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Judgment is an underrated component to knowing when, where and how to exercise one’s Constitutional rights.
Yes, yes, yes, Constitutional purists will sneer at the suggestion that one should consider social conventions, a normative understanding of tact and the wider implications of one’s actions before exercising a right, but I think the majority of us would agree that sound judgment — an amalgam of those considerations as well as others — is important in this particular context.
To take an example from the gun community, I support the right of the lone open-carry advocate to strap on an AK-47, don fatigues and a flak jacket, and walk into the local supermarket to grab some brown sugar and a gallon of milk. But do I think that individual is exercising sound judgment? No. Do I think that individual is forwarding gun rights for the gun community? Probably not. In fact, one can make a pretty strong case that the opposite is occurring, i.e. that individual is alarming responsible gun owners, scaring non-gun owners and perpetuating the Obama narrative that gun owners are militant extremists and “bitter clingers.”
For the record, I’m not against open-carry advocacy. But I think there is an intelligent way to go about doing it. I think open-carry advocates should notify police before holding a demonstration, carry banners and signs to delineate their message to bystanders and onlookers, travel in groups to avoid the “lone gunman” distinction, follow local laws and be respectful and polite to everyone they encounter: business owners, law enforcement, the non-gun owning public, etc.
By talking about open-carry advocacy I’m attempting to draw a parallel to the free speech rally this past weekend in Garland, Texas, where two men were killed and one was injured following a thwarted terrorist attack.
Though the investigation is still ongoing, one doesn’t need to be Sherlock Holmes to figure out what motivated the attack. As part of the free speech rally, The American Freedom Defense Initiative put on a “Muhammad Art Exhibit” in which cartoonists got to compete for a $10,000 prize for the best depiction of Muhammad, the founder of Islam. As many of you know, it’s a great offense to Muslims for one to draw or render an image of the prohpet, specifically if it’s done in a satirical or derogatory manner. Cartoons, of course, fit that description.
The American Freedom Defense Initiative certainly has the First Amendment right to put on a Muhammad Cartoon Contest, but just because they have that right, should they do it? Is the organization exercising sound judgment?
Just like with the open carry advocate I described, I question not only the group’s methods but its motives as well. The AFDI claims it wants to promote free speech, the freedom of conscience and equal rights, but a contest that deliberately and unapologetically offends millions, perhaps billions, of muslims is not the best way to go about achieving those objectives — just as carrying a long arm openly near a school is not the best way to galvanize support for the Second Amendment.
So if the AFDI is not really out to win hearts and minds, what is it doing? From the looks of it the AFDI is trolling. That is, the AFDI is sticking the proverbial broom handle into the beehive to get a reaction. And there’s no doubt that the AFDI succeeded on that level.
As mentioned, two armed suspects were preparing to gun down the events’ 200-plus attendees. Thankfully, local police introduced these would-be murderers to their maker before they could carry out a deadly attack — but not without sustaining at least one casualty, a security guard received a non-life threatening wound to the leg; which raises yet another question, is putting innocent lives at risk by sponsoring a cartoon contest really the best way to make a point about the discriminatory aspects within Islam? Maybe it is if you want to go to war.
Consider what Pamela Geller, the co-founder of AFDI, had to say following the incident.
“This is a war. This is war on free speech. What are we going to do? Are we going to surrender to these monsters? Two men with rifles and backpacks attacked police outside our event. A cop was shot; his injuries are not life-threatening, thank Gd. Please keep him in your prayers,” Geller wrote on her blog.
“The bomb squad has been called to the event site to investigate a backpack left at the event site,” she continued. “The war is here.”
What?! That’s not agitating for social reform! That’s beating the war drums quite stridently. All this makes me wonder if Geller has something material to gain from going to war with Islam. It’s sounds crazy, but is she a cog in the military industrial complex? I haven’t researched her enough to make a connection but it wouldn’t surprised me if one existed. As with all divisive actions and lightening rod events, sometimes it helps to stand back and ask yourself, “who is behind this and what is really going on?”
In any event, what I’m trying to convey is that the organizers of the event did not exercise sound judgment, as evidence by the wounded guard. There are many peaceful and culturally sensitive ways to bolster free speech, equal rights and freedom of conscience that are compatible with Islamic cultures. Needless to say, paying for sketches of Muhammad isn’t one of them. Sure, I’ll continue to support AFDI’s right of free speech just like I’ll support the lone open-carry advocate, but I’d just like to ask them to think more critically about the consequences of their actions. After all, lives are on the line. And the next time they disenfranchise mainstream muslims and stir up the radical element they may not get away virtually unscathed.
On another note, just so there is no confusion about me being “soft on terrorism,” I’m all for ferreting out and killing terrorists, especially those that are currently living amongst us. But baiting them with 200 civilians and cartoonists is not the optimal strategy for doing so. I think we should leave that job for the federal government and the U.S. military.
What are your thoughts on this situation?
When you open carry your modular rifle into the grocery store, wearing camo pajamas, be sure to wear an anti muslim shirt so responsible gun owners know you aren’t a terrorist, and the terrorists will know all you want is a gallon of milk and bag of sugar, but you are ready to cook their goats with 30 rds a piece if they give you a problem.
Excuse me ? When`s the last time you read any news ? Islam is an evil in the earth. Read a qur`an. See that rape,pedophilia,beatiality,lying,cheating,murder,sex slavery,slavery,are all permitted in Islam.Muhammad claimed war is deception. It`s working in the authors case. Moslems don`t like a drawing ? boo-hoo. Jesus has been mocked,thrown out. Any Christians running around chopping off the heads of blasphemers ? You`ve convinced me. I`ll copy the picture of ol Mo, & transfer it onto the tailgate of my pick up. Also the Arabic letter N. Moslems use it on Christians homes to id where Nazarenes live. Reminds me of the Star of David, & how the nazis used that. I have no tolerance for the moslem sensitivities,what-so-ever.
