by Zastava, they get it right, Century does not!!! And please, I saw some remarks earlier, I perfectly understand the people that are pissed off!!! So understand them as well, dont leave remarks about yours works good and thats it!!! F that!!! People are MAD their AK has issues so they vent on here and advise others to stay away, I will also advise anyone to stay away, there is better AK’s out there go for the Arsenal’s out there, 5.45 or 7.62×39, eitherway its all good, if not the Saiga then go for the SAM 7- Bulgarian Milled reciever. And all you haters that believe AR’s are more accurate than AK’s, well in general they are slightly I do agree, but I was hitting targets at 250 yars wth Irons and at 400 yars with a POPS scope without issues, Im not a sniper and Im not deployed, if you need anything else beyong that you are fool if a civilian, unless Hunting. Then you need a Hunting rifle!!!
I had one of these and it ran ok as well, the action was extremely sluggish, magwell was ugly cut like the rest of the reviews, and it did only take metal mags or surplus ones, also no 2nd sling attachment neither?! Century is not known for making a very high end product, so this aint no Cadillac Gunsamerica!!! Not by Far!!! Its heavy, more than average AK’s, due to the heavier barrell and reciever at 1.5mm? I sold it, I didnt have problems feeding I just didnt feel like it was high end, and it cost me $250 less than high end Ak, for Ex: Arsenal Saiga AK, those are the best, Real Russian AK, this one is at about 98% of what a real russian AK used by the Army is, aside frombeing semi auto ofcource. Same reciever, chrome lined barrell, same akm muzzle break, legit AK!!! Pap would be ok if the double stack build was done orig by Zastava, they get it right, Century does not!!! And please, I saw some remarks earlier, I perfectly understand the people that are pissed off!!! So understand them as well, dont leave remarks about yours works good and thats it!!! F that!!! People are MAD their AK has issues so they vent on here and advise others to stay away, I will also advise anyone to stay away, there is better AK’s out there go for the Arsenal’s out there, 5.45 or 7.62×39, eitherway its all good, if not the Saiga then go for the SAM 7- Bulgarian Milled reciever. And all you haters that believe AR’s are more accurate than AK’s, well in general they are slightly I do agree, but I was hitting targets at 250 yars wth Irons and at 400 yars with a POPS scope without issues, Im not a sniper and Im not deployed, if you need anything else beyong that you are fool if a civilian, unless Hunting. Then you need a Hunting rifle!!!
Iv’e had my Zastava N pap for 7 months now, Iv’e run approx, 1000 rounds of steel & brass cased FMJ and HP ammo from several different manufacturers with not one malfunction. Iv’e installed a russion red dot and this thing is a blast to shoot, very satisfied. Now I want a O pap. Bearster your opinion of the pap SUCKS!
I bought one bases solely on your review. I hope I did the right thing. Just picked it up yesterday. My dealer ordered it for me and I got it in 4 days. The safety seems stiff, I am hoping it will free up some after using it a few times.
Century arms suck, the pap sucks, their customer svc sucks, don’t buy their shitty products!
For the most part, these run ok, now some are having and had alot of issues with feeding, and Centuries great idea about making a gutted ugly magwell that doesent fit all mags doesent help the sales either, there is an abundace of these rifles everywhere now, just like the crap Wasr’s that Century came up with as well. These rifles are heavier than ususal, and thats fine with me if it was truly a great rifle, and its not. Im sorry there is just too many crapy details to list, they are all listed in the many, many peoples info above, way too many crapy reviews everywhere! When it comes to AK’s, you better do your research if you see a certain model which is avail everywhere and in the thousands! For example: look for Arsenal AK, or to be exact the SGL-21, (7.62×39 models), saiga models. There is very minimum amounts avail on Gun Broker, like last time I looked this week there was 2, Pap’s, I saw 186 rifles avail. Thats just on Gunbroker. Almost all the dealers have the Pap in stock, my local shop doesent buy them used, unless you wanna get like $200-$300 for them (approx) or less, the dealer offers that low because they dont want them, used they are likely an already a bad experience for the current owner. Dealers get new ones for $475-575 from century (approx) maybe a bit less. As it was told to me by a dealer, we dont want these…too many issues and too many people coming back with issues and us having to have to deal with sending them back to CA. Dealer said ” in 30 years in business he had 1-2 Arsenals with canted sights that he sent back, and fixed and sent back to him within 3-5 weeks, so far hes had like 20-30 Paps this year alone, and they come back with half the issues not fixed, so the cust svc sucks” Why would anyone want to deal with these Jokers and ripoff artists? They or CA only care about profit and not the customers or putting out a proper product, these are guns for God’s sake! They have to dependable, these are AK’s!!! they are supposed to be bulletproof! not have issues with feeding, or not fitting the other guys mags! My saiga fits all mags, only one I noticed was a Polish radom mags didnt. The ones that fit are: Tapco, All steel surplus metals: Yugo, Bulgarian, Polish, Russian (all), Hungarian. Also plastic bulgarians fit as well. I Tried fitting a Yugo on a “Yugo or Serb” Pap M70, and guess what? Nope! Good job CA! Great quality control! Great product CA! Stay away from these Jokers!
I bid on a Zastava on Gunbroker back when they first came out and wound up winning the thing for a failry low bid. I have a Polytech AK-47 that I bought back in the 1980s for something like $300. The Polytech is a much better AK in every respect. The Zastava’s stock is angled all wrong for the low-profile rear sight. And although it came with two hi-cap magazines, it will not accommodate standard 30 rd hi-caps. Zastava should have mentioned that inconvenient fact. One big reason for owning an AK is the abundance of cheap magazines. On top of that Century doesn’t sell aftermarket mags that actually fit the damn thing. And it is heavy, even for an AK. The rail is affixed to the flimsy dust cover, which means it is inherently unstable (There is a reason AK’s don’t come with top rails on the receiver.) I understand that Century has now addressed the crappy magazine well with one of proper dimensions in later models. That has only served to drop the valkue of the older models, and for good reason. Century obvioulsy rushed this thing into production without thinking things through. The “Cadillac of AK’s?” Hardly! I plan to unload mine for whatever I can get for it and use the money to buy overpriced ammo for one of my ARs.
I happen to be surfing around for info on the Pap and came accross this article/peoples blog, Im just here to vent in a way, in relation to the AK Platform, just read an article about a secret museum inside CIA, they recently opened a section with Bin Ladens AK that they took off him when Seals killed him and a Al Qaeda Training book next to it. The Yahoo article read it a “Russian AK with Chinese Replica writing on it” or something like that, up close you can clearly see it s a Chinese Polytech style AK with reg Chinese writing on it! Its not a Russian, everyone knows USA supplied AK’s to the Taliban and to Usama and his animals directly, Americans supplied Chinese AK’s, mostly all Chinese AK’s, either Yahoo is stupid enough to publish stuff they dont know anything about, or someone at the CIA lied to them. Such Liars!!! Mostly all the Russian Ak that ended up in Taliban hands after the war with the Russian were ones they took off Russian soldiers themselves or ones that were sold to them by Russian soldiers there, which did happen.
as far as the Zastava Pap M70 AK rifle, this rifle could have been a great rifle if CA didnt mess up the magwell not fitting all mags that its supposed to, cmon!!! How do you do a magwell conversion to a double stack and leave the rifle fitting only metal surplus mags, at least mine did, and another 5 other same ones at my local gun store did as well, none of them fit Tapco mags or the Bulgarian plastica mags either, just metal. And above all, none of them fit the metal, again “meta” YUGO bold hold open mag didnt fit either! Yugo rifle not fitting yugo mag! Thats after CA got their hands on it, if were to be able to get the regular double stack version directly from the Zastava without CA touching it at all, it would be a great rifle, its used worldwide and with great results, they are acuurate and dependable, thicker and work great. Otherwise Ca just gutted it and made it a piece of crap that in most cases has issues feeding. They are too cheap in properly converting it, and switching to a dougle stack bolt, so they install a feedramp to support a single stack bolt, and let the feeding issues begin! I dont care about the reviews online defending this conversion, I have seen with my own eyes the defects and the improper gunsmithing thats done by them, They are mass producing and importing these by the 1000’s and therefore have no interest in quality control its just $, $, $!!! No respect for the customers! Sinse they do not respect their customers and their service is the worst in the industry, which I have experience with as well along with other shooting buddies, I would not advise anyone to go with this rifle, unless you are prepared to have a real proffecional make it look right, otherwise its possible you might get one that works ok, but with all the little kinks and little issues, I’d rather go with a reputable company, EX: Arsenal. These days they are approx $200-$400 apart in price, and if you can get one used for cheaper take it!!! You wont regret it, as long as you inspect it and everything is ok, go fot it! Its a real Russina converted AK, original from the Izhmash factory in RUSSIA, and Arsenal properly converts it to look, feel, shoot, perform overall just like the MILITARY version AK used in Russian Army…Or get the SAM7 Bulgarian, which is also done by arsenal, there are alot of them around, check gunbroker just to get an idea! I would stay away from the ZASTAVA if imported by CA, I personally stay away from anything made or imported by CA, unless Iam 100% sure they didnt touch it in any way or changed anything on the firearm, ever at that they are still know for importing the crappiest guns around or at least much more crappier version thatn other companies, to them its all numbers, to me its quality, im not buying a firearm so that it can later on take a crap on me, I need a firearm to serve me well through the years, stay away from CA they make nothing but junk!!!
I dont care about the AK vs AR Argument, they are both great, depending on what you use them for, also has to do with what AR is compared to what AK, I would compare an Daniel Defence to an Arsenal SGL or a Chinese Polytech. Now this Pap M70 is a piece of dog crap altogether, bolt runs slow, kinda snags a bit and not smooth at all, Its chrome gimme a break CA! No 2nd sling? No scope attachment on the side of mine? Stupid scope mount on top which is useless! What a great idea!!! Canted sights! and ofcource as everyone mentions on here the worst cut on a magwell Ive ever seen on a AK conversion/build! How and why would anyone allow a rifle to go out to a public if it looks to crapy, CA thats who! They were always known for making the worst conversions with their rifles, this AK can and should be as good as a Saiga’s, but these dumbos made it as crapy and as cheap as possible, when I mean cheap, they cut as many corners as possible when converting to a double stack, they left a single stack bolt in there and adjusted a feedrapm to fit it, or slapped a unevenly cut piece of metal that barely fits, un-blued! Century Arms did the worst job possible with this rifle when converting it!!! Horrible gun smith skills! Terrible! It looks great on a shelf far away, when you know your stuff and have seen the clean lines on a perfect looking and finishe d AK you know this is a dog crap job! Stay away from CA products and rifles! Their Customer Service is even worse, I had to deal with them about a WASR AK years ago and its was like dealing with a bunch of 5 year olds working adult jobs, no one understands or knows anything! Absolutely the most terrible experience Ive ever had in the gun Industry, I have dealt with Arsenal, Glock, Ruger, Smith& Wesson to name a few and I know they are manufacturers mostly, but dealing with their cust svc was in general a pleasant experience. CA is horrible stay away!!! Their products are not woth the headache!
** Fow what -ghost216- wrote above, this below was written, take a look this is quote on quote:
“ak will fire after being under water or buried for however long, but it also isnt very likely to actually hit anything reliably at any distance”
* What? Really? Are you of the medication? It will not hit anything reliably at any distance? Really? The Taliban are not killing soldiers , our soldiers in Afghanistan everyday? And what are they using, the AK I believe? They shoot 250-600 yards away on average, at 1st then they get closer…. Sometimes certain engagements are closer 200 yards and below, depends! But, they are hitting, hitting all the time. Are you mental? How do you even make a statement like that? It makes no sense! I saw a video of a Chechen war in Russia on youtube, they attacked a russian Convoy, 60 soldiers, 3 survive! What rifle were they using? AK! Yes they use RPG’s and PKM’s machine guns, but as a battle rifle its always AK! they hit with it as far as a 500 yards all the time! I just saw a guy with a SAM7 7.62×39 AK hit a target 500 yards away with IRON SIGHTS!!!!! 20 shots, 11 hits on a metal plate size target!!! What are you talking about here, really? Also the stupid ass statement about not being able to take it into combat? So all those people using it in combat now, in about 95% of all the worlds conflict now and in the past 65+ years they were just imaginaty AK’s we see? Were they imaginary? What about those people using it in combat everyday? Everyone uses the AK, almost every conflict involves the AK, alot of times it ends up being the bad guys using it, is that why you hate the gun soo, soo much? No reason to do that, respect the weapon and what it is good for, dont hate it because of the countries that use it or who invented it or what country it originated from. The AK has always been extremely dependable and reliable, years after years, war after war! And always will be! I dont care that an AR might go through a car or might not, All I know is that an AK 7.62×39 round will! Thats all I need to know! If you want more accuracy, eventhough I already mentioned the 7.62×39 cal still hits at 500 yards ***AND IT DOES!!!!!*** as a AK used I can use a AK74 or a 5.45 cal, more accurate, just as accurate as the 556 further out! What is the Argument here? AR has never been more dependable than an AK, never! They are not made the way and will never be the same way as far as dependability, it wont happen! AK maybe a stamped metal rifle that is mass produced! OK! Everyone and their mother is making AR’s now, everyone! They are everywhere! They are highly and I mean highly mass produced in USA and other countries as well! An AR can go for a thousand rounds or more or less without having trouble (without cleaning), AK will always surpass! Its true, AR is better as far as accuracy and its lighter for battle purposes, AK will still serve a purpose as the reliable workhorse no matter what! Yah if you fill it with water it will likely fire and might have a problem later, what does that prove really? So will an AR, a little dirt, mud and AR’s jam, again, not always, but overall they do and always will, they run of a different system… Its they way it will always be, until someone comes up with an AK type system inside an AR, and I dont mean the piston AR, but a true system like the AK inside an AR platform, its only a matter of time….
