The Fostech Echo goes all the way up to three. (Shown here at two.)
Make it Echo
Fostech Outdoors, makers of the Origin-12 series of semi-automatic shotguns and Bumpski bump-fire stock for AKs, recently received ATF approval to manufacture a new drop-in rapid-fire trigger designed for AR-15-pattern rifles. It’s a trigger that fires on the initial pull and then again on the reset!
Thanks to a strict reading of the law, these triggers aren’t considered select-fire or machine gun parts because they still only fire one shot with each pull of the trigger, only dropping the hammer the second time when the trigger is released.
Patent-holder Peter Hawbaker developed the trigger the help of Fostech and it’s coming to the AR market soon — they’re calling it The Echo. It uses all three selector positions for safe, semi-auto and rapid-fire modes. Flip the safety past the semi-auto position to the third position, and you’ll quickly discover why it’s named the Echo when you get an automatic follow up shot.
It’s not the first of it’s kind; rapid-fire triggers that fire on release have been around for a while for ARs and Ruger Mini rifles. But the Echo, as a true drop-in trigger, is a simple install for a fun rifle or pistol upgrade — and it’s sold separately. Other rapid fire triggers, like Franklin Armory’s Binary Firing System, are only offered with complete firearms.
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The kit includes a rapid-fire trigger pack and 3-position selector.
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Check the Fostech website or call for availability.
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In the safe position the trigger will not fire, as per usual. In the semi-automatic position the trigger fires only round when the trigger is pulled, which is also per usual. In the third position, or “Echo Mode,” the gun will fire once when the trigger is pulled and then a second when the trigger is released.
The controlled pair means fast and easy easy follow-up shots. Before anyone panics, the Echo has been designed with a safety that disables the follow up shot in case the shooter pulls the trigger for the first shot and does not want the second shot to fire. To prevent the follow-up shot move the selector to the semi-automatic or safe position and the second round will not fire when the trigger is released.
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Installed it looks like any other AR trigger.
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For now the model is a right-handed design.
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Optimized for tactical and competition shooters, the trigger has a light pull in the 3.5- to 4-pound range. Each kit includes a trigger pack and a three-position safety selector switch that has to be installed for the whole system to work.
The first stage in manufacturing is already under way, and Fostech expects that the first batch will be available in April this year with the full release scheduled for May. The MSRP is set at $479 — cue the complaining — although it’s not especially out of line with other rapid-fire trigger systems. The next steps for Fostech will be toward the AK platform and more.
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Read more at Fostech Outdoors: https://fostechoutdoors.com/
The Franklin Armory “Echo II” is far superior to this! I have both & Fostech trigger pull & reset really sucks! Spend you $ on one that really works!
Franklin does not make echo2…..
I did it with the AK\’s in 1996-97 and didn\’t get my patent until 2005. It\’s a full on utility patent #6,966,138. I made the little attachments out of .031 sheet metal and slid them right on to the trigger with the tab under the pivot-able foot of the safety sear in order to increase the gap between the hammer engaging notch of the trigger sear and the engaging notch of the safety sear (BECAUSE FILING IS ILLEGAL!!). You could also put a small spot weld on the underneath side of the foot for a more permanent application. I liked the attachment better… ez on , ez off , no disassembly required with practice. Just make it where the hammer passes through the increased gap and onward to the bolts\’ firing pin upon release of the trigger. I was going to sell the attachments for $20 each but the cost of the product liability insurance I needed was over my head. I\’m just a blue-collar machinist. Friends tell me AR\’s are similar? ATF said …\”one projectile upon pull and one projectile upon release was not Class-III NFA (at that time). I am glad to see my idea is not going to waste. Your welcome! 🙂
I did it with the AK’s in 1996-97 and didn’t get my patent until 2005. It’s a full on utility patent #6,966,138. I made the little attachments out of .031 sheet metal and slid them right on to the trigger with the tab under the pivot-able foot of the safety sear in order to increase the gap between the hammer engaging notch of the trigger sear and the engaging notch of the safety sear (BECAUSE FILING IS ILLEGAL!!). You could also put a small spot weld on the underneath side of the foot for a more permanent application. I liked the attachment better… ez on , ez off , no disassembly required with practice. Just make it where the hammer passes through the increased gap and onward to the bolts’ firing pin upon release of the trigger. I was going to sell the attachments for $20 each but the cost of the product liability insurance I needed was over my head. I’m just a blue-collar machinist. Friends tell me AR’s are similar? ATF said …”one projectile upon pull and one projectile upon release was not Class-III NFA” (at that time). I am glad to see my idea is not going to waste. Your welcome! 🙂
Fostech should offer an upgrade with a STEEL safety selector lever instead of the PLASTIC – POLYMER lever.
I would pay for an upgrade with a STEEL safety selector lever instead of the PLASTIC lever for the Gen2 model. I would have given it my highest recommendation but the plastic safety lever could break if I happen to drop my rifle in a rocky area or if I flip the switch too hard during a stressful situation. And you couldn’t make an heirloom rifle out of it because after 20+ years it will be too brittle to handle hard use. Until they offer an ALL METAL version that is durable, I would say this is only good as a very expensive range toy. And if another company comes out with their version of a sturdy all STEEL binary trigger that runs just as good as this one, I will go with their brand. After reading some of the other reviews out there on the internet, I see that there are many others who agree about the cheap feel to the flimsy plastic safety selector lever. Hopefully, Fostech will add this STEEL upgrade soon to their catalog and offer it to their customers to keep them HAPPY. I will reserve to recommend this product after FOSTECH makes these strengthening improvements to its binary trigger. If you agree with me, let Fostech know about this. They really do need to make this more durable.