Frankly, I see nothing at all wrong with baiting in the radicals and then giving them little ballistic implants that will let them talk directly to their maker. Do it often enough, and all but the most idiotic among them (who would quickly be killed off) will realize that American civilians aren’t quite the “soft targets” their cowardice allows them the “courage” to attack…
Pamela Geller, where have I heard that name before? Anyway she seems to be jewish from her aversion to writing God. I am sure she would like nothing more than to see Muslims and Christians get into an all-out war against each other and murder as many of each other as we can. Is Islam backwards? You betcha. So are those who provoke attacks and skirmishes between those of other faiths.
It is absolutely proper to demonstrate your contempt for a religion that thinks it is normal to attack people who displease it. Be armed, be ready and shoot them dead till they learn that violence is not a legitimate response.
This article written by SH Blannelberry is as un-American as you can get. It is a big compromise on the free exercise of our constitutional rights. It slaps the men and women who have given the full devotion of commitment to our way of life and lost their lives. Here\’s why I make that claim. Who are any of us to tell another American how far they can go to exercise their blood-bought constitution rights. None of us have that right. Pamela Geller has a right to do what ever she wants within her legal constitutional rights including sponsoring an event so offensive as to make our stomachs curl. We may have an opinion and are free to express that opinion. and that is the point- that\’s what our fallen brothers and sisters died defending.The correct response is more speech not less. We don\’t prohibit speech because it is offensive… the American way is to present the other side of the argument. Personally, I think those two radical Muslims got what was coming to them- not because they were Muslim, but because they tried to use violence to stop free speech. If they were Americans, they had the constitutional right to organize a event with contrary viewpoints. That is freedom of speech. Do not limit nor suggest any else limits the exercise of rights because it may be offensive to others- to do so is un-American as well as cowardly.
If you allow them to silence us they have already won. Mike
YES ! ! you should !
Liberals make me sick with their giving away of our rights at every turn….
I for one,,, will NOT be giving away ANY of my rights to sick satan-w0rshipping sickos who belong to the muzzieCULT !
especially my FREE SPEECH right…
Whoever wrote this article is an idiot!! If you advocate for doing things in a “politically correct way” which you did just by writing this article then you no longer are a free man and are already a slave!! When you say “…I support everyone’s right to free speech, but there are ways to do it responsibly…” you just said you don’t support “Free Speech” and have negated your previous statement and have taken the politically correct route…and I no longer want to hear anything you have to say or care about what you have to say…you have just told me you are an elitist!!
In the last 40 years, the Muslims have killed so many of our American citizens in so many gruesome ways in so many locales that my thinking is thus: I will never open carry anywhere there are other people even if allowed by the local laws however I will enter any Mohammad drawing contest that comes along as it is a perfectly fine way of thumbing our nose at the raghead savages. And, if the opportunity should arise, we should kill all we can so as to send them to Satan!
This article was written before the Phoenix event, so we now need to add that one to the fodder.
You can do whatever you want, but you have to live with the consequences of that choice. If you want to choose to insult radical, irrational people who will then want to kill you, that’s your choice. For the idiot in Phoenix, though, that choice now affects the safety of his wife and kids. To me, that is totally irresponsible.
Not to defend these crazy, radical zealots, but I think it is reasonable to assume that they are not going to take too kindly to having their religious beliefs deliberately insulted. And that’s what Pamela Geller and Jon Ritzheimer did. I really do not respect Ritzheimer because now he is trying to sell the house and he and his family are in hiding. What a burden to be placed on your wife and children. Did he not think this out, did he not think about the security of his family? No. Was it worth the price? No. All this just to go spouting off his opinion of radical Muslims. Stupid.
Very tempted to click the unsubscribe button after reading this shallow drivel that does not take into consideration the absolute hell very many Islamists are creating in very many places and the unimaginable horror and pain they are inflicting on large numbers very real and innocent people. I am sure the 200 attendees knew what the possibilities were when attending so describing them as innocents is an outright lie, likewise the guards and police hired for security .
Rights and responsibility. The only true responsibility we have is to our fore fathers who fought bravely to make the best country in the world. The responsibility to live our lives to the fullest and most prosperous. The easy target regarding responsibility is to put up an analogy to the old yelling fire in a crouded theater.
However, we forget that the real reason this is wrong is that it truely can cause physical harm to those in the theater. Drawing crude pictures of Mohammed, Jesus, Budda, etc does not do any physical harm to anyone, period. It might offend many. But in the America I know, people could care less or care a lot but no one would think of pulling a knife to cut someones head off.
Wonder if the author saw the Paris attack that killed all those Muslim haters at Charlie Hebdo? I saw a masked Islamic terrorist stroll down the street to a wounded policeman, lying on the street, and put a bullet in his head while he begged for his life. These animals that were killed in Texas would have done exactly the same thing for exactly the same reason. That is all I need to know to say more power to Ms. Gellar and her organization. If her event will draw out potential killers, then she should have more of them. Draw them out and kill them. I would be happy to attend the next one. I have some good ideas on how to draw the MOOSLIM prophet. I think it was a bad idea to allow thousands of muslims into America. It’s like mixing oil and water. All you need do is look at the number of Christians killed by ISIS to know the two religions are NOT compatible.