comment reg: ***ghost216*** left above: the quote was: ” AK isnt very likely to actually hit anything reliably at any distance” does this make any, I mean any sense???? Any? really? An AK cannot hit anything at any distance? Ok lets see, just recently watched a youtube video of Chenen war in Russia in early 2000’s, Russian Army Convoy was totally destroyed/ambushed from at first approx 400 yards away, 60 soldiers, 3 survivors!!! (ofcource please consider there are RPG’s and PKM’s and other machine guns, but AK is their main battle rifle,Chechens only use AK’s, almost nothing else! so-Really? My friend served in the Army and was in Iraq, got shot 2 times, both times from an AK, 1st time from at least 130-160 yards, from the 1st burst, while moving from one vehicle to another, he personally heard the burst that hit him! Really? I hit 6-7 inch groups easily and a few times better from a Pops Russian sniper rifle on a Saiga SGL-21-61 model myself! Really? And Even better with a AK-74 -5.45 cal* Ok, now in refference to Original AK’s failing the same* time as the M16 in the Vietnam War or during, AK’s were developed before that and had already went through the stages of failure and were mainly corrected, The AK’s used in Vietnam were mainly* Russian 2nd generation AK’s and Chinese AK’s mainly by the Vietcon, they worked perfectly, as mentioned time after time they didnt have much choices but to bury them and keep them hidden in rice patties/mud etc… and they kept on working, M16 went through an adjustment period and were corrected and did provide much, much better results as time went on and worked ok, or most of the time. I agree with the 556 round being able to go through a car door, it should and most of the time it will. Now, the AK round will always go through the car door and then the entire car all the time, that is the point I would like to make. I have both AR (Rock River) and a AK (Saiga SGL-21), shot them both through a junker at a range and they both were fine, some 556 rouns went through & some didnt. The AK rounds would almost or always go all the way through the car entirely. Im not saying AR will not be effective, if per say someone is driving a vehicle towards a military road block and not stopping, yeah, 2-3 or more soldiers using AR’s are going to ripp that vehicle to shreads, no doubt. But if one person is shooting they might still get through cause some of the rounds might not penetrate all the way through the vehicle, thats all Im saying!!! Now as to the comment about not being able to take AK into combat? Are you off the meds? Have you not seen the AK in almost every combat that there is? ***EVERY!!!*** Almost every conflict from the late 1950’s (approx) all, and I mean all current conflicts going on now all involve AK’s, ALL! How do you back up the statment that you cannot take the AK into battle because it is too heavy, when almost* every battle for the last 60+ years involved an AK? Does that make sense? Africa, Angola, Mexico, Columbia, Chechnia, Bosnia, Afghanistan, All of the Middle Eastern conflicts* ALL!!, all had used an AK, and all use them now, Syrian war now, they all have AK’s, all carry them, all of them! So I guess they are and were all imaginary AK’s then? AR is an awesome rifle, shoots really far, light, almost no recoil, great on target, shoots as smooth as butter, I agree, but its not as dependable in the long run as the AK, AK requires less maintenance in the long run and as a civilian Im fine having a rifle that can def go through, walls, brick, standard civilian cars, medium size trees all while being ACCURATE with a 200 yard range, and better with a diesent scope, I have a Rakurs scope on mine, equivivilant of a ACOG (approx equivilant), its a beast, no batteries, hits good groupings at 200-250 yards! Its in service for the Russian Special Forces serving in Chechnia and other Mountain former Russian Caucus region(s), they deal with shooting at each other from sometimes rediculous distances (hense MOUNTAIN REGIONS!), and they do so very effectively with a standard Saiga military version AK and will continue to do so…. One rifle is not better than the other is my conclusion, Our military has great success even with the mediocre M4 military Colt, My friend served in Iraq/Afghanistan in the US army doesrnt have enough toes and fingers on him to count how many hits he had with his M4, he loves it, but as a true military marksman he respects the AK as well for being dependable workhorse and it never stops ticking, doesent need a cleaning for months! And has a power to bust a shoulder after it goes through his vest into 7 pieces as it happened to him. So all these rifles have their purpose and are all great and are all different, and I cannot really state one is better than the other. If I need to patrol an area and watch for enemy further away, yeah give me an good AR with an ACOG, The AR with an ACOG is perfect for that, see enemy 400 yards away moving towards you, aim through the ACOG, breathe, scueeze, the end. If I need to set and Ambush, lets say from an elevated area within 200-300 yards or less, give me an AK, its gonna go through the vehicles below me, if it hits someone in the leg, that leg is likely going to hold together via skin only. Also in an Urban setting, mostly all shootouts are going to be within 200 MAX, in a inner city Urban setting, AK is perfect, The Ar will be as well, but I mentioned for me personally the long term maintenance part + the better penetration power I believe is a better choice to go with an AK, this is just me personally.etc, etc…They are both great weapons and both serve a good purpose and both have specific use. I really knock either I can just point out the best qualities of both.
I agree with what ghost216 is saying regarding the ak vs ar and beating a dead horse, some true some not. Im reading a book right now by a US war vet got back from Afghanistan, and came back with a medal of honor, which was not given to any US military personel for approx 5-6 year prior to him getting it. He personally had a few parts in the book where he was doing nothing but bitchin about the stopping power of a 556 round, he said that 308 which is a glorified 7.62×36 (approx) has much better stopping power, he never really said anything about the M4 jamming or anything like that just the stopping power was the issue. He said some of the guys they and he shot just kept moving or crawling and somekept shooting seconds after being shot. When far away M4 is effective as far as reaching the target, true, much better than a AK, but keep in mind, the Taliban is also shooting AK’s at the US forces and are hitting targets at 500 yards away. Yes its harder and yes they have to adjust 20 times before they start hitting something, yes they are sometimes shooting PKM’s and sniper rifles also that have better range, OK! But they are still hitting with AK’s. Yes I agree Colt M4 is not that special, there are better AR’s out there and are more dependable than army issue, true. But AK is still a work horse and requires less maintenance and as stated on here before perfect for any Urban type combat, if you think its too bulky for straight up home defence then go with the shorter Krink option, for very close situations, a 30 round 7.62×39 rifle like that is awesome! I think! If not go with any diesent 45 cal handgun, holding 10-15 rounds, hollows and youre set! As also mentioned during any civil unrest AK I believe is perfect, dont get me wrong so is AR, why not! But god forbid AK has a hick-up of somelittle flimsy part ex: striker* or anything of than nature goes out on you your rifle is fucked! AK has less parts less shit to break. AR in water and completely filled with water will likely fail as well. We can beat a dead horse all day about the AR vs AK argument, to each his own, I have both, both serve me well, bot are great shooting guns. Me personally, I would stick with the AK, plus the AK74 the 5.45 round is also quite more accurate than the reg 7.62×39 and reaches out much further as well, aside from costing less as well. Anyway enough about the AR vs AK, this article was to review the PAP M70, not AR’s, LOL!
***The PAP M70:
I never purchased one to say I had a nightmare with mine, my friend did, Nightmare!!!! Looks like a shit built, he had a original Pap, pre ban one, the ones that cost like $2500-$3000 range now! Those are beauties! This looks good on the outside but that feedramp built in by CA and the magwell, his didnt come with the side rail to begin with! canted sights! no sling attachment on the buttstock! WOW! WOW! What a great Product! After getting work done to it by a Smith it finally feeds great, installed a sling attachment, fixed the sights, etc…The way it was supposed to be from the Factory! Now its nice, but Centurie’s product control is just plain old stupid!!! They dont care about anyone, and based on reviews online he didnt even want to deal with them, and fixed it on his own. I would never, ever recommend getting anything that they have touched! Anything! Unless its a firearm that they simply import and do not touch in any mechanical way! I would advise to always stay away from thei firearms!
I will more than agree with everyone else on century. They have never been known to actually deliver reliably a quality product. Canted sights, bad mag-wells, etc… Ive had a wasr that was junk, a sar 1 that was “o.k.” and will never chance it again. Pay more and get something that will actually work, saiga, arsenal, or anything that isnt a maadi or stamped CAI.
Scope on the receiver…well… that in itself says something about the shooter. It will not hold zero, and everyone who actually has just a little basic common sense realizes that the cheap thin sheet metal will move around and allow scope movement, and if your not careful, your scope mount screws/bolts if threaded to far will actually hit the bolt. THERE IS A REASON THE SCOPE MOUNT WAS ON THE SIDE!!! Forward mount it and you will get better results, while also obtaining the taticool appearance!
As for everyone involved in the ak-ar debate, thats beating a dead horse. Its like which is better, 1911 or a glock… Sure, an ak will fire after being under water or buried for however long, but it also isnt very likely to actually hit anything reliably at any distance. I keep seeing reference to the current military m4’s. Well, those m4’s came from the lowest bidder, and for the most part are about the same as a lower shelf civilian ar with a different trigger group. You think that the ak is so much more reliable? Keep believing that! We fire 5,6,7 mags at them while they shoot 15 rounds back and that makes their rifle more reliable? Our weapons fire quite a bit more than theirs. They probably shoot their weapons less the entire time they have them than you will in a year of weekend shooting. Basing your assumptions off of Vietnam and the gen 1 m16, or the crappy colt m4 made and sold to the government for 600$ is just ignorant. Original ak’s also failed same as the original m16. In the past 10 years, the materials, reliability has all much improved.Yes, an ar will fail given certain circumstances, but go try this, dip your ak in water, let it too fill up, and then fire it with water still in it and see what happens! It may work til it explodes! The ak is cheap presses stamped metal with a flexible barrel and a very thin receiver cover. Just like a high point pistol, it is cheap and will work most of the time, and that’s about it…
Now the car door comment…That is just total bs. a 55gr round has as much energy as a 123 gr 7.62×39, and if you increase the 5.56 weight, it surpasses the 762, and also travels appx 800-1000 fps faster. at 300 yards, a 55gr will punch through both sides of a car door, just like the ak if you can actually hit it with the ak at that distance which i highly doubt. Most have a “generous” moa of 5 inches at 100, so at 300-do the math!. The 62gr steel core xm855 does even better job at penetrating. And by the way, to be fair, you are probably using “good” 5.56 copper jacketed hollow points in the ar, while using steel core import ak ammo arent you! if your gonna tell a story, tell all of it and remember certain details!
Lastly the shotgun comment from someone. That is truly just an ignorant statement. Shoot buck shot or slugs in your house and see where it ends up. Maybe learn a little ballistics and bullet design. The 5.56 is by far a better choice to stop someone than a 12 ga slug, which will go in, out and continue for quite some distance. 5.56 will tumble and fragment, slug deforms and continues going.
To all of you who want to hold your ak as if it is the greatest thing since sliced bread, the have at it. Just bc all the 3rd world countries use them, and China or Russia, doesnt make them the better choice. Which countries are well renowned for firearm engineering? Germany, Switzerland, etc… now what do they make and use? Guess the smart weapon manufacturers are just wrong since they made no effort to produce an ak platform, even in 5.56, bc arm chair warriors know better. And by the way, you are not going to take either into combat so get over it! And if you do, you will probably be bitching about the weight or lack of ammo that you cant carry bc it weighs so much, not to mention decrease in maneuverability! But hey, its reliable… and good unless your being engaged from further than a football field away.
I wish people would stop beating up Century Arms, give them a break! All they are tryin to do is make money! Whats wrong with that? Sinse when does customer satisfaction and service ever have anything to do with making money in America? LOL!!! I thought I was the only guy in the world that had thought Century was a terrible company and made terrible guns, I guess I am not alone afterall!
I have dealt with Century Arms before and my dealings with them were no fun, I have also seen these at my local shop and as mentioned before on here on the outside it looks great and after doing research about Zastava itself the company (Zastava) is very good and reputable. Now as far as Century Arms getting these rifles in and making them US compliant on their end is a NO, NO as far as I can see, once I inspected one of These Pap’s recently, a all Polymer version with a side rail for optics, i believe its a N-Pap model, I can immedtly see the imperfection the straightnes of the lines or the way the magwell is cut, I was immedtly advised it fits metal mags only, I tried a Tapco mag with it at the store and it does not fit, metal Polish Mag did. That is I believe just plain old rediculous!! They have this piece of metal that they install which acts as a feed Ramp of a sort, and thats a piece added when making the Pap a double stack rifle to accept double stack mags, it looks unfinished, not blued to match the rest of the black blued metal on the inside of the reciever, the action is very sliggish and not as smooth as it should be, the buttstock is basically cannot be modified, it has a long stupid screw through the whole stock to screw into a piece of wood, that is a Zastava’s weird creation I believe, and it makes no sense to me. The buttstock is extremely Long, no cleaning kit hole, also no chrome lined barrell, and above all no 2nd sling attachment!! Makes no sense!!! Of cource youre gonna say, well if you dont like it dont buy it, I like it and mine is great, Ok I agree! I will not buy it because its not smooth, the 2 that were at the store had screwed up sights a s well straight from the factory, if a company can let a rifle leave their factory with such important details left unfinished right from the start it means to me that they just do not care about quality!!! Thats all!!! This is no Cadillac to me! Every detail on a Cadillac is beautiful and works great inside and out, and I think when someone named this rifle a “Cadillac” of AK’s the likely meant the older, heavy, smooth, comfortable, no proble having America work horses!!! Right? Thats what a Caddy means to me! My Grandfather still has a Caddy in his garage purchased originally by him in 1987, with 140,000 miles on it and thats a Caddy!!! This rifle is no Caddy to me, or at least one without proper breaks, engine and transmission, LOL! I would personally and I have stayed away and as someone mentioned earlier even when they were at $600 and now at $875 New, I will continue to stay away. I will and have stuck with a Arsenal SGL-21 series for years and have 2 of them, they are a true work horse and are as smooth as butter and were from the start, smooth action, no canted sights all in all oposite of the Pap new from the factory! If this rifle was direct from Zastava already double stack by them and Century would not touch them at all on the inside or any internall parts I would buy it in a sec, otherwise its a rifle thats trully ruined by Century, plus from what I have expirienced personally with them about another firearm limping out on me before I wouldnt want to deal with the idiots that work there again. Overall this is no Cadillac of AK’s by anyone’s means, I would stay away from Century modified guns, I would avoid and will avoid this gun and Century as a whole, always!!! My opinion!!!
I got a Saiga AK, SGL I believe is the model, thats all I need, all I will even need for a rifle for Urban Purposes, my saiga has never had any issues, all I see and hear is many many problems people are having with these, if so many issues I will not buy. I bought my Saiga for $725 little more than 2+ years ago, USED*. Very Slightly used. Never, ever any issues, shoots like a gem, no feeding issues or problems, eats any and and all ammo! My personal Opinion is to learn on other peoples mistakes, use Reviews and etc… I have seen like 10 diff blogs where person after person is complaining about these having issues, so therefore I will never buy or take a chance. I would rather spend a $250-350 more on something more dependable. Gunbroker has 3 dif Arsenal Saigas from $1100-$1200 right now! These are selling from $899-$1300, not sure how some jackasses are selling these for $1300+ but they are, My choice would be very, very clear! I will continue to stay away from Century Arms products! Buy shit buy twice!
stay away from century arms! horrible company to deal with!
Century Arms sucks! this rifle overall simply sucks! Saw these and they are rediculous when it comes to: Century’s gun smithing skills! I would stay away, and I did after seeing one and holding one, on a gun rack it looks nice, diesent wood, feels heavy, like a good weapon should, but whn you start inspecting the magwell, feedramp, cuts, lines, etc a little more in detail, you can see how much Century flopped here! Century Sucks! I cant believe in these tough times and especially with this bastard government that we have in charge thats about to possibly ban these types of weapons this company allows itself to literally bend the US gun owners over by making a rifle that is prone to fail, and fails for soo, soo, soo many that buy it!!! Century Sucks!!! Stay away people!!!
YUP, like the guy said it above, Dealing with Century Arms is like cards read by a different Gypsy everyday, its all a scam and you will get a different answer to the same question by every rep there (when calling in), I had an issue with mine, gave it back to my Local place I got it from, they sent it back it was covered by their wonderful warranty, after 2 months of them not replying to me I decided to call in, A lady in their Vermont office said it was being looked at by a gunsmith and to call within a 3-5 days max, I called in 10 bus days and someone answered and within about 5-8 sec after my question they said: ” It looks like it will be looked by a gun-smith within a week or so maybe a few days more???” I asked how did you know that within 5 sec after I gave you my name? he quickly said he can look into it a bit further and put me on hold immediatly without even letting me reply! After answering and them again almost immedtly tranf to the Vermont office again and after 24 min on hold another lady answered, same question, she said ” it looks like a gunsmith dpt is taking care of it now, should be done in a few days or so? Kepp in mind last time the same offices rep/lady said will be done within 3-5 days within max! I asked why the same answers or different answers and no consistent answers? why? Not much of a responce, just we will get to it when we can type a thing! Ok. I hang up, TY, waited another 10 bus days, this time I have the store call in and I was given a RAN # or something to pull it up by, store called the Vermont office directly, they said will be shipped with a week should be out of the gunsmiths hands this week, call being made on a monday! LOL! WTF! Century are a bunch of dickheads, a bunch of scumbags! Not to mention they allowed a rifle to leave the factory having issues to feed, all caused by a fucked up feedramp they installed to accompany a single stack bolt left in after their fucked up looking conversion to a double stack AK! Dickheads! How much of an asshole company do you have to be to let such a fucked up rifle leave your production floor!!!??? Fucking assholes!!! You made a conversion to a double stack rifle and forgot to make it fit all magazines, just make it fit metal ones? WTF??? Are you fully retarded? Or just semi??? So you are making the public outhere buy only metal surplus mags only? No other AK importer has these issues! NONE!!!! Mitchel Arms Pap M70 back in the day were Gems from what I have seen, and as far as Arsenal AK’s being the best, and these days they are the Best AK, Mitchells Pap’s will give a Arsenal run for its money any day of the week. This is because it was Imported and properly coverted by a reputable non-money grubbing jackasses like Century!!! Overall this rifle is great until touched by Century when it comes here, you take Zastava reg double stack AK straight from their factory and they are beauties! Made to last forever, these are and were being used in Africa, Midlle East, Eastern Europe for many years, always great and reliable! During the recent war in the Balkans this was the main rifle because its made there, never ever heard any issues with these! Century fucks up rifles and thats all they do!!! Do not ever go with anything made by this looser company and its dickhead employees!!! If its in any way touched by this company please stay away, if its just simply imported and just stamped with their logo, maybe…Otherwise stay away from this asshole company!!! Century arms trully sucks ass!!!