The bottom line is we have laws and Gellar broke none of them. The dead killers did and paid. It was fortunate (and amazing) that a single policeman killed both terrorists with a revolver (if the reports are true). That should be the real story. That there are people that are willing to defend our constitution against all peoples that would destroy it.
why not? if you can not laugh at yourself you are stretched way to tight.
There are a number of issues here that have been jumbled. Let’s see if we can sort a few of them out.
1: Draw Mohammed. Muslims make pictures of Mohammed, but leave the face out, covering it with a veil. This said, the “Draw Mohammed” get together was at best childish and at worst a hate action. What would your response be if a “Draw Jesus” contest were held under the same circumstances? Mocking another man or woman’s religion is about as ugly as it gets, since it mocks the intensely personal and unique relationship a person has with their concept of God. I just cannot see how this can be a good thing.
2: The Anti-Muslim rally. That comes out as just about stupid in my book. How would my fellow readers feel if there were an “Anti-Christ” or “Anti-Jesus” rally in front of their local church? If the organizer of this moronic thing stays out of jail on Hate Crime charges, it will probably be due to the Islamic Center’s restraint, not any Constitutional right.
Take a look at this bandied about First Amendment: It prohibits Governmental restraint on Speech, the Press, and communication in general. It describes how a protest is to be held: Peaceably. It does not (per Chief Justice Oliver Wendell Holmes) grant the right to yell “fire” in a crowded theater. Do it and you go to jail. Why? Because each RIGHT imposes a RESPONSIBILITY on the person enjoying that RIGHT.
Does our cherished Freedom of Religion not include Islam? Does it not include Judaism? Does it not include “a religion different from the one you practice”?
I see this rally as a four-year-old’s discovery that he can say “dirty” words in public. Does he get away with it? Sadly, today, probably. When I was a child, doing something like that would get me swatted. If I did it too often, I would get a spanking.
Result, I didn’t do it. Nowadays, it seems that children of all ages think they can get away with whatever they want.
The guy who oversaw this embarrassment is an Afgan Vet? Pamela Geller had her fifteen minutes of fame by organizing the Draw Mohammed fiasco? Somebody needs their mouth washed out with soap.
One thing the old system of corporal punishment gave you was Respect. The new system seems to have failed there, too.
Welcome to the backside of the Bell Curve.
Have to disagree. She broke no laws and the would be killers did. I wonder if you watched the videos of the Charlie Hebdo massacre in Paris? If you had you would have watched as a masked terrorist calmly walk down the street, to a wounded policeman, and shoot him in the head. These terrorist would have done the very same thing for the very same reason. They were offended by a cartoon. If Americans allowed that kind of crap, no one would be safe from retaliation killings just because someone offended them. You asked would I be offended by an anti Jesus cartoon. The answer is no. I believe in people’s rights to disagree and to whatever degree they want to disagree as long s it’s not violent. That’s what the bible teaches. Turn the other check. That is not what the Koran teaches. You also must not be familiar with the Westboro Baptist Church. Tune in to one of their rallies and you will understand what tolerance means.
http://savespeech.com/
If a Muslim tells you drinking beer offends him, what will you do? If he tells you that your wife’s clothing offends him, what will you do? If he says your speech offends him what will you do?
They do not respect your rights and wish you to act as if you live in Yemen. So my response to you is that its horrid judgement to sacrifice any freedom for that gratifying PC feeling that comes out from attending Beltway cocktail parties.
And just so I am not mistaken, I believe all those lefties who so cherish flag burners and piss Christ, should be sent to Yemen now, so they can demonstrate their moderation and PC abilities.
If a Muslim tells you…
I’d ask myself “Am I getting in his face?” Then I’d ask myself, “Am I/We the only people in the room doing this?” If either answer was “No”, I’d shrug and suggest that the problem was his, not mine. Then I would continue drinking my beer and enjoying my wife’s appearance.
The world is for everybody, not just the noisy people.
While historians rot in jails because they dared question the details of the “Holocaust™,” the breathless attention given to “Freedom of Speech” to promote the agents provocateur at Hebdo and Draw Mohammed contests is so much hypocrisy… stereotypical hypocrisy.
See Matthew 6:2, 5; 15:7; 22:18; 23:13, 14, 15, 23, 25, 27, 28, 29; Mark 7:6; Luke 13:15 or follow the research leads by clicking on my screen name.
When it comes down to the choice of risking a terrorist attack or muzzling free speech to accommodate a tiny minority’s religious views, I favor free speech, every time. Free speech guarantees the rest of our freedoms.
We already have a secular religion in this country called “leftism” that does everything in its power to stifle speech it doesn’t agree with. Its acolytes try to drown out dissent by others with Internet posts and shouts of “Faux News” when the Left’s quest to control how news is reported in this country is threatened in any way.
Two observations:
– if we have people in this country who can be provoked to murder by the act of drawing a man in a turban, the problem isn’t Pamela Geller. It’s with a government whose Homeland Security Department is wasting time and money trying to prosecute Americans for wearing camouflage while white, or for defending themselves from a mugger who the President says would look like his son, if he’d had a son. This same government hasn’t really made it clear that there’s no place for ANY religiously-motivated violence in our nation, no matter how in love the President may be with the religion in question and its violent adherents.
– Pamela Geller needs to get over herself, no doubt. But she has an absolute, Constitutionally-guaranteed right to speak her piece She has an absolute right to be an incredible ass, insult a religion which proclaims its own right to enslave and murder the rest of us, and expect not to be killed for her trouble.