Saw the info up top or review, just had a buddy that ended up trading a Zastava back to his gun store where he got it at originally, store got a Saiga in and he was on a waiting list, he lost alot on it but wanted to get rid of ti to get a good AK, I agree from what I got from him Century was hard to deal with cause he said they hide what they actually do to your rifle, you dont know untill you get it back, and they didnt really fix anything just polished off some part for smoother feeding, after seeing the difference in quality he got rif of it. I had the same issues with my Wasr as well and I have a AK-74 Saiga as well, and no issues for years now, since 2009. No jamms, not even one, Im at the range almost every week, hundreds of rounds through this rifle and compared to my AR (Rock River) it never jammed. AR had a jamm after 600 rounds of no cleaning. The Ak had no jamms or issues until 2,000 rounds, then I just cleaned it to clean it, no sense in ruining a Rifle that is clearly superior! Russians made a AK so they are originally the best, stay away from fluff like Century Arms touched guns, any of them, they all have tooooo maaaany issues. Their so called repair department is the busiest in the business, that is for a reason, I know they import/export the most as well but still if you have a quality product leaving your factory that has no issues there is no reason why every other rifle has to come back to them! They are BS of gun Industry!
Dont but this Junkie ass rifle, Century Arms went ahead and ruined a perfecly made rifle, It moght not be the best specimen ok AK out there, but a heave very dependable version, BUT, only if its not touched by anyone like Century Arms!!! If you give me a untouched Zastava directly from the factory made by the Zastava factory into a double stack version, YEs I will take it, those were properly imported by Mitchell Arms back in the day, some still float around, people that know do not get rif of them and they are truly awesome! These are just shitted on Century and not converted! Yes, the proper wording is shitted on! Horrible hack job with the magwell, feedramp add on, line cutting and just poor, poor craftmanship and gun smithing skills, All I needed to see was the magwell and other shit parts installed and I was enough for me to put it down, even when these were only $650 at my local store brand new! Nope! No thank you, I dont need feed issues in the future, pluse dealing with Century as I have before with their shit WASR, which I bought before for $300, just cause it was cheap! Shit weapons from a Shit company! Customer service sucks, and so does quality control! If its truly a weapon that do not modify at all then I would trust to buy it, if they did anything mechanically to the weapon I would not trust them, NEVER!!! I have a Saiga SGL-21 7.62×39, originally purchased for $825 in beg of 2012, new. This is truly a real AK, Russian, Russian made, and properly made into 922r compliant by Arsenal, LV, NV. Everything cut perfectly, installed properly, looks and feels like a true AK, very accurate and no issues after close to 4+ k rounds, no issues or imperfections! This is with shit corrosive ammo, reg surplus ammo and hollows, soft/hard tips all lacquer coated rounds. Nothing all good,no hickups or jamms! ofcource it was cleaned, but only after shooting the corrosive ammo (after 3 times of shooting with corrosive), i would avoid cleaning at times to see the true dependability, and no issues! Perfect, not I almost feel bad for not cleaning it so much, she’s spottless now!!! LOL! No other rifle can really hold up to the abuse, No AR’s definetely! maybe Garant, M14, or SKS. YES that I can believe, and possibly a new Scar. No AR, not after the abuse these take in real battle situations, like the guys mentioned on here before, wuth the mud and dirt and AK being burried they still keep on going! You cannot do that with a AR platform, not with continuous abuse by the elements and physical damage, they are just too Lanky for that. Yes in a Urban Environment AK is all thats needed. Look at Gunbroker today, there is like 2 maybe 3 Saiga SGL 7.62×39 avail for sale. But there is like a 100 of Zastavas, and hundreds of Wasrs and other shitty AK’s or lower end ones, this is for a reason, people that know do not want to get rid of them, never. I know someone with a rediculous collection of guns, close to 120 guns. And he has DD Ar, Scar, and a M&P single piston AR in the collection, and if the world was to end the rifle he would pick is: AK saiga, then maybe Scar, maybe…Ak is simple and dependable, a work horse that will keep on working for years to come even with no cleaning or little maintenance. Do yourself a Favor and avoid Zastava’s or a Wasr, go for a Russina any series or a Bulgarian SAM-7 (milled), or Mc-90 or any chinese AK, Polish is ok too for the beginers, stay away from this trash!
I have this rifle, Mine works good, feeds good with regular good to junk ammo, just dont feed it hollows, reg Wolf, Tula, WPA, etc…works just fine. My buddy had one and got rif of it due to feeding issues, he also based on the reviews and speaking to Century didnt want to bother sending it back and just traded back in towards a AR15. Now as far as the outside finish, everything looks great, wood is diesent quality (for now), the paint finish is somewhat greyish? And it is very, very easy to scratch off. The sites were not straigh and were canted right from the start. The store had 3 of these and all were crooked, LOL! Not sure how Century allows this before sending it to a gun store, but whatever. Overall its a heavy rifle, dependable as the reciever is thicker and will likley last you longer. I cant put too many stocks or different ones on due to the fact there is a pesky long bolt set up and no one makes M4 style stocks that look diesent enough to go on there, (the Century one on their site is ugly, no thanks!), Ace makes stuff to attach to, but I saw someone with the stock from them and its not 100% solid to me, 2 screws that attach to 2 more screws, etc.. etc… Im not going into combat, but who knows who, when and where and in the end you want it all to be attached as a factory stock would to be 100% solid. As far as the magwell, i do have to agree that even my Wasr looks better, and the inside is a bit un-natural as far as finish and all the correct grindings that have to be done make a true looking AK Magwell, mine doesent simply fit any Mags other than metal ones, no plastic fits. That my friends sucks!!! I like having the $10 Tapco mags to go to the range with, carry on the chest rig etc to save good mags for rainy day and to help with the weight as well, so that does suck alot!!! Century could have also done a better job as far as adding a piece of metal on the inside to help with them keeping the single bolt in there (which no one does if it has a double stack conversion, but this is Century Arms guys!!! LOL), its done a bit ackwardly, uneven, not blued at all? Looks kinda cheap made. This rifle could have easaly been a piece and compared to the ones imported by Mitchel Arms back in the day this is not profecionally done or at least not by a good gunsmith. Mine shoots, but who knows? I collect AK’s, I have Chinese, russian, Romanian, Hungarian, Polish, etc…If I had to choose one for combat purposes I would go with the Russian (Arsenal SGL 21-61 I have) or the Chinese without thinking twice about it. Only would use this if it was absolutely the last AK I have left. Sorry Century, the only part that mainly works for me on this Zastava Pap M70 is the fact that it shoots, for now…Everything else is kinda below ordinary/average. Its definetely no Cadillac, cause I own a Cadillac, actually 2 of them, and on the inside they are straight, lines are cut and executed correctly and very, very rarely do the have issues. this rifle does have issues for alot of people, just read the reviews on here and all over the internet, Cadillac doesent have that many issues, Not sure why this comparison was made, maybe cause its heavy and just a bit smoother shooter due to the fact its heavier? Probably? I simply bought it to have the Serb AK variant in my collection and wouldnt put my life on it, NO WAY!
Now, I read some of the reviews on here from some time ago about people arguing about AK vs AR, now, here it is, People that have no issues with AR’s are people that just have not YET had an issue with an AR, thats all that they are! Its possible that even a mid level AR M&P, DPMS, Rock River, etc…(some might consider higher as well, to each is own), could go for 1-2k rounds + with no issues, but eventually it will get dirty, dirty enough to fail, ALWAYS! its just built that way, some guns need more cleaning/lube to keep going! It is what it is! also the striker always goes in AR’s as well after lots of back to back rapid fire etc…they are a more stiffer platform, more prone to cracking and while shooting delivering extreme shock to its internal parts, its just the way its built. I love my Rock River, I love my Daniel Defence, heck the DD cost me $1500, this is when a average AR cost like $750-1100, tops!, approx? average? I know its will go through all kinds of abuse, I’ve seen the videos and etc….But eventually, and without cleaning maintenance and blah, blah, blah. It will fail me, i cannot allow that if its a death/life situation. Ak’s are far more reliable, far more. Rain, sleet, snow, mud, shit, abuse, dropping it, hitting it, no claning for 4, 5, 6 thousand rounds, etc…etc…THEY WORK!, Yup like someone said, they get burried and pulled out and work. My frien said in Vietnam they would bury them in the ground, in rice fields, which are mud and water and filled with lots of wonderful critters, and guess what they would work. So did the M16’s, most of the time…I know M4 is diff and better, yes, yes, I agree. But nothing will beat the dependability of an AK47/74. Nothing! Yes like someone mentioned above in 1 review, you do see videos all the time now of straight up helmet cams from Afghanistan right from our service men, You see them jamming, you hear ” Im jammed”, or the famous “got one in the tube, cover me!”, taliban doesent have this problem, with 20+++ year old AK’s, it does not have this problem. Some of those towel heads are using Ak’s from the war back with the Russians Im sure, actually I wouldnt even doubt it! Taliban ended up with thousands of Chinese AK’s, Im sure they didnt trade them in for scraps! LOL. No AR would be able to go through that, for so many years, never! Granted AR is a much lighter and more accurate platform, easier to trick out, etc… But not more dependable, never. And as far as penetrating power obviously 7.62×39 is better than 223/556, ofcource! it! is! better! goes through bricks, cars, trees, walls, etc.. Al, I need to know! Can 223 go through a wall, sure and a car, and also it might not? It really might now! I know the AK round will. AK is a better urban assault rifle overall due to its reliability/dependability and stopping power, and yes you AR guys Ak is deadly in the hands of a diesent shooter up to and far beyong 200-250 yards, of cource with a diesent scope even further, what else do you need in an urban environment? Nothing! House to house clearing, block to block engagements, hiding behind cars, walls, trees, no one is really safe from an AK, up to 300+ yards. CMON! Thats all I need!
Century Arms is the worst Importer of firearms as far as quality and Customer Service In America, the worst! Please stay away from their products if they are in any way touched by them! Stay away from Century Arms!
My Pap M70, it took me 2 months to realize the issues and the overall quality to trade back in to wards a Arsenal, real, quality made AKM, true AKM, and closest to the real Russian Military version, which is a true top standard of what an AKM should be.
Pap M70:
Cons:
1) Canted sights right from the Factory or Century (whichever)
2) incorrect threading on the muzzle break, muzzle extremely loose from the factory
3) no side rail for optics
4) dust cover rail, 100% worthless, wobbly, would not hold zero, ever!
5) Butt stock, single lonng bolt style, cannot install anything aftermarket, also very long, this rifle is made for long arms in particular, not me.
6) terrible, terrible magwell, uneven inside and also out.
7) does not fit any Polymer mags, for me , NONE! just metal suplus!
8) nasty looking feedramp inside, as someone mentioned slapped out of a sigle piece of metal to accomodate a single stack bolt, which should be removed in the 1st place if doing an official double stack bolt conversion.
9) No chrome lined barrell
10) Heavier than other AK’s.
11)feeding issues right from the start, rounds get jammed up on the improper feed ramp, again, and again!!
12) Terrible company, Century has the worst customer svc in the business, the worst!!! after speaking to them briefly and the reviews online I decided to trade the rifle back in, the store who also gunsmiths slightly modified it to make it feed properly and has sinse re-sold it, Why not send it to Century to make it right you say? When I spoke to them they said to just send it in, i asked if I can speak to gunsmith while they are “fixing the rifle”, they said no I cannot. I asked how will I know what is fixed and if there is anything else they can do about other minor issue above? They said write it on a piece of paper and they will see if they can do it, the only way to find out if they did is when I recieve the rifle, as per them this will take approx 2-3 months possibly? maybe slightly less. Ok, so, why would I send something to them not knowing what they are actually going to do to it? WTF??? this makes no sense to me! I desided that if they are so busy fixing broken rifles, and this is what someone there at Century told me, is that they are way behind in repairs for stuff people send back, why would I want to keep something that will likely have issue again? Why not go with a product that is more solid and made better, inside and outside.
Do yourself a favor and look for a Arsenal SGL-21 type rifle when getting an AK, they are truly a gold standard for the AK or AKM Platform! And as long as they continue to make their products with the quality that they do, they always will be the best! Gunsamerica, please! get your shit straight and stop giving commercials to this terrible company or Century Arms! i will personally stop using you because you are making shit into flowers! Or simply put fluffing this rifle to be great! please stop! Please do not buy this rifle if you looking to avoid issues in the future!
Has anyone that has defended this rifle seen the inside of the it? Or the feedramp and how it is installed, its litterally a piece of polished un-finished metal, looks like a chunk of metal thats totally un-finished at all, they simply just made it fit, cut out the feed ramp to work with a single stack bolt, so they dont have to replace the bolt, ofcource…Then the magwell on the outside and inside is totally uneven and just plain rediculous looking, anyone without and gun skills can file it better than they did. Century Sucks!!!
Century Arms are Bastards!!
Century Arms sucks! Their rifles are terrible, even if its not made from glued together used up written off Euro Surplus kits, then its a new rifle like the PAP M70 which they totally ruin by getting their monkey hands on it!!! What would be the point of buying a rifle that you know might have problems? i know when I but certain lower end brands of handguns I know its not going to be as dependable as a Glock or Sig, or a properly cleaned and made Beretta or 1911, etc,,,etc…Why bother? Some people get these and Wasr’s and have no problems, and thats fine, And alot of people have problems with these and wasr’s as well, look at the Wasr, Century has been importing these kit rifles for many years and still after sooo, sooo many issues they didnt change a thing!!! So it will be the same for these as well, no matter how many people complain, send them in to be fixed they will do what they have to in order to make more money and fuck their customers!!
Century really messed these rifles up Bad! really Bad!!! They cannot gunsmith if their life depended on it, terrible, terrible cut lines on the magwell I agree with everyone on here that stated the same, and yes compared to a Arsenal which at this time goes from around $1000-$1400 on Gunbroker to the Pap’s that go for $850-$1,100 (why in the world would anyone pay that much for Pap I dont know??), I do not see a reason why someone would just not pay the xtra $150-$250 to have a real ak and just buy Arsenal. if you buy Century rifle then I wish you lots of luck, Century is a scumbag company and I dont advise anyone to do business with them, fuck Century!!!
Saw the info above from someone that served in a Serbian Army, I agree your rifle was awesome!! You had an aoriginal Pap M70 or a Serbian AKM, these are practically the same, BUT, Century get them here and cuts out the magwell and makes the compliant to use in USA, they become different in that factor, the magwell is cut out completely uneven, the inside of the magwell has to be re-done almost completely, feed ramp, etc, it looks like the simply add a piece of metal on there and grid out the feed ramp, they dont blue it or anything!!! they keep a single stack bolt in there (the pap that comes in here is a single stack one before the Century conversion thats the difference, ones that fit 10 round mags), If you look at the Pap’s sold for CA or the ones that have those ugly thumbhole stocks they have a single stack magwell for 10 round mags, if you look at those you can see how cleanly cut they are due to being direct from the factory, the Pap M70 is not, its a nightmare, people have issues with these constantly, My local store advised me that they really inspect these when they come in and test them very close to make sure they are up to par! Same with the M85 or M92 now those are not touched by Century as far as the magwell goes either due to the fact they come in a Pistol Ak’s and are alredy double stack (at least in my state they are), If you were getting one get one of those if you want you can always attach a buttstock and pay the xtra $200 tax fee, if you want. Otherwise with the Pap you are not getting a true Zastava Pap as its meant to be from Serbia! I had one of these and I couldnt stand the magwell, plus when I had a gunsmith look at it he said that its a terrible what they did to these, he happened to have one thats pre-ban they were imported by another company, looks awesome, and thats likeley what was used by the Serb Army not these ruined by Century AK’s! I would stay away from them in particular, as others mentioned get an Arsenal, they are and were always about $200-450 approx apart! its worth it! I know I am not rich enough to buy shit again, so I would rather save up for something more dependable and something made with pure quality in mind! As far as customer Service, they are a joke! Scum that just simply does not care about their customers!!! I tried dealing with them and its a nightmare!!! When I purchased a Arsenal I called them just to chk the serial # and general questions, the same girl always answerd politely in their Vegas NV loc, very helpful, nice and jumps out of her seat to help you! I appreciate that and not those unreliable jackasses at Century Arms! anywhere I go and anyone I talk to I will always continue to shit on Century due to the fact that I had problems and they simply told me to go F myself, therefore I advise you please do not buy their products unless you want issues in the future!!! Stay away!
Just saw this thread when I put in review for Pap online, I agree with alot of the reviews here, its a terrible rifle when it comes to feeding and magwell issues, if you want a truly top notch quality AK that is as close to the original AK it was designed to be then get an Arsenal, whether 7.62×39 or the 5.45 you cannot go wrong with those! Believe me!!!
Century Arms has the worst customer service ever!!! horrible looking cut out magwells on these PAP rifles not being able to accept all diff types of mags and just metal ones! Unable to really customize these rifles due to the retarded long single bolt in the buttstock! Compared to other AK’s the bolt action is not very smooth at all and mine had feeding issues untill I got rid of it and got a REAL AK which is a Arsenal AK! too bad Century totally ruined a good rifle, at least they are good until Century Arms cuts out the magwell and completes the 922r compliance…Century Arms sucks!!! Stay away from them and their products if you do not want to deal with Bull Shit!!! Hope this helps….
Just traded my Pap M70 wood stock around 5 days ago for a Saiga SGL-21 (slightly used one), My Pap fed ok, no major issues. But there are reasong I got rid of it, No polymer style mags fit they are all too thick to fit the magwell, the magwell looks like shit, cut extremely uneven, inside and out, its not done correctly, and when at the store orifinally i checked out 3 diff ones they had none of them looked similar (magwells*). This always got on my nerves!!! I want to be able to buy other polymer mags!! Ex: Us Palm, Pro Mag, Tapco, Bulgarian, etc…They are lighter to carry overall on a chest rig or a carry pouch, half the weight! Besides the fact that this AK is alot heavier already!! Thats the only good part knowing that its a thicker RPK 1.6mm reciever that makes this rifle a good one or the only good thing I believe. I sent mine to Century just asking why is the magwell done so uneven and can they get it up to par to fit my Tapco mag ( I sent one with it), I asked as others have mentioned to just fix my uneven sights, sinse they are the gunsmiths and they might as well sisnse they will have the rifle in their hands anyway. Also i asked why did they have a single stack bolt with a double stack magwell, the bolt is a bit smaller than it should be? The response I got was we test fired the rifle with a metal mag and it feeds good, Thats it!!! Nothing else!!! The gas tube lock was not locked all the way in when inspecting the rifle, thats all I got! I dont want to hear anything about this company because I experianced 1st hand how rediculous they really are! Oh and I almost forgot! All this complicated work took them 6 weeks! And thats with me calling like 6 times and bugging them to move it along! While speaking to their gunsmith desk via email no one would tell me what they actually did or will do with the rifle and that I would find out via the note enclosed when I got it back? WTF!? Really??? Now thats what I call Customer Service!!! #1 !!! well done Century Arms!!! Besides the fact that every time you do call almost everyone gives you a different answer, one person says we just got it and another idiot says we have it for 2 weeks now and will be mailed tomm?? WTF!!! Dont get played by this companies BS! the rifle looks good on the rack, feels heavy and solid when you are checking it out, BUT! when you research people like me having one and others dealing with many, many feeding/magwell issues why deal with the all this BS! I can understand if they took time to fix their issues, they dont do anything!!! Oh also another issue, the muzzle break, the threads that were cut were not cut all the way down to the bottom of the barrell tip that you screw the muzzle break on to, last 3 lines almost have no thread cut into them! WTF! Thats why my muzzle was sooo looose from the start! This is BS!!! Iam extremely happy with the Saiga Arsenal AK, it feeds perfectly! double stack bolt, the magwell cut out evenly on all sides, the correct dimple in the magwell as all AK’s were meant to have, properly cut and filed on the inside to fit all mags! And guess what Arsenal rifle came with a 2nd sling attachment on the buttstock, makse sense right? Pap just had a front sling attachment! did Century expect me to carry my Pap barrell up with a sigle point sling attached to the front all while on my hip??? LOL! Pap had a rail on the dust cover that was wobbly! Why Century? why? How did this make any sense to you? No one at Century thought about the rediculous single bolt buttstock thats on This rifle and make impossible to have other stocks installed! i dont care about the Ace stock even though they are good high quality product they dont sit 100% as they should! Compared to a Vltr tube that simply fits right in as the factory one does on a Arsenal, or even a Wasr or Chinese or a Bulgarian stamped reciever AK!!! WTF!!!
This rifle is good before Century gets it and makes it a double stack by cutting the magwell out, I have a friend with a pre-ban Zastava Pap and it has the magwell cut out properly, I believe its a Mitchell Arms, Beautifully done just like the Saigas! Now that one I can compare possibly even make an attempt to say its better again due to the fact it has a thicker more dependable longer lasting reciever, also the gun is heavier which is a plus for recoil and accuracy along with a hammer forged thick barrell. I hate Century! There is nothing good about this company, nothing! Knowing nothing as far as accesories fir this rifle or its buttstock I mean they make a Tapco T6 buttstock avail via their website, its sooo ugly!!! Its like 3+ inches longer because they need a special cross piece to screw it in or to place the screws into the tube of it!!! what a great invention!!! And guess what Century is only one that has it avail and you have to fill out same paperwork with them to get it as you do for a firearm?! Based on a few reviews online I heard the same BS, someone filled it out and paid and after 3 weeks they didnt send anything, called and they just forgot! what? And as far as the Gunsamerica review, as mentioned before on this thread that any half diesent AK would pass the same test, any! as far as this being a Cadillac of AK’s, well then its a Cadillac with a crooked tires and a Hunday engine I guess! Century Arms makes me want to throw up!!! Do not buy their product(s)!!!
Interesting, there’s a huge number of people here who all hate the PAP rifle, and all mispell “decent” as “diesent” ,,,,,, and almost all of them use similar ***wacky** punctuation!!!! (I did that as an example). To me, it strongly looks like at least some of these are sock-puppets from the same poster just trying to defame the PAP.
alex
james
coreyc
bensonb
websterbb
Bfalconi
bigbear
BillieGunz
I used M-70 and M-76 while serving in Serbian Army. If I need to go to war again or zombie outbreak, I will always go with m-70! Just my opinion:) Check some new Zastava products and m-70 family mods…
http://www.zastava-arms.rs/
I have one of these, mine feeds well so far, everyone is right the polymer mags do not fit, my buddy has the underfolder in all black and his fits Tapco mags, I dont get it either. How can same rifles that had opened up magwells by Century to accept double stack fit mags differently? thats BS!! No Quality control or respect for the customers! Totally a Dick move!!!
I agree berniebb, I wrote about this rifle on this thread and others before, thats exactly what happened to me, I sent it back for repairs because I thought this rifle should be able to fit all mags and for them to make magwell more straighter, nothing, same response. Works with our surplus mags so good luck!!! same thing, wobbly buttstock and some new scratches on the dust cover along with wood scratches as well, asked to fit the canted sights, and ofcource no responce and nothing fixed, i know I can do this myself, by why does this have to leave the factory this way? took them to do this for 2.5 months, I live 2 states away!!! Cocks!
Totally Gutted and ruined magwell is the reason these have issues, the rest of it is basically not touched by the Century money grubbing assholes, they literally have no skills when it comes to completing a magwell to a double stack, almost none of the pap M70 are the same looking when it comes to the magwell and inside it!! This has to be the worst magwell job ever or up there fighting for 1st place! Even WASR’s magwell looks better off!!! It really does, look at them and compare them! Mine fits some mags good and mostly all polymer mags do not fit at all! I shouldnt have to dremmel or have to shave off upper sides of my polymer mags to make them fit!! They are labeled and are made for 7.62×39 standard AK Mag, and they all should fit!!! I would like to ask Century why do all other Brands and importers AK’s fir these mags and their wonderful Pap doesent? Why? How can you allow a rifle leave your so called factory with feeding issues? You making millions of dollars should be able to complete this job as it should!! Why after almost 3+ years of Importing this Rifle have you not changed anything about the way you cut out you magwell even after all the bad reviews and you bastards being soooo backed up with people sending them back to you for repairs!!! why? Why is it when you get the rifle you only use a Surplus mag to test it? Are you absolutely mentally challenged?? You cant have a sinle mag for just about every mag manufacturer out there to teast with to make sure they all fit? Spending another $100-$150 is too much for you to make sure all your future clients are happy?? Why not right? Century are Scum! this company has the worst customer service in the industry and has no plans to improve! They already know the issue their rifle has and dont give a rats ass about the customers, why improve, what would be the point of that! right? i dont want to hear anyone praising this rifle or this Trash of a company, they are the worst!!! And when you give them a chance to make it better for you they simply un-screw and screw your rifle back together and leaving it wobbly and unsafe and send it back to you in the mail stating its good, it shoots, basically Fuck you mr or mrs customer!!!
the yugo pap rifle was the worst ak style rifle i ever bought please do not waste your money on this i had at least three ftf fte every mag i ran i tried several types of mags all surplus or circle 10 mags none worked the wood was really cheap chipped and cracked on me sent it back to century it still sucked i can not recomend this rifle to any one now the only ak type rifles i have are arsenal/fime and i have a mak 90 debanned these rifles i will trust with my life
Century Arms can suck a big fat dick!!! Fucking Scumbags!!
I agree the rifle is great shoots good, takes all kids of shitty ammo I feed it. I agree it does not take any other mags other than metal surplus and that sucks, there are pleanty of plastic mags out there that are cheaper and I would love for them to fit, I dont fell I should have to file mags to make them fit, Century fucked up on that one, also could have made the magwell straight as well. Century always have been fucking up rifles, from glued together shit shooting Wasr to at times other shitty guns they offer as well. I went through 2 diff Wasr’s before and gave up and just didnt want them anymore, they suck ass. This rifle shoots good so far.
I have this rifle and it has no issues shooting or feeding, I have 2 a reg and underfolder, both feed great, eat all types of ammo, very accurate and dependable as all half way and higher end AK’s should. tru that magwells are uneven, looks kinda different even compared to some crapy WASR’s who’s magwell is staight. But I dont care about the magwell, I will file it myself to fix it being uneven, its trues it is uneven. other than that shoots great.
their manager named Laura in the Vermont office is a total piece of shit! never met anyone worse than her when it came to shitting on customers. Stupid company with stupid rules and shitty products.
Scumbag company as best….
I agree, Century is a worthless company to deal with!
I got one of these rifles, it feeds only with metal mags and with nothing else, mine doesent accept other mags or plastic ones, my buddy has one as well, his accepts them, or most of them. Why would they make these so differently? This makes me wonder? Do they just have a bunch of people just doing these one at a time as they feel that they should look like? or what they think an AK Magwell should be like? Do they have standard size charts or machines that cut these out according to standard Ak size or magwell size? because we compared ours and they look different? Does this company even have quality control of any sort? They manufacture firearms!!! They should!!! Dose this make sense??? Not to me??!!! My Brother has a Norinco and I used to have one many years ago, and they look identical. Why cant Century do their job correctly?? I have a cop buddy of mine and his didnt feed correctly aside from fitting all mags as well, why do our rifles feed and his didnt?? He was using metal mags! Quality Control ?? No?? Yes?? They straight up didnt test his or what?? Sending a rifle out thet doesent feed is a perfect idea!!! He called their Vermont office after he sent the rifle back to them to fix it and they said will mail it and its fixed in the next 24 hrs, again will mail in 24 hrs. He waits a week for a track# they were supposed to email, calls back in like 8 days and they said they just had a Gun Smith look at it today will be sending in approx 5 days?? What?? This is Cust Svc? Guess what? They didnt mail it till 2+ weeks after that last call!!! Awesome Customer Service!!! Good job!!! Great rifle from the start followed by outstanding customer relations from there. This must be an Industry standard from here on!!!
Century Arms sucks ass!!! Dont buy their shitty products, and if you do be ready to send it back to them so that they end up doing nothing about it and send it back to you!!! Good Luck!!!
I agree they are terrible!!! An importing company could not be any more less skilled in completing or working on rifles any less than this soo called company!! No Gun Smithing skills whatsoever!!! None! No customer Service!!! None!! To purchase a plastic buttstock from their website you need to fill out a firearm related form? Awesome!! Idiots!!
I would have to disagree with one of the comments up top that the Ak cannot be tricked out as much as a AR, have you seen a Krebs Custom AK before? there is a Quad rail system for all Ak’s out there, even the M70 Pap. sling attachments, lights, lasers, any scope is good to go as long as you have a picatinny. like 25 + different muzzle devices, etc…Anything and everything is available on the AK platform these days, there are full attachments for M4 stock, maco stock and Magpul’s etc… aside from My Pap I have a Saiga SGL AK, everything is done right on it as far as useful things. Ultimak front gas tube for optics, M4 style Maco recoil reducing tube and Stock (helps with recoil, makes me much more accurate and improved my groups alot, close to where Iam with my AR in and within 200 yard range and a bit farther), Us Palm grip and a 360 degree sling attachment, a micro red dot on the ultimak in the front, G2 trigger system, Magpul sling and front hand grip. this is not done for the purpose of tricking out or to look like an AR, but to use accessories that make theis system 100% better, easier to handle, aim, recoil, carry etc..Ultimately a better weapon to use. Ak can be as tactical as you want it to be and as tactical as an AR, difference is that AR is lighter, AK is heavier and more accessories the heavier AK gets. As far as AK vs AR there is no argument AK is more reliable, always has been and always will be.
This Pap, and I have one as well, is a good rifle, but its a shame Century gutted the magwell completely, alot of things have to be filed and redone to make it look proper and fit all mags than an Ak should be able to fit, as others mentioned on this thread it was cut by god only knows what kinda monkey that has no gun smith skills whatsoever, what was this BS company thinking? Why is the magwell so uneven? why doesent it fit all mags? who does this kinda BS!!!!???? I had to get alot of stuff straightened out in this magwell to make it half diesent looking, it cost me extra $!!! this sucks!!! should have been done correctly in the 1st place.
I saw this review and had to leave my comment, dear Gunsamerica please stop hanging on Century Arms nuts!! Please! I bought one of these, and it does feed, but only with metal surplus mags! Tapco and Bulgarian plastic mags do not fit, I think this is plain stupid!! I have plenty of metal mags but the idea that other Ak mags made for Ak do not fit is again STUPID!!!! I agree with all other feedback on here regarding the magwell, its cut extremely uneven, inside and out, nothing about the magwell modification to a double stack one is profecional looking or even at least straight !!! I dont know any Gunsmith that would have OK’d something like this, other than a money grubbing bastard that doesent care about anything but $!!! As far as the rifle it shoots good, fairly accurate (likely due to being a little heavier), a seperate good muzzle break helps a little more with the climb. Finish as far as paint is very plain and cheap, wood is a good quality though. century could have easily like someone said earlier been competing with Arsenal as the best AK on the Market with this one as long as they made it look and shoot right!!! Like everyone else, they stuck a single stack bolt in there, while having a double stack magwell!!!??? It might not change things tooo much overall but this is never done when converting to a Double stack. The fact that magwell is not done correctly or cut out 100% even o the inside is the main problem for alot of people having feed issues with this rifle, or because th feedramp is uneven!!1 Dont they test these before sending them, they simply need to make sute most of all mags out there on the market fit, otherwise its BS!!! What justifies making a magwell look ugly or uneven??? what??? I want Century to explain this to me?? WTF?? there are no avail aftermarket stocks other than ACE, and their stuff is all screw in, eventhough original and most all are screw in, it just doesent feel 100% sturdy to me, believe me I have one on it now. Century is so stupid! Why not make a block as well and attach a tube to it already molded in that can run that long screw through it (this rifle has 1 long screw that runs all the way through the buttstock to screw it in, and no other options avail), and thats it!! thats it!!! that way anyone can attach a Magpul, T6, etc stocks, or other regular looking AK stocks, shorter ones! Did century ever think about people that are shorter? or someone that didnt want a long stock? Overall a good rifle that could have been a perfect beauty.
Century Arms are a bunch of jerks who mess up rifles and then dont have the balls to fix them properly when they get them back, thats all folks!!!