Perhaps Homeland Security, instead of investigating every returning veteran of the wrong color because our President doesn’t believe ALL lives matter, ought to place its massive resources into investigating the nationwide network of men who ARE on record as threatening innocent Americans’ lives. If it can spare the money from paying its own staff who maintain Web sites calling for race war and the murder of innocent Americans.
I agree with Blannelberry’s points in the article. Well written and presented. We have our rights and should defend our rights but there is no need to go out to pick a fight. Millions of Muslims are good Americans, yet something like the cartoon contest would offend them, short of violence. Personally I find the American Nazi Party to be one of the most offensive groups around. When they have one of their hate rallies, they’re trying to get a reaction out of the rest of us. Same thing the dopes who put on the cartoon contest-they were wanting a reaction and they got one. To what purpose? Do you need to schedule a hateful event like this to demonstrate our rights to free speech? I don’t think so.
Geller is a racist who’s primary goal is to start a race and religious war right here in America. Right wing racist bigots ignore the fact that there are 6 million Muslims in the U.S. almost all of which go to work every day, are often in responsible professional jobs and raise families who respect the law and often serve with distinction in the U.S. Armed Services. They have come out time after time and publically condemned religious and racist violence in America and so have European Muslims as well. Far Right Fanatics fail to realize that it is Terrorists that commit crimes not the bulk of ordinary people no matter what their religion or race happens to be. This is totally beyond the comprehension of the uneducated. I often wonder if right wing fanatics ever even bother to watch the news unless of course its Fox News and we all know what an inaccurate bunch of boobs they are as surveys done show a large majority of the time they either get it completely or partially wrong and often deliberately fail to report all of the news when it does not fit their racist agenda, especially when it comes to American Muslims.
I am particularly outraged when right wing fanatics come up to people who are not Anglo Saxon and they with their noses up in the air ask them first “how long have your ancestors been in this Country” as if the idiots think that patriotism is synonymous with length of time in the country. They also seem to think that if you are not Anglo Saxon you can never be 100 per cent American either and that Christianity should be made a State required Religion which of course is completely contrary to the Constitution which requires separation of Church and State which by the way makes “Under God” in the Pledge of Allegiance completely unconstitutional and it was only added in relatively recent times to boot. With attitudes like this there can never be peace in the world. Of course Hitler would have wanted it this way.
Where is the outrage when Christian fanatics attack and murder innocent Americans while they are peacefully attending a non- Christian Church right here in America as happened last summer. Right wing fanaticism is not confined to any particular faith or race as it exists amongst all right wing fanatics. Thankfully the bulk of people which includes Muslims, Christians, Jews, Buddhist’s etc. do not promote racial and religious hate and bigotry and narrow mindedness. Is it not rather ironic that people who are products of higher education are taught to respect other races and religions or spread hatred and those that are not products of higher education are the ones that more often than not that keep alive Hitler’s racist hate philosophy and right wing fanaticism.
Your comments regarding “right-wing fanatics” ignore the fact that those “right-wing fanatics” you obsess upon haven’t killed anyone lately.
The people who can’t stand even the slight disrespect implied by drawing pictures of their Prophet and lash out in murderous violence – who aren’t condemned by the current President, whose Department of Homeland Security instead issued a report on that largely imaginary “right-wing fanatic” threat you go on about, and whose Attorney General sent a criminal informant to try and frame a group of homespun weekend warriors for “making war on the United States of America” – those are the ones who pose a real threat to society.
http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/index.html#Attacks
Now let’s see your list of attacks by religious fanatics other than Muslims. To be fair, constrain your list to the last 30 days (as the linked list is so limited).
The time for defiance is when under threat. Any other time, and it’s not defiance, it’s just self-absorption. If, at this time of Muslim extremist threats to our liberties, we do not respond, demonstrate, and defy, we acquiesce. Not acceptable. Geller was called by one media commentator a “pyromaniac.” Did she play with matches? Yes, she did. But to light an actual fire, you need fuel that will burn. Geller demonstrated without doubt that fuel exists here among us. And it’s ready to burn us down if we let it. Radical Islam, if not resisted (in every way), will defeat us without a fight. If there is a time to stand on our rights and to exercise them in defiance of a threat, the time is now. We didn’t make this so, radical Islamists did.
So after carefully reading all this, let me see if I have this right. A few of you out there think that two radical Muslims intent on murdering all the “Bad Americans” they can, show up with their weapons firing. Then this somehow turns into the fault of the victims who were having a drawing contest? Really dudes? America has been turned upside down by this over-the-top politically correct thinking and I for one, don’t understand how this twisted form of thinking can even develop. Liberalism dripping out of every pore of the body is killing America as we’ve known it for 200 years. The poor murdering radical Muslims were somehow transformed into the innocent victims because they plotted, planned, drove to Dallas, and tried to kill Americans for drawing cartoons. Some of you really need to take off your girlie panties and man-up to reality. They were planning MURDER. No one can bait someone into driving 1000 miles, arming themselves, planning murder, etc etc. It was already in them and this was simply the opportunity they chose to show themselves.
I think he mentioned they are here to attack us on their time.if we can cause them to react instead of waiting for their action we can stop them more effectively.
The very fact that we can have his conversation on line separates us from over 90% of the worlds population.
Rights do not mean much if you have to worry about who you might offend.
+1
Sadly, people forget Right and Responsibility are two sides of the same coin. They forget (if they ever knew) that one must respect others before one is worth respecting oneself.
Responsibility. Respect. Two words that are no longer in the lexicon of most people. They learned “Want” as a small child and stopped there, well before learning “Earn”.
If our Nation falls, it will be because WE pulled the foundations out from under it.
Welcome to the downside of the Bell Curve.