Saw one at a show today in pa, magwell looks terrible, tried a tapco mag it didnt fit, tried centurys m pistol
And it fit, that’s cause century doesent cut that rifles magwell out, paps looks all fucked up, century sucks ass!!!
This rifle is a great shooting rifle, its heavy, good 1.5mm RPK style reciever, bolt hold open on the safety feature, thicker hammer forged barrell, has a G2 trigger (great easy pull), I feel has slightly less recoil, due to being heavier (than reg AK’s). Has a rubber pad already installed on the buttstock, help just a tad bit with the recoil, also its rubber so kinda serves the stock to stay in place, doesent slide off like a slick plastic finish would of your shoulder, and again doesent hit as hard. The sights were a bit off from the factory. Im short, short hands, so the longer stock on it not really a + for me personally, should be avail with a shorter stock? Why not? Even less recoil or muzzle rise if you install a AKM style muzzle break, it helps alot. The picatinny rail thats on top of the PAP M70 I have is kinda useless, it wobbles, maybe with a Eotech type scope it might be ok, for close combat shooting? Might be fine. Long Range, which is not really too usefull on a AK is not going to work. Dont get me wrong, the holographic type site wont go anywhere, the top stays on great and wont come off, just wobbles a bit. Also as others have mentioned, no 2nd sling ring, to attach a full sling, just in the front on the barrell, doesent make sense. I had to get a Echo 9-3 attachment, and also installed a Hogue AK grip, both went on great and Hogue feels great, much better than the factory cheapy one.
Now, lets talk about the mechanics of the Rifle, the magwell didnt fit alot of my other Mags I have, not the bulgarian not the Tapco, fits the metal ones only, the Original looking old school surplus mags we all have seen before. Im not sure why Century did this or in other words didnt do this all the way correctly to make the magwell accept all mags. as someone mentioned, this is an AK, all those aftermarket mags are made for AK’s, so why doesent this one work with them?? Not sure what they were thinking?? Also no side rail for scopes, at least on mine. Some models do offer that now, I think they finally got with the pointless rail on top to have these available with a original side rail for optics, too bad mine didnt come with this one. I overall did not have issues with feeding while using surplus metal mags, just dont feed it hollow point ammo, I understand those do not always work well. I used 4 diff metal mags, Hungarian, Polish, Romanian, all of these metal mags basically look the
same to me at least. All fed fine. some Polish ones went in perfectly, some go in but slightly tighter, that is obviously the Mags? Or the little ramp that holds the Mag in place ( the one closer to the trigger), is not filed all the way it should be, compared to my Arsenal, Arsenals has a slight filing done on it, This one dosent its just rounded out, that might be an issue. Also the same case compared to my buddies Chinese AK. So something that was likely already done my Zastava, no doubt was done by them or factory correctly, and when it was re-done by Century they just do not finish things off as they are meant to be or by factory standards. In other words this is not something Zastava would have done to their factory made rifle, look at the Zastava AK pistol, M85 I believe? I saw the Magwell, due to the fact it doesent need to cut out to accept double stack mags, because its already cut out this way by zastava, so Century doesent need to do anything with it to make it 922 compliant because its considered a Pistol*, the magwell looks a alot better, cut very even and properly. why wouldnt century follow the exact measurements of the Magwell for the M70, they already have the M85 in front of them, they import it?? And make idential Magwell, inside and out. I just dont get it, you have it right there in front of you!!! The part of the magwell closer to the barrell is so uneven, Im not a gunsmith but I could have filed it to make it straighter than that, and not to make it fit all Ak mags also makes no sense??!!??!!. Would I trust my life to this rifle, YES*, BUT*, as long as I have metal surplus mags around, LOL! Overall its not a bad rifle for the price I paid in Summer 2012, for $675, kinda overpriced at that time, but kinda good now. They are going for approx a $100 now, I do not see many selling for $1000 online but many are listed, but I saw one at a recent show here in PA for $850.00 + tax. My main thing with this rifle is that Century could have simply followed factory Zastava guidelines for the magwell, just as Arsenal does for Russian/Bulgarian AK’s, them cut the magwell identical to a Russian Ak used by Russian Army, perfectly cut and spaced out, and just made some adjustments to making a proper rail on top, if youre gonna have on then make it work 100%, attach a 2nd sling attachment, correct the sights to be 100% straight, maybe even chrome the barrell? I know its Hammer forged, awesome! BUT make it chrome lined, its better for the corrosin in the future, make a few other stocks avail?, or just simply make it easier to get aftermarket stocks in there by chnging the attachment options? Overall if they did these things they would have a top of the top AK on the market, compared and maybe even a better version than the Arsenal? Maybe a better civilian type sporter AK rifle, which it is called by Century. Why not strive to make a better and a perfectly made product and not just chop and sell asap??? chop and sell, chop and sell!!! At least its not a kit rifle and completely brand new from Zastava,Serbia, so all other parts fit perfectly well, and if you are going to cut the magwell, as everyone else on this thred mentions: why not make have a double stack bolt on there and adjust the feedramp for this as well (to make it fit/feed perfectly), alot of time this is a feeding issue for this rifle right from the factory, so people end up sending it back. Why send something that feeds all ammo, Mags, and fits all Mags made for an AK??? Dear Century this part makes no sense to me? I called there just to speak to a person about these general topics, this person rushed me off the phone and said send it in, we are very aware of the issues and will fix it, when I asked well if youre aware why not make it right from the start before goes out to a customer? This rep had nothing else to say, but ” send it in we will fix it”. My buddy had this same rifle with issues, sent it in, and as everuone else I have heard of got it back unfixed, with a reciept saying to use the metal surplus mags only, WOW! I didnt believe it till I saw myself, awesome customer service. they also sent back with a pretty sharp looking scratch on the buttstock, when my friend called in about it, and after 30 min on hold, they said to send back in again, this is a frustrating process for a customer, he just hung up, gave up. This sucks! Do your job right century and respect you customers and you would have the best AK or close to a best AK on the market. You wouldnt have peolple talking crap about you but you would have threads on the int about people fighting about the PAP being much better than a Arsenal, but thats a long way to go. Get it Right Century!
As far as AK vs AR, both are great, depending what for. AK is definetly more reliable, will work in any weather, dirt, sand, water, mud, dust, etc…AR’s will tend to be a a little finiky and need more cleaning after a certain amount of rounds, especially in very crappy conditions. These AR guys never have been through these conditions and constantly exposing their rifle to the worst conditions nature has to offer while shooting their AR full auto, for thousands of rounds back to back, to back, for hours sometimes without cleaning or allowing it to cool off!! Are you kidding me? No way it would surpass an AK-47, AKM-74 etc… as far as a reliability factor goes. These animals that US soldiers have to fight now, bury their sometimes 15-20 year old AK’s and dig them up when needed, to simply shoot when needed, and so far aside from IED’s they do tend to hit their targets sometines, unfortunately the amounts of our and other countries military dying everyday is quite alot. So overall the AK works and works well when you need it, keep it clean and lubed after every trip to the range and it wont let you down, also the AK will have your back when you dont clean it for months if needed. Overall AK is much less accurate than the AR, and heavier, harder to trick out etc. But Ak is a workhorse that doesent die down, it packs a bigger punch and can withstand rediculous amounts of abuse and keep going, in a urban environment (thats where Iam now and most civilians are, lol!) this would be a perfect rifle, whether natural disaster/urban unrest etc… How can you go wrong, goes through cinder blocks/brick/cars/ house walls/small trees etc…Shoots well within 25-150 yards depending whos shooting can a bit further as well (good scope, etc…). This is all you need in this environment, I dont need to hit crap at 400 yars away, what am I hitting really at that range? Anyway AK is the way to go.
Any ak can do this test, give me a break Gunsamerica!!! This is nothing new. as far as Pap M70 from Century, well…Some work and some do not!! This should be something Century Arms should be very, very proud of!!! Great job Century!!! Good job taking a beutifully made Ak, which some believe is the best of the best out there, a nice heavy duty AK and F-ing up the Magwell!!! Great Job!!! Awesome job….If you as a consumer buy this rifle be ready to pay extra to get it right by a real gunsmith, a real gunsmith!!! Not Century Arms Int!!! They didnt fix mine, a real gunsmith had to switch to a double stack bolt, adjust my feedramp correctly, and finish all the correct adjustments inside the magwell according to an Arsenal AK side by side, by all measurements, once done, accepts all mags: Promag, *All Bulgarian, Polish, Russian, Tapco, Euro metal surplus, and Yugo bolt hold open. My Pap didnt fit a Yugo bolt hold open before that, WOW!!! A Yugo Ak not fitting a Yugo Magazine??? These now all fit. As per a real gunsmith’s statement: ” This should be nothing for a large company like Century to do, nothing, cant believe they sold an unfinished rifle like this to a customer in the 1st place, shame….” These rifles come in perfectly made, and then Century totally makes half assed before making them compliant, The people they use as ” Gunsmiths” should have their hands…… well you know the rest…..
I have this rifle , just like the one in the pics. Shoots just fine with the metal surplus style magazines, did not do well with Bulgarian plastic mags, or Tapco. they just simply do not fit to even try to see if it feeds or not. Thats kinda stupid. All it is are a few pieces inside that had to be grinded a little better to open up by about a few mm or so? Century didnt do that and just does it to make them fit suplus mags. My Buddy just got a similar N-pap, all black and a newer one with a side rail for optics. His did fit the Tapco mag, we traded. Why is Century so inconsistent??? In a perfect world AK’s and AR’s would be the main two or the highly used rifles in USA. Mostly all other Importers that physically make AK coming into US 922r compliants make sure the magwell when cut out to fit double stacked Magazines, fit all double stacked magazines. Not these jokers!!! also the single stacked bolt is left in there?? And as most owners of these rifles dont have issue feeding and some do, this could be simply solved by doing your job correctly or just by making a fully finished product. I just dont get it!!! The general review of the rifle is true and AK’s are the most reliable rifles out there and they would all pass this test. I had someone recently try to go through a 1000 rounds in a AR-15 (Daniel Defence now at $2,300+++ AR-15) without cleaning. We tried it, his failed at the Range at approx 920 rounds. My Arsenal AK and both Zastava have not had any hickups at now 2000+ rounds without any cleaning, i know someone might say im supid for not cleaning it, I know, I know, I just want to prove a point to the hardcore idiots outhere that are living a dream with their AR’s. This is all at shooting semi auto, not auto ofcource. Fully auto they would not do as good (AR’s I mean). Just saw a video on Yuotube with an Ak buried for 18 years in Africa, **IN AFRICA!!!!!** (THINK ABOUT THE CLIMATE!!!!), 18 years. Guy just smaked it a few times to get some dirt off the top and put some motor oil in the barrell, full auto right from the start,2 mags i believe, back to back, not one hickup.
I have a PAP M70 as well, got it this Summer for $715 total with tax I Live in PA. Wood furniture, no side rail attachment for a scope, wobbly and kinda useless rail on top, good G2 trigger-which is no biggie its a $20 part. Hard to find any aftermarkey parts for this ak, you need the attachment from Ace online and it makes it look kinda ugly with it on, not original looking, so this sucks. A far as the Magwell, cut out uneven and very unproffecional looking, I have a Arsenal SGL so with a comparison of how its cut all around inside and just the magwell, its like black and white. Why not make it look good, cut it out perfectly and have a better feeding AK? this way you can charge more or almost as much as Arsenal Russian AK and compete on a higher market? If youre a seller you are what you sell, and if you sell unfinished products or crap at times that is totally useless then you are what you are “Century”, Half the mags that are out there do not fit, only or mostly only the metal Euro surplus mags, I tried like 6 different mags that didnt fir the PAP in the Arsenal and they all fit the Arsenal, some of the ramps and the hook inside the magwell are not filed all the way and stick out a bit differently or odly compared to Arsenal, this is only due to the Magwell not being finished properly, this is purely stupid. Called Century and they said send it in but if we text it and it feed with a Metal mags we will likely not do anything with it, “n general”, Im not going to send it then! whats the point? they dont want to finish doing their job then F them. Century is a joke. They had a great rifle and made it into a half diesent rifle, its a bit better than a usuall crapy kit stuff they make but still kinda half assed in a way. they leave a single stack bolt, I compared the 2 diff bolts and it is a smaller sigle stack, dont know why they would do this? Their website has no accesories or additional butttocks or foregrips available? If they did have a huge aftermarket variety then they would simply make alot more money, but they are too lazy to do this…,they really suck!!!.
Got this rifle and alot if issues, feeding, mags not fitting. Sent back…Century said to make sure I always use surplus style metal mags only, I never heard of anyone tell me this before about an ak, look at all the aftermaket mags out there, they all mostly fit other AK’s out there without problems at all. For some reason this rifle has issues? Also it has a worthless rail on top that moves, canted sights from factory in the 1st place, and came back canted 2nd time after sent in for the problems, was mentioned on the letter to them if they can adjust, nothing done…Even when emailing their gunsmith helpdesk, nothing, no reply, just a: “will do what we can” ???, I dont get it??? Why put a single stack bolt on there if you know youre milling out the magwell for a double stack mags??? I asked them and no answer as well. What are they going to answer me? LOL. Jackass company, full of Jackass no low class employees, including very rude bastards in their Vermont Office handling the shipping of the rifle. No one knows anything, different answer everytime you call, Lowest level of customer Srvice I have ever, I mean ever dealt with, trully a worthless company to deal with.
Century Arms is a very unrealiable company to deal with whom is responsible for many, many unreliable glued together guns, same with this PAP rifle (which is not glued together but does come from the factory in almost perfect condition, the it is made into or updated into crap by Century), Century’s history is discusting, gun smithing is laughable to say the least. I have been a collector and constant shooter of guns for more than 30 years, Almost everything I have ever Seen from Century is either assembled terribly or just simply something good that they recieve is made into crap once they touch it or make it compliant, etc… Horrible company, this review for AK’s being able to be used under water makes no sense to me, all AK’s are capable of this, as long as they cycle…all of them. Ak’s are pretty much the most simple and most reliable weapon on the planet…
Century is not a good company overall. way too many bad reviews online, and for some reason only people I see giving them a good review are the online sellers themselves not general public that actually ends up with the rifles they sell, that makse sense to me…this is for a reason…I had a real gunsmith with 35 + years of experience, gunsmith that assebles AR’s and AK’s from diff kits or custom makes it, he said ” compared to the other companies out there that import AK’s, they had a good rifle when it came in to USA, then they got their hands on it, thats it”….it was a good rifle from the factory….Im personally going to stay away, Id rather pay $250-400 more and get a Arsenal, even if its a Bulgarian its still not going to have the Magwell issues, I kinda with Arsenal got these not Century, they would have been awesome rifles, just as good as the Russian AK’s, just a little heavier. Oh well….
This review is kinda weird, mostly all or even an average crapy Century Wasr which is the bottom level junky glued together kit AK that simply just shoots and feeds will be able to do this underwater test and alot, alot more. Always!!! So this is just a sales gimick to help Century which for most part sucks and always sucked. I get it!!! LOL!!! *** As far as Ak compared to AR or M4 etc… AK is is much superior better as far is dependability, no doubt about it. with AR some guys have no issue, thats becausemost of them are civilian shooters, take this AR of yours to a desert, bury it, then let it rain and put in mud, leave it there for 5 or 6 days, come back and put some more sand in it and mud in it, then just try to load it, Im not even asking you folls to shoot it just try to load it, nope wont happen. I tried this with a Rock River and a Daniel Defence, both cldnt get a shot of, and not buried for days I mean for just 6-7 hours, then exposed to more sand and dirt and grime etc…etc…and nothing!!! nothing you jackasses!!! nothing….a dud. This is rediculous that people think an AK is less dependable, we did the same to Wasr, Norinko, and an Arsenal, all # shot well, charged and shot again, the Wasr had trouble charging, but thank god for the fact that I was able to simply pul it back and let some sand out and it shot. the charging handle on either of AR’s was having trouble… sorry AR guys, this is the truth, this is me personally doing this for mee to see with my own eyes, this was done a few peoples rifles and they were all there, and the most outspoken AR guys couldnt say anything, just stayed quiet while field stripping their rifles and cleaning them, now the AK guys are standing there and shooting them. WOW!!! this was something I have never seen before, now a few guys didnt want this to be taped and be placed on Yutube due to being embarrased, so we kept it to our selves, but if up to me this would be up there no problem. But so what!!! not like there are not enough videos on the web showing the AK’s dependability, adv damage power and ofcource simplicity, which makes it one of the best if not the best rifle even produced. Yeah the AR can hit stuff further away, and is lighter, reloads faster, etc…but like some guy mentioned in this thread, in an urban realistic environment this is mostly BS, you need a weapon that is dependable, can be shot constantly without cleaning for weeks, months, etc…, can easaly engage a threat at 25-150 yards +. which is ideal for urban combat and probably way beoynd what you would need., holds high cap mags and can cause absolute damage with a sigle shot to major parts of the body, or the parts that matter, chest, stoumach, head and neck, and below the belt. thats all you need as far as a rifle goes. everything else as far as a AR is not dependable, even the best most dependable AR’s constantly have issue of some sort, and no you cannot keep shooting them without cleaning it spotless with lots of oil for more than a day of constant shooting or even a full day of rapid fire. It simply would not work. Look at places like Africa, they all use AK’s, you really expect me to believe they clean them everyday, LOL! nope, some not for months, years even in some cases Im sure, this is with shooting them everyday.
Sent this Pap to Century Arms due to feeding issue, they didnt fix a thing, still has feeding issue, still doesent fit many mags other than metal surplus stuff, and even those some dont fit. Im talking about the way it milled out, its not done correctly and some mags are too wide or the magwell is too narrow, whatever it is the so called gunsmith!! (A Joke!!!!) at Century should be ashamed with themselves when sending a unfixed rifle back to a buyer!!!! they sent back a reciept that with their mag it shot fine…Ok thanks Century!!! Hope this helps other buyers to avoid this BS I have had to go through…
My friend had way toooooo many issue with this rifle, feeding, mag issues, no 2nd sling attachment, wobbly dust cover, etc….And when sent back to Century they didnt fix anything at all, nothing*, reciept said test is complete, rifle shoots, use other suplus mags that will fit…I dont know is that normal??? Is that helpful?? So because of that I would never buy anything they make, why bother…
Pros: good rifle overall, good history from the Zastava Factory.
———————————————————————-
Cons:
Century sucks!!!
customer service is terrible
*dust cover with a worthless picatiny rail is also totally 100% worthless
*how do you make a rifle with no other scope mount on the side??
*single stack bolt ona double stack rifle
*magwell cut out very uneven
*does not accept all AK mags, ehich are made for AK’s, and this is an AK??? makes sense? no? LOL…
*misfeeding issues with alot of mags, and some surplus mags as well…some very barely fit, almost too tight…
*only 1 single sling attachment in the front, no 2nd sling attachment anywhere else? Makes sense right??? WTF??
***Did I mention Century Sucks???**** Yup i did….
Hope this review Helps!!!!
The Pap M70 is a great AK rifle, shoots good, reliable, as all AK that are semi diecent AK’s are. Century is a piece of dog crap company, always has been always will be, from their WASRS to their crapy Garants, etc…With this AK just like someone mentioned before CAI had a chance to make a great weapon, but this means making a quality product all the 100% of the way. They made my magwell so damn uneven!!!! If you compare it lets say with the M85, or the shorter Zastava Ak pistol, (which dosent need to be milled out because it already takes high cap mags and is left alone as it came fresh from the Zastava factory), the Magwell looks perfect, even, cut perfectly, looks like the expencive AK47 out there. This M70 Pap, comes in with a low cap magwell accepting 10 round mags only via factory, so they cut out the magwell, and god forbid they do that straight???!!! really???? comes with a single stack bolt carrier/bolt, cause it s a low cap rifle from the factory. So, all CAI had to do was, cut it out exactly to the factory standard, adjust the feed ramp and fit a double stack/ or larger bolt which belongs in a Double stack Rifle/Magwell, as all other top producers out there do when making a proper AK to be 922 compliant. This rifle 70% of the time will shoot well and not have issues, but these idiots cut the magwell out so that it doesent accept half the mags, some people have good ones and some really crappy ones and with lots of feeding issue, mags not fitting issues, etc…WHY??? These guys dont give a crap about anyone or their clients, I tried calling their Cust Svc line, to ask general info about the rifle, or what can be done or just an opinion, the slow punk that answered the phone didnt know anything about the rifle, not a thing!!! just kept saying its a 7.62×39 Ak rifle, kept repeating this? really??? These guys missed the boat on this rifle, this one has a good RPK reciever, 1.5 mm thick, has a good tough thicker barrell, hammer forged barrell, as a (yugo)RPK would as well, co can take more abuse and possibly last longer, why not just finish this rifle to be perfect?? Why not put a scope mount on the side, * new versions do, but mine originally didnt!!! Didnt they know this would be helpful??? especially with a Dust Cover thats on there that wobbles? why is it on there if it wont hold 0?? whats the point?? scope or eotech type optics, doesent matter, it wont stay put! The people that have no issues with CAI are people that either keep they CAI rifle in a safe and never shoot it or theirs just simply works, which happens!!! sometimes!!! 🙂 , I had a Wasr and it worked…for a year….and about 500 rounds through it started to have feeding issues, sold replaced with another or a newer version, same crap 800 +- rounds later, Total Junk. Pay attention very close to the quality, the junk kits its slapped together from, the wobbly mags, etc…eitherway this is not a review if the Wasr so enough about that, CAI it total is a very large and crappy company, no respect, not care in the world about its customers at all. At any time you call! I wont bother sending my rifle back to them, this would be way too much for them to handle, if they cant do it right the 1st time then they wont get it done now, especially after all the reviews of different people on here and all , and I mean all over the internet. To all those blind people that like CAI??? LOL!!! just chk online for their reviews…for anything at all, they are the worst.
***as far as the review by Gunsamerica above, this was done totally to make CAI happy or to give them a commercial, any good AK47 can do a water test, even the crappy WASR, basically any hald diesent AK can do this.
***Now to the dumb asses that even have the nerve to compare an AK for dependability with a M4/AR-15….YOU ARE A DUMB ASS!!!!***AK47 is by far the more dependable weapon, from vets to guys in the army now, fighting in Army now etc…they all agree AK is more dependable. Its Ugly, its heavy(er), its alot less accurate-beyond 100-120 Yards (also depends on the shooter as well, and not the gun),,,,,but its alot more dependable. There are stories of Afghans I heard from Vets, that people who were serving in Afghan saw the AK’s a few guys had, one of the guys had an Ak47, taken from a Russian Soldier during the Soviet War in the 1980’s!!! this dude that had the Gun, fought with it afterwards for as he said approx 3 years after , while with the Mujahadeen, after Ruskies left he kept it, ofcource as everyone in Afghan does,,,LOL…..had it for years, till now of cource, accourding to him it was basically buried under his floor of his hut, never ever cleaned by his Afghan guy, during and after. And he did state he used it on and off after the war too, but not much. He did state that once someone he knew used his own shoe lace to just run through the barrell…ONCE!!! thats it. so lets see…svc time with the Russian that they took it off, kinda unknown, and likely cleaned as well. then 3+ years of constant fighting, everyday, rain, snow, sand, dirt, grime, constant heat and cold, non stop abuse, then…15-20 years of being burried in the sand, or wherever…while being taken out shot and then reburied, ****ALL WHILE NEVER, NEVER, EVER, CLEANED!!!!This guy said he never cleaned it, he said the guy who was his commander said he didnt need to, and it never ever jammed, NEVER***, HE SAID HE WOULD HIT PEOPLE RIGHT OF THEIR TANKS OR VEHICLES AT 250-350 YARDS AVERAGE, AND IF HE MISSED HE WOULD ADJUST THE RIFLE TO HIT VIA THE NEXT SHOT OR BURST, NO FORMAL MILITARY TRAINING AT ALL!!!***there is no M4, M16 variant that would be able to do this, NONE!!!***all you jokers out there that think so are just idiots…Even the Creator of M16 himself admitted to Mikhail Kalashnikov that AK is way more dependable. This was proven in Vietnam over and over and over again!!!! the new M4’s are constantly jamming on guys in the field, Mostly all the private contractors out there are using AK’s only, not M4’s. I have a buddy who served in Afghan and In Iraq, now does Private contracting in Afghanistan for a Company that has a Government contract there, he loves the AR’s, but he said ” Just cause of the dependability Factor would not Trust AR in the Afghan environment*** Uses a Russian Made AK, ofcource its all tricked out, a Krebs Custom with all kinda of Crazy xtra stuff, to make it more accurate and have way, way less muzzle rize and kickback, making it much, much more accurate than out of the box and even after Krebs tricks it out even. So all you Ak haters can suck it…My cousin just came back from Afghan, thats where I heard the story of the Guy burying hia Ak from, his camp or base came under attack, they fought for almost 3 days on and off, night and day, more than a few of our guys dead, his M4 jammed at a point of when the Talibs were basically right outside of the camp, after coming down lower and lower over the 3 day time span, almost shooting at 50 – yards away, he picked up another M4 from dead or injured guy, that one jammed 3 clips at rapid fire later as well, due to the fact there were more other rifles avail to use instead he continued to fight, eventually they fought off and with more and more air support fighting stopped, and as of 2 weeks ago we shared a 6 pack or 2 after not seeing him for a Year, this is from the Military’s mouth, not BS!!!! you tell me this is a normal rifle that our Army should be using????
hmmm …. yet another poster who uses the word “diecent” just like James and Alex, along with tons of wacky *punctuation!!!!!
Is this some sort of sock-puppet post?
Century Arms Customer Service is the worst!! the worst!!!
have this rifle, sent it to Century cause of feeding issues, they didnt fix anything, just sent it back and their reciept says dont use anything but metal mags, when recieved the rifle back the buttstock was not screwed back on properly, was wobbly, they scratched the gas port, didnt bother cleaning anything, (not that i care, but they said they would), their customer svc is a joke, everyone doesent care to chk anything for you,everyone says something different everytime you call, just a bunch of jack asses, **especially the customer service manager named: Laura in the Vermont office**,,,,this company mills out a single stack magwell to be a double stack, and keeps a single stack bolt!!! makes sense? No other Ak importer/manufacturer does this stupid, cheap, crap. Stay away from Century, the rifle is a very diesent rifle, new and made by a good Serbian company, all Century had to do was just make it look like the factory, just like Arsenal does, and they would have a better rifle, just a little heavier than a reg AKM variant, but more long lasting, more accurate. Instead they went cheap and all they care about is nothing but mass production and thier attitude and customer service reflects this!!! why shouldnt my AK accept all Ak made magazines, as long as its a standard size and spec it should work and feed always, with all variants. My friends Arsenal AK takes all mags and feeds the same!!! Eitherway this is a hassle and not how a company should act when it comes to customer service and making their product.
Interesting, both you and “Alex” misspelled “decent” as “diesent”. Also, you both use long strings of commas in strange,,,,, places ,,,,,,
James, are you Alex?
I own one of these. I Love this gun but when I took it out I had multiple feeding issues. I had Century Arms replace it with a new one. The new one same thing. I sent that one in and they repaired it. Now it works perfect Ive shot 1000 rounds with one feed issue only. I shoot Tula ammo it is pointy at the tip and the tip would hit an edge in the receiver. Century arms beveld the edge. Works great now I hope this helps others with this same issue. Its such a good feeling gun I could not find anything close to it in an AK. I purchased a Bushnell Red dot with an ULtimak front rail and a rubber hand grip. The dust cover rail is a joke. Kick ass gun now!
This is a great review of the Century PAP. I’ve owned two Century pieces now. One of them was the beloved WASR-10 and the other was an FN-FAL clone. I fired close to 5000 rounds through my WASR before trading, and can’t recall any FTF’s, maybe a handful of FTE’s. The FAL with 200 dollar Cabelas glass on it shot a 10 round grouping at 100 yds of 1.5″. That was with South African Surplus 7.63×51 also. I have been more than happy with both of the Century products I have owned, and I’m sure this is also a nice piece. The reason guys with their polytechs and Russians don’t have any issues, is that they never take them out of the safe. I also do some hobby writing on my own site. I review many weapons, check it out: http://gunmodreview.com
I just sent my pap back to Century cause of feeding problems, Iam the Alex that left the lengthy comment above earlier, Century sucks, they really do. rifle is supposedly on its way back now, will see. i asked for a double stack bolt/carrier which should come on a double stack AK in the 1st place, they wont tell me what they actually did and advised me its on a piece of paper they sent with the rifle from their so called gunsmith, LOL! WOW!!! will see what the shape is when I have it back! stay tuned…by the way their customer service is so terrible!!! no one there really knows anything, no one!!!
I have one of these and am thinking about putting a different stock on it. Does anyone know what options I have that fit the pap? Thanks
I bought one a few weeks ago. Review makes me think I made a sound decision. Where do I get more mags? I don’t think the PAP takes common AK mags.
It will take Tapco mags. In fact every mag (metal or poly) fits snug in mine with no problems at all. Wish my SKS did the same…
I don’t understand all the AK hate, the AR and AK are both very good weapons. There’s cheap AR’s as are there AK’s but this looks to be a very well made AK and one I purchased. I own a Stag Model 1 AR that I also love. On top of that I own both a Mac and a PC lol.
All I can say about this gun is it’s a fair deal. I picked mine up for $630.00 and I’ve put about 300 rounds through it with no problems. I wasn’t expecting a collectors piece. Hell… I purchased two Thompson Center .308’s for my sons to hunt with and had issues with them straight out of the box! If you are looking for a cheap AK type rifle that is decent for the money… you probably can’t go wrong with this one. And everyone I know agrees the AK is reliable and durable. I clean and baby mine after every shoot. I’ve taken this thing apart to the point that I feel like I could build one…lol. I plan on buying at least one more. I still think the rear canted site could’ve been avoided but it was fixable by adjusting the front site.
sorry my last review, I meant RPK reciever not RKS!….
I own this rifle as of summer 2012, on the shelf it looks great, feels good (much heavier than other/some AK’s, due to the RKS style reciever-makes it heavier, and somewhat longer as well), thats fine. Now lets talk about Century Arms, Im not 100% sure all the parts are 100% new. The rifle has a feedlug on the single stack bolt that is way too short, this rifle is cut open to accept high capacity mags, they do not come in this way they are modified by Century. Century does this knowing they need to have a double stack bolt and they still do not include one in the rifle, this will increase failure chances in the future. All high capacity AK’s have these double stack bolts, and these do not. “Cadillac” well I guess this one doesent has breaks of a $9000 hyunday then??? or something similar to that? :),,,Also the magwell itself, its cut somewhat straight on the sides, but the front part that clips onto the Mag is not staright, looks like its cut with a saw and then not finished or filed correctly, what asshole would do something like that??? WTF!!! PAP is a great weapon, very reliable as all other diesent AK’s (Russian, Chinese, etc…) but why make it to fail in the future??? Century is known for making shitty WASR’s we all know that, but they had a chance to make a quality product and kinda slipped. OK dont get me wrong, my rifle shoots fine and will likely last a while, as long as the bolt issue is not an issue, Im sure if I start putting serious amounts of rounds through it it will begin to take a negative effects! Look at the online catalogue for the guns they offer, its abunch of shit!!! crap!!! shit!!!,,,Overall as a new rifle they could have simply made it better, they could have done the magwell exactly to the double stack standard as the Zastava factory does-(as Arsenal does to the standars of the Saiga-AK), used a normal double stack bolt and installed a rail that doesent rattle or move around, WTF!!! they are a Armory and they cant make a normal rail, you go through the trouble of putting the picatinny on there why not make it work properly, jackass move. The original review of this rifle is definitely done by someone trying to be on the good side of CA,,,100%!!!,,,I hope you got a good discount!!!.
*By the way any Ak can do the underwater/mud shit test just as the PAP, any half diesent AK!!