I often wonder what would have happened if Muslims had held a cartoon session depicting Christ in less than sanctimonious ways. You can bet that right wing Christian fanatics would have done exactly the same thing. One only has go to right wing fanatic Christian web sites to see the extreme hate and loathing of everyone who is not Anglo Saxon White, Christian and Protestant and Conservative (White Eastern Mediterranean or White Eastern European, Catholics, Jews, Liberals etc. do not count), as they are considered inferior grade Americans and do not even mention loyal American Muslims that have served in the U.S. Armed Forces and later held profession jobs and raised law abiding families. They too are considered inferior grade Americans. The hypocrisy of many far right wing White fanatics is truly appalling as it mirrors Adolf Hitler’s racist ideology and many right wingers unabashedly admire him and admit it.
You’re probably too young to remember a piece of “art” called “Piss Christ.” It consisted of a clear water glass full of urine, into which a crucifix was placed.
Our own Federal Government, acting through the National Endowment for the Arts, took tax money from every American, many of whom have immense reverence for the Judean rabbi whose execution for his claim to be the Son of God depicted on that crucifix, and gave it to the grifter who urinated into a glass and profaned the ultimate symbol of Christianity.
Your own obsession on “far right wing White fanatics” reveals you to be an ignorant bigot. Please consider crossing a busy intersection against traffic, next time you get the chance.
They might be complaining but you don’e see them out killing like the cult members of the religion of death do at the slightest offense. There is no such thing as a loyal American muslim, they are only loyal to thier imams and koran.
I think he mentioned they are here to attack us on their time.if we can cause them to react instead of waiting for their action we can stop them more effectively.
I agree with the author of his article on everything except the really “far out” idea that Geller was maybe linked to the military industrial complex. Lets face facts Geller is Jewish and as everyone knows the Jewish people and the Arabs have been going at it for a millennium and there are always extremists on both sides of the fence throwing hate and mud at each other and Geller rates this at the top of the list.
One cannot yell fire in a movie theater just to exercise their freedom of speech and Geller was deliberately trying to start a fight and kill Muslims and the demented woman got exactly what she wanted which was a shoot out.
Is it not sad that Atheists and Agnostics are often the very first to promote toleration of the worlds various religions and races of people while often it is the far right religious extremists of all faiths that are always seem to be promoting racial and religious hate and violence against each other. If you log on to right wing fanatic web sites whether they be Middle East or American Christian you will be appalled at the hate and venom expressed there towards other races and religions. I often get the feeling that we as a world society have not progressed one iota beyond Hitler’s hateful rhetoric of the 1930’s which led to gas chambers for everyone who did not think like he did or belong to the right religion or race of people.
“One cannot yell fire in a movie theater just to exercise their freedom of speech”. This is the straw man all who oppose whatever freedom of speech they are looking to suppress use.
When you yell “fire” in a crowded theatre all who are there have no choice as they are already there. When you conduct a “cartoon contest” in a private venue you are NOT yelling “Fire” in a crowded theatre. Those that might be offended don’t have to attend and therefore don’t have to be offended. Just as those who found fault with the crucifix in a bottle of uring, or feces covered painting of the Virgin Mary didn’t have to attend the showing. Most of the complaints about those presentations were about government (taxpayer) funds being used to support the “art” not the subject matter for it’s sake. In any case I don’t recall anyone storming these museums or art galleries to KILL those artists or the people there to view their presentations. That’s a total non-starter for a protest method.
What’s really rich is you self-righteously complaining about bigotry by “right wing fanatics” and saying “we as a world society have not progressed one iota beyond Hitler’s hateful rhetoric of the 1930’s” on one hand, and on the other hand saying ” Lets face facts Geller is Jewish and as everyone knows the Jewish people and the Arabs have been going at it for a millennium and there are always extremists on both sides of the fence throwing hate and mud at each other and Geller rates this at the top of the list.”
I don’t care for Pamela Geller’s religion-baiting tactics, but she’s got an absolute right under our laws to so what she’s doing. NO ONE has the right to tell her to stop, or to threaten her life, or take her life for exercising her Constitutional right.
Pamela Geller hasn’t told you to stop making statements like “Lets face facts Geller is Jewish and as everyone knows the Jewish people and the Arabs have been going at it for a millennium and there are always extremists on both sides of the fence throwing hate and mud at each other and Geller rates this at the top of the list.” Sounds like bigotry to me.
Way to go. Pam !!
So what the author is saying is that we should not do anything to upset Muslims because they might fly into a justified rage and hurt you. How has that worked for other countries? Like say Israel, the Phillipines, France, Nigeria, Egypt, Syria, Iraq, Iran, Saudi Arabia, Libya, Yemen, Lebanon, Kuwait, Afghanistan, the US-remember 911, and on and on. It seems like eventually everything you do offends them, including being alive.
Bowing to threats is cowardice. As far as I can see you are making excuses for lacking the courage to stand up to extortion.
If the federal government (through the National Endowment for the Arts) is willing to subsidize pictures of a cross in a glass of urine, or Mary covered in feces, or photos of little boys in erotic poses so that “our” sensibilities can be “expanded” as well as offended, then drawing Muhammed as a method to show radical (or any other) Muslims that we support our freedoms is not not just a good thing, it is a necessary thing. So should we have Muhammed cartoon contests? Damn right we should.
Geller is about one thing, it isn’t “free speech”. It is about making Geller rich. Her loyalty is not to the United States.
These cartoons are just the same as flag burning. If any thing, they are a little worse since they are designed solely to inflame emotions and to pick fights. Islam should be fought with the truth, not some shrieking harpie trying to enrich herself.