*Also another point as to AR vs AK, i have a close family member that is in the military now, now I mean Iraq/Afghanistan now,,back from deployment in last 6 months type of now!,,, he has another approx 8-10 buddies we shoot with go drinking with etc, some are army rangers and a few marines and all are cops, and again all are active military, they all love their AR’s, M4’s, etc…LOVE THEM!!!,,,But not one time did any of them ever, I mean ever disagreed with me regarding the AK being more dependable, just dependable though! AR’s never compare, never!! I understand some of these guys on here like their AR’s more and thats a matter of an opinion but these are facts, I have heard stories from the horses mouth(s) about how terrible M4 is in battle, from all the sand, dirt, mud, shit, etc in Afghanistan M4 is constantly jamming, jamming after its been lubed, cleaned and ready to go, sometimes after auto fire of only 2-3 mags!!! you can watch some youtube videos even, watch them assholes!!! marines getting ambushed, i can see this kid shooting back and after 2nd clip he’s yelling I’ve got one sutck in the tube while being fired upon with none other than an AK47 you bitches!!! I love American guns, I am a very, very proud American, there is nothing wrong with being very patriotic about guns developed here in USA and loving them and preffering them to any other guns, that is your choice as a gun guy/consumer, I get it, all good! But do not compare!!! Do not!!! they are not as dependable as AK47’s!!! Never!!! Guys in Vietnam, and this is from a Vet’s mouth, said he had used Ak47 him self many, many times, sometimes had one on his back for weeks in the Jungle due to the fact M16 jammed and overheated etc all the time. I know new M4’s are better and improved, but they still are shit when it comes to dependability of an AK. There’s a video on youtube of a guy is talking about a Barrett AR, they are supposed to be top 3-4 most dependable and best AR’s on the planet, they cost like approx, and dont quote me $2500 + -, Guy says well after 500 rounds striker went, “well we all know that happens all the time on AR’s, thats just the plaform that they are!!! $2500,,,WTF!!!, Why should that be an issue at all??? dependability wise AK is much better and much cheaper choice,
NOW* accuracy wise, sure AR platform is better 100%, but we as consumers and regular gun guys dont need the 400-500 yard accuracy in real life, never!!! ever!!! Just target practice, and thats fine with me, but most urban combat even if everything is gone to shit, no cops, no army and total chaos on the streets, you will never engage anyone further than 100 yards, maybe 150??? Think about it!!! And I mean Urban environment. youre likely better of with a shotgun and a nice 45(prefferably),,or /40/9mm on the side and an AK on your back if possible, moving through the city trying to get yourself and family out of it, to escape to woods mountains etc…eitherway AK could be used but not on a Large crowd running at you and possibly armed as well and ready to pull trigger(s). Within 50-150 yards I can engage any AR guy just with the iron sights, not including a good scope, or if possible a Eotech or a good russian military scope PK-A or etc… I will likely do alot more damage, like one of the reviews before, go ahead and try to hide behind cars, brick, metal, or regular walls…will see what happens.. Talk shit all you want!!! All you want!!!
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Oh… I forgot to mention that the accuracy thing isn’t an issue anymore since I sited it in. Not the most accurate gun ever, but not bad at all.
Couldn’t resist purchasing this gun. I’ve noticed the price seems to be increasing in my area and I’ve been debating purchasing one for some time. I looked at the Romanian M10 (I think), and right out of the box it would not even accept the magazines that came with it. Changed my mind in a hurry on that one. I have shot 200 rounds or so out of the Zastava. I had only one issue with feeding and it was from an older magazine that a friend gave me. That is the only issue I have had. I have a friend who is a FFL dealer. He actually builds rifles but only AR’s. He does not prefer AK’s. I took this over to his shop and he said… and I quote… “there isn’t a thing in the world wrong with this rifle… it’s one of the better made that I’ve seen”. It obviously isn’t an extravagant collectors piece but it’s quality for the money. Biggest and only complaint so far… it was EXTREMELY inaccurate out of the box and they should throw in an iron site adjustment tool as part of the package. Other than that… I would recommend this to anyone with an extra 600 bucks looking for a fun durable rifle to round out their collection.
I have the poly thumb hole version and have yet to experience any problems, other than the dust cover sight mount. After the gun destroyed its second cheap red dot sight, i shot it with the stock open sights and produced an amazing tight group at 50 yards! Just feel that i must return the favor by saying something nice here.
I have one my self but in this article you didn’t finish the conversion. Raplace the dust cover and put on a side rail. That will bring up the accuracy. As it stands now the cover moves and has play in it , at close ranges its not a big deal but as you go back thats how you end up with a 5inch shot group. Try a 3inch or better.
Good read but I am afraid far from the truth. I picked up this rifle for my 25th birthday and within a week after going to the range a couple times it was in a box and on its way back to CIA for some work. The rifle would not feed properly and after some testing at the range we realized that the bolt would only feed correctly if the round was coming from the right side of the magazine. Not sure why but the left side of the stack would NEVER feed correctly. I should be getting the rifle back from Century within the next two weeks or so and I am willing to give them one chance to make it right. If its not up to AK standards ill send it back for a refund and try something else, most likely an Arsenal…those must be Bentley’s 🙂
I have had an AR for about a year and it has never failed me once. Thousands of rounds through it and I can’t think of one thing to complain about. I am disappointed so far in my first AK purchase, that’s for sure.
Sent my PAP to Century for the same reason and it came back unfixed. A lot of PAP owners are complaining about the same problem. The local gunsmith found the problem and is rebuilding it. When its done, it should work like an AK should but I will have way to much money into it.
All ARs are piston driven? Huh they must of forgot to put 1 in my BushMaster!
Well you did get a Bushcrapper I mean my Ar’s piston are exactly where LWRC put them
Thats funny, they forgot the piston in my DPMS also. WTF? 🙁
The piston is mislabeled. They call it a “gas key”.
Looks like I am going to have to get one….
Im sorry for you, keep reading the comments LMAO
hey is there any aftermarcket stocks for this gun?
if anyone finds an aftermarket adjustable stock and new forends for the pap please let me know
Tapco has a nice 6 position M4 style butt stock for the PAP M70. I put one on mine along with a Hogue front hand gaurd.
Tapco six pos adjustable butt stock: http://www.carolinashooterssupply.com/Tapco_M70_PAP_Adapter_and_Collapsible_Stock_BLACK_p/tapco-yugo-stock.htm
Hoge hand grip and front hand guard:
http://ak-builder.com/index.php?dispatch=products.view&product_id=30646
Ok, so I know nothing of the AK’s. I’ve never shot one. After seeing how this thing is all over the target, my question is WHY would you ever want one? Yea it can be put in water, and it’ll shoot, but even with a scope it still walks around the target. I’d rather have a piston operated AR.
Is there something that I’m missing?
All ARs are piston driven and direct impingement is the most reliable and proven rifle system in the world. So I woul start homework there, and if you want an answer to your question, just read the article instead of just looking at the pictures.
Yes! You need to shoot one to realize that AKs are indeed very accurate and very reliable. I have both ARs and AKs, and have been a firearms instructor for over 20 years. You need to stop listening to what other people are saying and start experimenting on your own, buddy! It helps against ignorance, you know!! You have no business in posting here is you have no experience and no clue what you are talking about!!
You have no business writing a comment here if you have no experience shooting an AK. That is what you are missing your ignorant idiot!
I’ve read all the comments with great interest. One of my first AK’s was a Mak-90 (scoped) that would shoot 2 to 3 inch groups at 100 meters. The second was a Saiga reworked by Roberson Arms that (scoped) with Sellier& Belloit ammo would shoot 1 to 2 inch groups at 100 yards; of course this was off a bench. This was long ago and both have since turned into trading fodder and looking back now I definitely have sellers remorse Why is it though that no one has tried to make a more accurate AK at a reasonable price? Outside of Kreb’s Custom I don’t think there is anyone and the likelihood of most spending $1850.00 on a Krebs Custom AK is remote, and maybe I’m just choosing the wrong tool for what I like to do which is spend a day at the range putting very small groups into far away targets.
I first saw AK’s in Africa and not in large quanties. In my later use etc. I found that this is like most Russian equipment designed for conscrip armies that do not need to be literate to operate efficently. The gun will work in snow, water, and mud. None of my American made weapons could match it for that specific use. The NATO 556’s are a definate improvment and can actually hit at beyond 500 meters. Civillian examples that are matched to the user are excellent if you take care of your weapon and clean the gas tube. If you have to use a 7.62×39 spend a little money and get a CZ 58. Hand machined light and capible of asorbing abuse. I also found those in Africa in the early 60’s and to this day they get my vote. Long range? Use a .308 or spend the money and get a upsized .338. The M-14 will always be my favorite. My w 3 who was guns best gift to the army developed the type 21 which matched with the sionic’s barrel modification was my best choice to this day for designated marksmen. I actually have a Zastava in .223 that is a wonderful inexpensive rifle that is good out to about 300-400 meters And as an aside is better made than the $800.00 types you will find. Each and every gun has a purpose and they stay around if you let them. I can even teach maintence to my wife in about 8 minites and have her hitting targets out about 300 to 350 meters. Some of the custom Ar’s are about all that you will need to . Buy something try it out and then comment on the issue intelligently. Anouther weapon to look at is the CZ series in 7.62 x 39 cal. It was a first love of mine for many years. Try it out. Let the kids and the low budget play with theAK’s and get yourself into something comfortable. This still reminds me of a current issue from our local gun clubs. Rule one !: find something you can afford’. Rule 2, take care of it. and se if everyone can help out with any problems. rule 3 find someone to observe your actions and then listen carefuly to them. Then if you have heart breaking problems come and see me. I just may be able to help you.
Pat Mellen
Bought on last night.
What do you think so far? Had any range time yet?
He still mad at himself for buying that paper weight
I am not sure you know what you are talking about either. I have used the M-4 or M-16A2, A4 with the proper maintenance for 16 years and twice in combat. Two tours in Iraq thanks. I am not sure what kind of ammo you were using in that M-16 but the ammo I use can go right through the sheetmetal and take out any occupant in a vechile from that distance. The AK is terribly inaccurate and I would never pick it over a well built AR/M16. The new models will work with little or no lube and are built a hundred times better than any AK. I will put my AR build up against your poorly built AK any day. Oh and I played in the sandbox for over 2.5 years during those tours.
If you are really a shooter you would have never placed a scope on the dust cover. Ever!
too bad there are tons of AK owners who mount scopes on the dust cover. A simple Google search would show you this is not uncommon and a Vietnam Vet friend of mine who I consider a top notch shooter has an AK with a scope mounted on the dust cover. But I guess since **YOU** said he’s not a real shooter it must be true though!
I just purchased the one with the Polymer thumbhole stock. It is fantastic!!! I have put 150 rounds through it so far and no problems what so ever!!!!
I guess they’ve never heard of Arsenal USA. I’d put my SAM7 up against this thing any day. There’s something about a gun with all the parts forged and milled by the same manufacturer in the USA. As far as a torture test, I remember seeing their Youtube video that involved dirt, water, and a Humvee!
I’ve got AK’s and a herd of AR’s both have holes in usefulness, situation to situation. Nothing is perfect and I can’t carry all that I might need. Rimfire is hard to beat overall. Now you can laugh.
Ruger 10/22 all day
Well I will always see these are the best yada yada yada. Century Arms have some issues with models of the AK. I own a preban Polytech and yes a afterban Norinco MAK 90. The Polytechs are hands down the best that was ever made and are highly collectible. The Norinco Mak 90 is also a straight shooter great for plinking and hunting. But go figure both was made by the Chinese armory. As for these people claiming the AR 15s are the best well drop it in the mud and run a magazine lets see how happy you will be.. I have owned my share of both and the older AK’s still have reliability compared to the AR. If you wanted a nice 223 then a MINI 14 would be the reliable choice if you like made in the USA. Of course there are a handful of AR variants out there that might be worth it. The market has so many great weapons each has their pros and cons. I wont be running out to buy a Century arms product especially after the WASR2 they marketed was a hatchet job. I do recommend if you are looking for a high cap weapon buy it now things may change down the road on them again.
First, I agree with combat vet. I regret buying a DPMS M4 .223. I would prefer to have purchased another DPMS .308. I own a WASR that I have never had any problems with. No complaints, I agree that the .223 is pretty much worthless. It is not a round to put others down permanently but it is a wounding round, and this was told to us in the Army 30 years ago. If you wound a person in a firefight it takes them out of action and several more to carry their comrade out of the fight. Shooting the .223 at night with tracers is an eye opening experience. They deflect on a single blade of grass. If your foe is in ANY foliage you might was well throw rocks at them. I urge most people to get a shotgun so you do not kill your neighbor. If you can accurately handle a rifle get an AR .308, but think about this a .308 is lethal out to 1000 meters. The bullet that misses will kill someone far, far away. Get a shotgun, they are true hell up close but nothing after 200ft.On pistols the best IMHO is the Glock 20 10 mm loaded with double tap ammo 135 noshers 1600ft/sec 767 lb/pd. 16 rounds per clip and in chamber. Be very careful it does not have a true safety. NEVER rest your finger on the trigger! EVER!!
Your finger is the safety!!!!!!!!!!!!!
First, I agree with combat vet. I regret buying a DPMS M4 .223. I would prefer to have purchased another DPMS .308. I own a WASR that I have never had any problems with. No complaints, I agree that the .223 is pretty much worthless. It is not a round to put others down permanently but it is a wounding round, and this was told to us in the Army 30 years ago. If you wound a person in a firefight it takes them out of action and several more to carry their comrade out of the fight. Shooting the .223 at night with tracers is an eye opening experience. They deflect on a single blade of grass. If your foe is in ANY foliage you might was well throw rocks at them. I urge most people to get a shotgun so you do not kill your neighbor. If you can accurately handle a rifle get an AR .308, but think about this a .308 is lethal out to 1000 meters. The bullet that misses will kill someone far, far away. Get a shotgun, they are true hell up close but nothing after 200ft.On pistols the best IMHO is the Glock 20 loaded with double tap ammo 135 noshers 1600ft/sec 767 lb/pd. 16 rounds per clip and in chamber. Be very careful it does not have a true safety. NEVER rest your finger on the trigger! EVER!!
I don’t really care if you cream all over this rifle, but please, don’t deride the Chinese for what they are, and that’s a military quality rifle, built in a military rifle factory, unlike most AK’s out there. They are also, IMHO, with the exception of some late MAK’s, the one of the best AK variants out there, but, don’t believe me, believe the US Guvmnint, who re-armed Iraq with Chinese made AK’s.
Also, IMHO, the longer stocks, and the Yugo foregrips are NOT more comfortable than standard AK stocks, in fact, most Romanian rifles I own, have the swollen foregrip of the AK74, which is one of the most comfortable out there, not to mention ergonomically, and functionally superior to smooth ones.
And, speaking of Cadillac’s, I remember one called the “Cimmaron” which, was a Cavalier, rebranded, with a flashy grill, and soft seats, but inside, it was all Cavalier, and thats ‘Zackly, the Cadillac you have here, for the money, give me the Romy, with its strong and ugly laminate furniture, and the cushiony feel of its chrome lined bore, especially since I HAVE some of that old steel core Chinese corrosive ammo laying around, any day. Ad ten bucks for a few cans of Krylon, and that Romy Cavalier stills comes out a better deal than tits on a chicken any day.
Nice article, but I would give KVAR…Arsenal Inc as the Mercedes of Ak’s. My SGL-94 ”Kalashnikov” has ar like accuracy, but with legendary durability. That’s the place to go for Ak
‘s and Saiga .
What did Century Arms pay you to write that article? I LOVE THE AK47 and have used it over and over in combat and choose it every day over an M16 in combat. I have two of each in my safe but I always grab an AK… the M16 is a finely oiled machine that breaks down at the first drop of a hat but the AK is a hammer it can be rusty dirty etc but it always works and keeps on shooting. As far as the idiot who said the M16 (AR) can do anything an AK can do and better they have never been shot at by either. I gave a demonstration last year at our annual machine gun shoot at a junk car. firing the M16 using controlled bursts at the junk car at 200 yards with 2 30 round mags with 58 hits only two round penetrated the sheet metal. after walking down and checking the target, I fired the same 2-30 round mags at the car from my AK. with 57 hits all rounds went straight through the car through the sheet metal into the seat out the other door and the whole car was like that. so the M16 can not do what the AK can do. I am pretty safe behind a car if your shooting at me with an M16 but not an AK… the AK is not as accurate that is true but in combat with adrenaline and moving fast running with body armor etc your carrying your sand bags and shooting sub moa from your AR right? HA what a lie and BS you obviously never been in combat… The AK works and works wonders and is fantastic for what it is…. and to the guy who talks about Rambo movies like there some kind of instruction manual for combat your a fucking idiot… Rambo is Hollywood entertainment wake up and smell the shit.
by the way the AK is not a bolt gun so why would anyone with a brain put a scope on a AK? one of the EoTech type sites sure but a scope? really? put down the bong and sober up will you…
and lastly Century Arms has not built a decent weapon in as long as they have been in business. I have purchased their WASP series and they did not function out of the box… I bought one of their Garands and that was so crude I had the receiver replaced with a original. So when you write something about weapons please know what your talking about before publishing it… the article about buying and collecting Colt SAA was well written and someone knew what they were talking about. This article was propaganda written by century arms salesman who has to make his quota..
All very well said. Perhaps like Pat Mellen below, I spent quite a bit of time in Central and West Africa in the mid-late 1990s, not employed as a fighting man myself, but in the thick of a LOT of fighting. I’m a journalist, but I’m also a “gun guy”, so I paid close attention to what was going on around me. The array of small arms in an African civil war can be truly astonishing…StG 44, anybody? (Where the hell were they getting ammo for that? This is Africa…WTF stuff happens every day…) As you would expect, there were AKs of every imaginable stripe and one thing I can say is that they are seriously rugged. What can an AK do that an AR can’t? Well, remain operational through several years worth of corrosive ammo in the total absence of any kind of maintenance in a place with 90% humidity, mud, blood, bugs that eat anything that isn’t red-hot, swamps, red dust, vegetation and leaf litter everywhere, etc. Is it as accurate as an AR? Absolutely not. Will it make things unpleasant behind cinder blocks and corrugated iron in a way that an AR can’t? Oh, yes. Ask me how I know. The AR is a fine rifle in its own way, but so is the AK, in a different way. A lot of very dead people in places like Sierra Leone, Rwanda, Burundi, and Zaire/DRC got that way because somebody else’s AK worked when it counted, not just reliably but very effectively.
What AK do you recommend? I also love m14’s
this is a nice ak for the right person and for 700ish fine. but come on with this long article. some nice furniture who cares. a bolt hold back not a big deal considering a saiga has them and they r way less money even after converting it. optic rail sucks and they said it. safety lever ok well i can get a krebs custom lever that’s easier for $50, the slant brake still stinks and on and on. basically you can put any accessory on a cheaper ak and make it as good or better than this for a similar price while picking the accessories you actually want.
” basically you can put any accessory on a cheaper ak and make it as good or better than this for a similar price while picking the accessories you actually want.”
Gotta disagree there. It’s better to pay for a better base gun (receiver, barrel, careful assembly) than to tack-on a bunch of accessories to a badly made piece of junk. You specifically call out the slant brake. Ok, yes, they suck, but they’re really more of a cheap thread protector. I’d rather buy an AK with a slant brake and ‘pick the accessory I want’ than to have the manufacturer guessing what I want.
With regard to the “Ar’s” they have firepower all right, but nothing beats a 7.62: especially in the 51 mm. size!!
I would beg to differ i would never take a 7.62×51 over my .338 Lapua mag!!
Does anybody know where I can actively by the 10 rd single stack mags for the PAP? I’ve searched all over the net and can’t find anybody still in stock or still selling them.
http://centuryarms.biz/proddetail.asp?prod=MA206
How many do you want?
Say what you will about the the ak but in real world situations it rather carry that then a Ar any day …chrome. lined barrel and underfolding stock on the pap?
Are the barrels chrome-lined? I couldnt find information that specified. Otherwise it looks like a worthy contender. I’m about to add a few rifles to my collection as I have gone overboard with pistols. I’m starting out with a few sensible, robust, solid contenders and for the AK variants this looks promising.
If this is the Cadillac then Saiga must be the Rolls Royce.
And a AR is a Bugatti
You would never use a Bugatti as a getaway car!
Only accurate guns are interesting.
No gun is accurate ITS THE PERSON PULLING THE TRIGGER
Bull. A good rifle is both accurate (putting rounds on point-of-aim) and precise (putting rounds into a small area on target). The best shooter in the world can’t hit anything with a piece of junk rifle. thefirearmblog.com/blog/2014/07/07/worst-sks-scope-mount-ever/
I have the 10 round thumbhole stock version I bought at Cabels’s before I learned that Century Arms was importing them. I love it. I also own one of the wood stocked high capacity ones like shown here from CA. I love it also. Both are great rifles. I have a 3×9 scope on the 10 round version and do 2 1/2 inch groups at 100 yards. I will ring a 12 inch gong at 300 yards 8 out of 10 rounds with the rifle and 154 gr. Herters ammo from Cabela’s. Can’t ask for better than that.
No chrome lining on the chamber or bore of the Yugo rifles. Say what you will about the WASR (Romanian). It DOES have a chrome lined barrel and chamber.
I’ve read the new article of the PAP AK 47 an it sounds like someone actually attempted to improve the AK to some degree. One has to go back to the original design of the AK in that it was an early developed auto rifle that was used by the viet cong and many other communist countries. Yes the original AK has many issues, terrible trigger pull, loose tolerances, target group terrible and yes you could actually here the viet cong running in the jungle with the AK rattling all the way. These rifles were built all over the world in communist countries and parts were inter changably with any gun made through out the world no matter where they were made with the exception of the sixties Chinese verision which had an machined receiver.
They were made in mind with people with limited knowlege to use. If you pull the gun apart you will notice that the trigger mechanism resembles a toy cap gun. The tolerences are loose so they don’t have to be cleaned much, that’s what gives it the rattling effect when shaken or run with through the jungles.
Spending money to improve the AK is like redesigning the a Yugo, yea you might get a little better, but you still have a Yugo. In this case a AK
I don’t know A, seems like you’re kinda scraping the bottom of the barrel for articles these days…??? But you still haven’t cleaned all the crap out of the bottom of it.
First of all it is NEVER going to be me (alone anyway) with a gang of looters. Indicators precipitating such a situation of social breakdown degenerating to a point where roving groups of predatory banditos are attacking and home invading everything that moves will always be advanced enough for the intelligent survivor and his family to ‘get the gell out of Dodge’ while the gettin’ is still good. Unless you’re a Rambo wannabe and bored with the usual TV adrenalin hits, then you might be delusional enough to ‘stick it out’, ‘stand your ground’, and defend your Castle…right up to the time they burn it down with you still ‘defending’ it…. and if you are ever found, your body will be right next to your Cadillac AK with its nice ‘wood’ all blackened and charred. The only good defensive position outside of a battleship, is not being in one to begin with. For those of you of the ‘Rambonian’ school of gang warfare and guerilla tactics, recall that even John never found himself ‘alone’ face to face with a gang of anybody unless he was on the offensive and had a belt fed .50 BMG, tons of H.E. to set off, or a gunship to rain rocket and mini-gun ‘P’ down on the fools. Otherwise he was escaping, evading, and counter ambushing. And you never saw him hunkered down in his ‘castle’ patiently stuffing his cheeks with cheetos waiting for a dangerous mob of looters to attack him! Surving ‘in place’ as an intentional advanced plan against potential social breakdown and anarchy is so stupid i have to stop talking about it anymore lest my BP exceeds my cyclic rate of cognitive fire!
I also apologize to tell you that an AK simply is not the best home defense weapon, as everybody should know by now. It was never made for that just like your 300 Win Mag wasn’t either. Not saying they wouldn’t work in a pinch, anything would be better than nothing in skilled hands, but i’d be more nervous afterward wondering if i added more innocent neighborly bodies to the scene from the penetration of high power rifle rounds. There’s not much that beats one of those new 12 guage semi auto’s with quick reload detachable mags. Or that nice 15 shot Kel-Tec pump, for home invasion CQB type combat, along with a good pistol in your waistband. And if that mob of looters gave you the losing lottery number, buckshot would still be better in an urban H-H neighborhood. Why would you ever be ‘shooting’ at anything out to 100 meters and beyond, anyway? Are you a police sniper? If so, you wouldn’t be using an AK. BTW the DHS, as we all know by now, is stocking up mainly on .40 cal ammo for potential urban unrest. Doesn’t that tell you something about firepower tactics for the most part in urban anarchy situations?
That said, back when Norinco AK’s were going for a buck and a half from SARCO and 1200 AP rounds in a sealed tin for 69.95, well yeah, it never hurt to have a couple of these for beer and blasting fun. Especially the handy underfolders. And if you could only have one weapon, well, at those prices, You’d suck it up on the ergonomic disadvantages, (i laugh at that stock length argument when skilled operators specifically replace to shorter stocks for tactical ops) and learn to hold your front sight very steady while your manipulating a less crispy trigger, and clearly realize your point blank limitations due to barrel accuracy. And not think you’ll be doing praire dog sniping at 300 meters any time soon, then an AK can never be said to be a ‘bad’ choice, all things considered.
But! And thats a big fat extra long rifle BUTT in your fat armchair couch potato butt face, when you are buying ‘Cadillac’ AK’s at $800. a pop, oops I mean PAP, then that changes the entire Zombie golf game. For 800 bucks you can get a brand new decent AR-15 carbine all day long at a gun show and if you are able to put one together from a parts kit, you can do even better on price or accessories.
And sorry again for the rude ‘awakening’, but its better to be alive and awake than dead and obstinate, There IS NOTHING AN AK CAN DO BETTER THAN AN AR-15. Except maybe be heavier. The reliability myths came out of unusual past combst circumstances. Thats all been worked out. Modern well built AR-15’s are actually more reliable than AKs, all issues compared, and yes, Myra, AR-15s can shoot right out of the swimming pool also. Just like an AK and most other semi auto’s, once the water in the barrel is drained. But unlike the AK, which has seized up on extraction on more than one occassion in my experience with constant full auto fire absent of proper lube in combat, the AR-15’s were actually designed to fire without lube. Not to mention that there’s not much, iF anything that rises to the level of AR-15 rapid firepower suppression, in terms of quick changing of magazines. And certainly compared to an AK, with its inherent ability to jam a magazine in the well if not inserted just right during replacement, (which is in many pro user’s opinion the second biggest drawback to an AK) especially during high adrenalin rapid shoot out exchanges, where fine motor finger movement is often compromised, the AR-15, with quick release drop free and rapid replacement mag capability, is the full house Aces high winner. Hands down. (or up if you’re taking prisoners). Paying 800. plus tax and fees for any AK-47 when you can get an AR-15 for less defies logic, but then whoever said gun ‘enthusiast’ collectors, as opposed to combat operators, were logical.
The bottom shot is don’t waste your money on this AK unless you have it to waste. It’ll be like that other type of ‘pap’ smear. You won’t be that impressed.
What the hell. . .have you got any death threats? I can’t believe I’m typing this out but your “article” was hilarious! I’ll tell you 1 way an AK is better then an AR is BULLET WEIGHT. An AR-15 is just a glorified .22 caliber and, actually, a .22 is better then a .556 because the .22 will ping around inside of the human body. Of yeah, and what’s up with your name? You probably ment to spell it like this: Mujahideen
Look, I am a huge .22lr fan with quite a few rifles/handguns chambered for such–agreed that the .22lr is a very deadly round and quite underrated at that in that many novices believe it to be only/mostly good for plinking or pest eradication… But, make no mistake about it, the .223/5.56 is a much better round for combat needs for a multitude of reasons related to ballistics data that we need not pursue here to be sure (it can only be addressed via a dedicated thread).
However, I say get both a firearm chambered in .22lr and another in .223 (maybe an AR build in both ;)…
AK has real size bullets. Most of the armies arround the world and all hoodlums are using AK not AR15. Red China has more money than the USA and they didn’t switch to ARs. Are they stupid? They supply to us all crapy items and we continue to buy from them lousy lamps, electronic, screwdrivers. Who is smarter?
During Vietnam war 55,000 Americans were killed by Vietkong using AK. Now we buy tulapia and other products from Vietnam. Are they stupid to use AK? I think was an article on http://www.SherViews.com about AK or AR.
You are “right”. Millions of guerillas, camel drivers, whole Africa , Asia, South America and all Chinese army don’t know how to arm their people. AK was used in Vietnam by bare feet peasants. 223. bullet can be deflected by a small tree brach, not 7.62. Ask seasond “search-and-destroy” Vietnam veterans: “What you prefer AR or AK?”.
!2 gauge pump has pellets or a slug? Big difference. Colt 45 is better than your bulky 12 gauge. Rest of your article is crap also.
Actually, good as ye olde 1911 is, it’s still a pistol and that is what you use while trying to get to your long-arm, ANY long arm. The AK does pretty well out in the sticks where I live and my nearest neighbor is half a mile and my main problem is coyotes and I am not too concerned about a MOA humane shot. If I bring him down, he won’t be in misery long.
I doo agree with the fellow who pointed out that standing your ground against roving gangs is suicidal. That is why I and some friends network. We have plans for rallying and fall back to a more defensible position. “Defensible” mainly because it is so far off the beaten path it would be quite a while before anybody bothered looking for us. Just no profit in it unless you were getting desperate. But, that is only “plan-A.”
Anyway, you get the picture.
As for the AR, it was bad enough with the tumbly 55gr bullet but now that they stabilized it with the 62gr bullet and whatever other modifications, it is less than lethal w/out multiple or seriously located hits. Of course, I have to admit I was in the M16A1 era.
Man I read that comment and I don’t care if it was 3 years ago. I want to Jap slap the fuck out of you and your yuppie shit filled mouth. Your obviously just a cockbag and sad depressed and alone in your moms basement or some shit. I hope is SHTF you get raped tortured and set on fire. Hell I want to rob your house last honestly so you can watch the world burn down around you. You really truly and forcefully should suck start a shotgun and never talk to anyone about anything ever.
I’m a big fan of the Zastava PAP. I bought mine prior to CA getting involved-not a fan of CA personally. Mine is the single stack 10 rd version which I purchased at 1/2 the going rate right now through CTD. Not a rattle ora wiggle in the whole damn thing. On steadier days I’m holding 3 MOA at 100 yds iron sights. The scope mount on the dust cover is for looks only-don’t even bother with it. Go side mount or fore end mount. My version has the black poly thumb hole stock and poly fore ends-the ergonomics despite comments I’ve seen is actually good. This is my favorite piece in the stable for a fun shooter.
Nice piece, great balance, milled receiver, solid shooter. Recommended.
Thank you, your testimony and article i just read made up my mind. I have been looking at the poly pap for a while now. I put one on layaway today and will get it out next month. Do you have anything else to tell about it now that you have used it for a while? Did you buy yours online?
Thanks,
Glenn
An excellent article on my favorite rifle! (I’ll take reliability over ‘cool factor’ any day!) What specifically is this “new legislation keeping the government from taking our guns in the event of natural disaster”? I’d like to look it up. Thanks in advance. Keep up the great work!
… Calling my dealer tomorrow, I’m sold on it!
Im sorry for you
Have one and loving it. I’ve owned several AK variants and this is truly the “Cadillac”. Get ’em while you can.
how does it compare to the arsenal – i thought they were supposed to be the top of the line ak’s
Actually, a nice article. Most folks commenting are simply carrying on the endless AR-vs-AK debate and that is not what this article is about. It is really about the Zastava pap vs all other commercial AK47 variants. It is clear that the Yugoslavian version stands up well to the military traditions of that Kalashnikov design. That is no surprise considering Zastava’s long history of military as well as civilian arms making. They also are well known for building in the same quality in their civilian arms that they did and do in their military arms. So they didn’t do so well at making cars. Not the same thing at all.
Now, I only have a wasr AK but, it must be one of the better of the breed as it has never failed me and Century’s modified Czech vz58, not really an AK at all despite outward appearances. But, if it was in my budget, I would definitely grab one of these pap rifles. I have a couple Yugoslav M59s and a 59/66A1 (sks rifles) and those are tough rifles and more accurate than the run of the mill variety of the breed too. Also having a number of Yugoslav bolt rifles all the back to 1929 so I have a healthy respect for Yugoslav rifle manufacturing capability.
Whats the model number for the ak47 paps rifle