I wonder how many of the supporters of Geller would advocate for government violence against a group sponsoring a “Deny the Holocaust” cartoon contest?
We may not like it if you burn the US flag, put a cross in jar of urine, or bash traditional American values, but we won;t kill you for doing so. If they don’t like the way things are here they can and should go back to whatever shitholestan they came from.
If you call for a law banning flag burning, then you are advocating violence against flag burners. All laws are based on the principle of “Do what I say or I will send armed thugs to kill you.”
A sane immigration policy would end all threat from the “Muslims”.
I did not mention Christians, the question I asked was “Would Geller’s supporters call for government violence against people hosting a Deny the Holocaust contest?” You know like how most of Europe puts people in jail for questioning any aspect of the story. I know attacking Christians is approved of by the major media, just like attacking Muslims is.
Government violence is more dangerous than any “Muslim” threat, especially to Americans.
Ain’t it great to be an America? Where else can you make money off of stopping Islamo-nazis?
More like “getting rich by selling out the United States to the interests of an alien culture on the other side of the world.”
Gee, sound just like wait for it………………>>>>>>>>>>>>>THE CLINTONS<<<<<<<<<<<<<
Any good words for them? Draw a beard on Hillary and she could look like old MO!
Are you kidding me? This sounds like something written by Bill O’Reilly or Juan Williams or any other dozen liberal, hide in the corner, don’t stir up the behive, types.
Look, This country has a constitution which in addition to protecting religious freedom, also protects free speech. No one, not the government, not Democrats, not Republicans, not Chrisitans, not Jews and certainly not Muslim fanatics have the right to claim an exception because of their sensibilities. It’s offensive speech to some which is most in need of protection because some speech is going to be offensive to somebody.
The majority in this country is fed up with constantly aggrieved crowd crowing about their sensibilities and how this or that offends them. Our universities have already, due to the majority liberal PC crowd that run them, shut down anything that smacks of offense to someone else. It’s time for those of us who actually like the country the way it was founded, respect the rule of law, and adhere to the constructionist principles of the constitution fight back. Pam Geller is in the forefront of that fight. Kudos to her for taking on the increasing vocal Muslim minority in this country and exposing them for what they are. Hypocritical (it’s OK to trash Christians and Jews), domineering (do it my way or I’ll kill you), bigots. The more of these events that take place in America, because that’s where you live Muslims, the better. Don’t like what’s being said go back to your 12th century countries and enjoy.
Geller is a racist who’s primary goal is to start a race and religious war right here in America. Right wing racist bigots ignore the fact that there are 6 million Muslims in the U.S. almost all of which go to work every day, are often in responsible professional jobs and raise families who respect the law and often serve with distinction in the U.S. Armed Services. They have come out time after time and publically condemned religious and racist violence in America. I often wonder if right wing fanatics ever even bother to watch the news unless of course its Fox News and we all know what an inaccurate bunch of boobs they are as surveys done show a large majority of the time they either get it completely or partially wrong and often deliberately fail to report all of the news when it does not fit there racist agenda, especially when it comes to American Muslims.
I am particularly outraged when right wing fanatics come up to people who are not Anglo Saxon and they with their noses up in the air ask them first “how long have your ancestors been in this Country” as if the idiots think that patriotism is synonymous with length of time in the country. They also seem to think that if you are not Anglo Saxon you can never be 100 per cent American either and that Christianity should be made a State required Religion which of course is completely contrary to the Constitution which requires separation of Church and State which by the way makes “Under God” in the Pledge of Allegiance completely unconstitutional and it was only added in relatively recent times to boot. With attitudes like this there can never be peace in the world. Of course Hitler would have wanted it this way.
Where is the outrage when Christian fanatics attack and murder innocent Americans while they are peacefully attending a non- Christian Church right here in America as happened last summer. Right wing fanaticism is not confined to any particular faith or race as it exists amongst all right wing fanatics. Thankfully the bulk of people which includes Muslims, Christians, Jews, Buddhist’s etc. do not promote racial and religious hate and bigotry and narrow mindedness. Is it not rather ironic that people who are products of higher education are taught to respect other races and religions or spread hatred and those that are not products of higher education are the ones that more often than not that keep alive Hitler’s racist hate philosophy and right wing fanaticism.
Right Wing Fanatics should also realize it is not unpatriotic to criticize America if the intention is to improve it. No Country is perfect and to pretend it is and condemn people who are trying to change a Country for the better is hypocrisy and ignorance at its zenith.
Always enlightening to hear from one of our recent immigrants who embraces the American way. Such tolerance combined with outstanding intelligence demonstrated by your post indicates why cultural diversity is demanded by the Obamas and Clintons and like thinking people.
these seem to me to be the comments of well dis-informed communist (at least a socialist type) dumb enough to call O’Reilly a ‘Liberal’. FOX and OANN are the only network news station that I feel can report relatively honest material. And why we even allow ‘AL Q’ to spin here free speech or not beyond me. Petru please save up for a one-way ticket home, it doesn’t seem you’re happy here with our style of freedom.
Yes you should. You must, and you are surrendering if you don’t. These followers of the false prophet are offended by everything. The “religion of peace”, is in fact the religion of death. They wantonly and savagely will kill anyone who doesn’t believe exactly the same way they do, including other muslim sects. If you offend them in any way the penalty is death. We cannot and will not tolerate such behavior in the US. The truth is, there is no radical islam. There is only islam. We are going to lose because we refuse to believe this is a religious war. They have mostly taken over Asia, Africa, and the mideast. They have control of a significant part of the old Soviet Union and a strong foothold in Europe, particularly France and Spain. They are not going to give up until islam rules the world and by the time our “leaders” admit what is staring them in the face it will be too late.
Blannelberry is right in that people should not offend just because they can.
However, it is the Muslims who bomb, behead, shoot and kill unarmed and armed “Unbelievers” or “Apostates” (that’s a “muslim” of another sect, BTW).
And then, rather than acknowledge that Islam has a certain anger management problem, Muslims tell us that we hadn’t better violate their Muslim laws by doing things like drawing a cartoon of their prophet, an acknowledged pedophile, warlord and mass murderer, in the text of his own “holy” Koran.
Understand, that this prohibition of depicting Mo isn’t the only thing that “offends” Muslims.
Islam must never be criticized, according to the Koran. Guess what that leads to.
How’d you like the NSA pinging you for an e-mail or phone call in which you expressed a disparaging remark about a Muslim candidate for Congress?
Think it can’t happen? Really?
Where’s the Muslim fatwa forbidding violent jihad?
Where’s the Muslim “outreach” turning over its own criminals to law enforcement?
Why is every Muslim organization playing the victim card when it’s Islam that has the blood on its hands?
Sorry!
I am totally with Pamela Geller on this one.
This is a war. It has been a war for 1,400 years and the only reason it’s going active, again, is because the West is Weak and the Muslims can win. which the Koran also prescribes : fight only when you can win, that is.
It’s as simple as that.
And no, we’re not going back to the ME. IS will fester just like the old USSR.
The war, today, is to keep our civil liberties in spite of failed gov’t policy, and that is AFDI is doing.
Oh please…”offending gazillions of muslims”. Sorry, but it’s not a very small group of muslims who are terrorists (if you support what terrorists do, you’re also a terrorist). Millions of muslims are terrorists, in action and support. First, you show you’re a dhimmi by referring to mohamed as “prophet”…he was a child molestor and evil thug, nothing good or holy there. Modern islam tortures children, destroys churches, kills Christians while their fellow muslims cheer. muslims were cheering when the WTC fell and Americans died…they were giving out candy to the children in celebration.
Sorry, don’t care about muslim sensitivities, they gang rape white children (England/Australia) in packs because the girls dare to wear shorts. They aren’t worried about the civilized worlds sensitivities and yet demand we worry about theirs. Not going to happen. An evil group.
Look the crazy’s are out there waiting for there instructions. By pissing them off we bring them out into the open and we can plan for it.
“Look the crazies* are out there waiting for their* instructions.”
So who are the crazies? I find there are a lot of people out there who are crazy in my mind. Should we hold anti-gay, anti-religion, anti-gun or anti-homosexual contests and rallies to see who we can bait and kill?
Why is pissing someone off to such an extreme that they feel like they have to do something an answer?
The only ones doing the killing when offended are the members of the so called religion of peace. More bait & shoots are needed.
Timothy McVeigh was baited by anti-gun laws. I’m pretty sure religion wasn’t a motivation in his killing of US Citizens.
Is there anything you are so passionate about that if someone pushed you enough you would act violently?
Yes…MY right to Self defense, and MY right to Free speech…among others! Seems to me that when someone from the “religion of peace” threatens to destroy me or mine for exercising my God given rights (yes…they are!), THEY are the aggressors and should be dealt with accordingly! Even Christ told one of his disciples: “…he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.” Luke 22:36. As you can see, even Christ believed and preached the virtues of having arms for the purpose of self defense.
The first amendment protects all speech especially speech we disagree with and I am totally on board with the saying, “I don’t agree with what you are saying but I will defend to the death your right to say it”. But I am at a loss when people like you justify their point of view by exclaiming “why don’t we also yank on the chain of others, “anti-gay, anti-religion, anti-gun or anti-homosexual”? The answer is so simple, I am in awe you don’t see it. None of the aforementioned extremist groups have threatened anyone with death for exercising their first amendment rights. Muslims extremists have done so, over and over for a very long time. Frankly I am surprised it took this long to organize events like the Muhammad cartoon contest and I am all in where that is concerned.
The point I was trying to make was that in my opinion some people can be pushed on a subject they feel so passionate about that they will take violent actions. Is it right? Heck no. It’s not just Muslims or a person like Timothy McVeigh who will act out violently and baiting a person to see if they will take the bait is not the answer.
I think he mentioned they are here to attack us on their time.if we can cause them to react instead of waiting for their action we can stop them more effectively.
” I think we should leave that job for the federal government and the U.S. military. ”
You must have your head shoved up your own ass so far you will never risk sun-burning your nose….you want to count on the Federal Govt. headed up by Att.Gen. Lorretta Lynch and that most heroic “Commander in Chief” Barack Hussein Obongoloid????…..Get a clue fool.
When the media shows a Mohammed cartoon, next to the jar of urine with the crucifix, then the country will survive. The media still accuses the victim for the murder attempt. The blame is still placed on the cartoon drawers. Look at the Phoenix protest. I would not go unarmed, but the wearing of arms brought out all the Bloomberg liberals to protest with the Muslims in the name of no hate/ peace/ coexist/world love…..
It is always necessary to show up an AntiChrist up for what he is. I use this in the ancient Greek sense not only of being opposed, but of replacing, or attempting to replace, what you are anti. There are many AntiChrists, as predicted. Mohammed is only one of them, not the most distinguished or talented. We can only judge him by the actions of his adherents. As the ones who come to our attention are all bat shit crazy, it is safe to assume that Mohammed was as well, along with anyone placing their future in him. I do not understand the West’s acceptance of Muslim immigrants, nor our kowtowing to their digusting and degraded leadership in the middle East. If they didn’t have oil, they would be irrelevant. Pity our leaders are so beholden to them.
Your closing comment was:
“On another note, just so there is no confusion about me being “soft on terrorism,” I’m all for ferreting out and killing terrorists, especially those that are currently living amongst us. But baiting them with 200 civilians and cartoonists is not the optimal strategy for doing so. I think we should leave that job for the federal government and the U.S. military.
What are your thoughts on this situation?”
My response is WRONG!!!!!!!!
If someone, anyone, even a Muslim ASKS, you to please not draw Muhammad because it is uncomfortable and causes him distress, then by all means, along the lines of good manners and consideration, sure, I wont do that if it offends you.
BUT!!!! Tell me if I draw Muhammad, you will kill me? You better believe I can’t draw one fast enough and shove it in your face. And try to kill me? I will exercise all available to me including my second amendment rights to make sure the only one dieing for Islam is the Muslim who is trying to trample my freedoms.
They have no consideration or good manners about Christianity or any other religion…so why would they be given any? to our own detriment even??? That makes sense in NO religion. We have to accommodate them, but they don’t have to accommodate anyone else? Last time I checked, islam is the only religion that advocates violence against those that don’t convert. So one could make the argument that killing muslims is an act of self defense…???? I wouldn’t say that at all. But if you advocate violence, such as islam does, then violence is likely what you will reap. That’s….uh, Karma? or maybe self-defense.
ABSOLUTELY!!! Its about time these radical muslims were indoctrinated into the way of the FREE world…….OH! wait…that’s right….they don’t conform to our ways….they kill us if we don’t conform to theirs…..silly me! How could I have forgotten that?
I don’t recall anyone attacking the art exhibit of a crucifix in a jar of urine…..hmmmm???!!! But who am I as a Christian to expect things to be equal…..that’s just plain crazy talk!
You say you are a Christian. Have you read the words of Jesus that say : “Therefore all things whatsoever ye would that men should do to you, do ye even so to them: for this is the law and the prophets.”?
If you are supporting these contests, you must want others to attack your faith as well.
Oh my gosh, Chris, like there isn’t an ongoing war against Christianity already??? Have you lost your mind? Or have you simply chosen not to notice as Muslim barbarians saw the heads off of Christians just because they’re Christian? My faith has been under attack for as long as I can remember and I say that Christianity can survive these travails. But what about a “faith” (read: cult) that is so threatened by a freakin’ cartoon?
I support with all my fiber these contests, for the true intent is to demonstrate just how barbaric the “religion of piece” (misspell intended) is. Lure the animals into the open, force them to do what is in their nature and let their apologists try to explain away their viciousness. Sounds good to me.
And for one who presumes to preach to us, isn’t Christianity at least a little bit about Truth?
Yes more of these in every city in America. We need to bring out those among us that would like to find a reason to attack. Let’s go ahead and give them a reason now before they have children and populate America with hatered like other cultures have.
If we took out everyone who wanted to attack then there wouldn’t be anyone left, just think of all those hate groups from every religion, race and culture. just look at all the people hating law enforcement now
So, since there are so many different “groups” who want to attack us “nothing” should be done? I respect your opinion and “yes” there are a number of different groups, countries, and etc… who hate us……… BUT, the so called “Radicals” of the religion of peace(?) are MORE than just a “group”. They are a large(and still growing), organized world wide armed force with the clear intent to rule the world. Millions of Americans KNOW this and have wanted the spreading evil cancer stopped! It has been like screaming for help in a bottle whereas our government does not hear us. They are at WAR with us and have been for a LONG time!
Blaming the conference for tee violence is blaming women for being raped.
If enough of these events were held, we’d eventually be free of the threat of this political violence. I say we need more of them. That way, jihadists can go die.
Sadly i do agree fully with your point. I am sad because it has come to this, but it is time to stand up and protect our rights while we still have them.
Our forefathers (including my relatives) died for every one of our freedoms, and to me the 1st Amendment is just as important as the Second!
If we don’t soon tone down the PC bull that does nothing but undermine our 1st A Rights and make us look like wimps the country will not make it. I bet the next time a couple extremest decided to attack a crowd on American soil they won’t do it in Texas.
Texas…smartest state in this country…..
The purpose of the contest was to openly defy an ideology that seeks to forcibly convert everyone or kill those who won’t (its in the Koran 8:12 is just one of these). Bear in mind that not even the Church of Satan has commands like those in the Koran. The contest was an act of defiance and a revelation of how these people are not peaceful and tolerant, but are nothing more than savages possessing dark ages mentalities coupled with modern technology (scary). One last word on defiance; just because our ancestors could have mustered on Lexington Green, 19 April 1775, should they have?
Just because they can have a muslim march in the UK insulting the Police,and English subjects,should you?
First, I hate when people burn or trample Old Glory as the current laws allow. If their distaine for the Flag, what it represents and all that have shed blood defending it is so great: they need to renounce their citizenship and get the hell out of the U.S.A.! But they won’t. Are these Flag burners any different then the Muhammad drawing contest prmoters and contestants? NO, there just pushing different buttons.
Second, I find the several levels of security at the Event very interesting. P. Geller had her own body guards, there was event security, plus Police positioned outside AND a ready SWAT Team positioned behind the building. Was this just a precaution or was the event bait to see what would be drawn out to seek vengeance on the infidels? I’ve got no problem with using bait but even cartoon drawing sheep are entitled to know why their tied to the stake.
Final questions. Did the Event screen for weapons and not allow anyone with a CWP in? Was this to protect Geller or a Facility rule? Geller left the building before the bag guys arived. Coincidence or planned?