I like being able to up the performance of a rifle by the flip of a switch. Might come in handy making home invaders think a platoon has them surrounded, etc. Upstart price is high but should drop over time., it’s thumbs up here.
I’m hearing a lot of chatter on here that sounds a lot like a bunch of liberals trying to convince themselves that they know something . Since when did Obama ever walk on eggshells when guns were concerned ? He has taken every opportunity to relieve folks of their guns . Donald Trump is our president now . He carries concealed himself so I doubt he is the boogie man that will take anyones guns . And why beat a dead horse ? If the ATF approves something then why split hairs . If I had 500.00 dollars I would like to try one of these . It would be another tool for my toolbox.
I think they should follow the Constitution Hhey have already violated our rights under the 1986 Gun Controll Act..Rule in favor of the Constitution!,the People”
Oh, what a dilemna …. buy this trigger or buy a suppressor? This trigger would get to me sooner (as the suppressor will take almost a year with all the paperwork and BATF “approval”).
I agree with previous posts, we have allowed our 2nd Amendment rights to be eroded over time, and this is a small way to re-gain some of those rights. IF you don’t want to purchase this trigger or think it is TOO expensive, then don’t…but don’t disparage or trample other gun owner’s rights by implying it has no merit. Our 2nd Amendment rights are not about hunting or competition shooting, it is ALL about our individual rights as citizens of these United States to defend ourselves, our families and our properties as, WE the People, see fit, not the Federal government. Beyond the “mall ninja”/”tacticool” comments, there may be a day when these AR’s will be grabbed at a moment’s notice by their owners to defend other citizen’s rights against certain Federal agencies that now model themselves as more para-military than they need to be, or are Constitutionally intended.
Yes, I do enjoy the rails, flat-top upper, laser, bi-pod, forward assist, adjustable magpul stock as well as the 30-60 round magazines, but I’m not being “tacticool” just because I am not currently law enforcement or active military. I did my time ( 20 years on and off), yet I still train responsibly (and store my weapons securely and safely), so I don’t have to explain or defend my rights to own whatever AR I choose to own/carry. Thank you Fostech, Franklin Arms, SlideFire and BumpFire Systems for your efforts to assist in restoring American’s rights to bear arms as the Founding Fathers originally intended. I just hope would-be criminals/terrorists/psychos don’t acquire these parts to use in the future for armed robberies or mass shootings.
well it is exspensive but if you want an have the money it is a good thing I want one to but will have to wait till I can come up with the money just bout a44 an do agree with you should not take our rights away what is good for one does not mean it is good for every one so the ones that want an gets one the others should not tell us what we should do
No way in hell should a trigger cost as much as a full AR. $500 for a trigger, sporting or not, this is extortionate as hell. S**t I can get five chinese bumpfires for the price of one of these…lol.
I just picked up aTrijicon MRO for a cost of $460.00. The Echo trigger for a little more cash, it’s not too much at $479.00.
I’ll bet you the price of a fostech groupings are multiple MOA better with binary than bumpstock.
It’s worth the $.
Take a look at the Fostech Page!
Looks like they started shipping units Dec 1, 2016.
Check also the Page of the ATF acceptance letter!
The time for waiting is getting shorter!
You can do the same thing with a Mini-14, just a lot cheaper. HOWEVER, I like the fact that it is offered for the AR15. And, yes, I want one of these or perhaps the FA Binary trigger system. The antis already hate AR15’s. They would ban them in a heartbeat if we let them. As far as I’m concerned, anything that makes an AR15 operate like the M16 it was intended to be and is made available for civilians, is a GREAT THING!
We got completely ripped-off by the ’86 Machine Gun Ban. Our rights were stolen right out from under us. As far as I’m concerned, this is a “technological payback” for the idiots who think they have some right to prohibit law abiding citizens from owning and using rapid fire rifles. This device is neither dangerous nor useless. No more dangerous than a gun spitting spinning lead at 2000 fps! An AR15 is a combat rifle. It was never meant for hunting, shooting coyotes, 3-gun competitions or other B.S. It was designed for killing/stopping man-animals in combat. And, to that end, when firing from a weapon with 30-60 round capacity, FASTER IS BETTER!!!
Some day someone might actually invent a device that permits semi-auto rifles to be fired at rates that far exceed full-auto rifles. While, I don’t see how this is possible, if someone actually figures it out then I’m buying one of those too.
actually it was meant to injure them rather then kill… which makes it funny it’s the gun the gun grabbers go after. the one gun designed not to kill.
Excuse me, a weapon designed to not take life? Thats an oxymoron if I’ve ever heard one. Weapons are tools of killing (that not necessarily being a bad thing) to think anything less is to try and kid ourselves to feel better about owning one. Weapons aren’t good, violence is worse, but both of those things are not going anywhere so you’d better learn to defend yourself with what is available because when the shit goes down its going to take the law 10-15 to get there.
Apparently you don’t know the history of the M-16/AR-15 (5.56mm). There were two schools of thought that the US Army had on adopting this assault weapon and abandoning the Army/Marine Corps battle rifle the M-14 (7.62mm). First was to apply American values on other cultures. If you shoot and wound a warrior you will tie up two or more warriors to assist their wounded Comrade. The second was the weight issue of the rounds.
Will this only work with AR15 or any other guns…like hand guns?
Franklin Armory’s BFS trigger is cheaper and is now available as the trigger system itself without having to purchase the entire lower.
The Franklin unit can be outrun if you’re fast enough with your trigger finger. Check out MACs YouTube video on it. The hammer will follow the bolt home.
If you do not like it then you don not have to buy it.
I like the idea of the double tap trigger, it may be over the top for some novice shooters but there is a place for this in experienced shooters hands. Law enforcement, military, ect. Judd, and the Fostech team are neighbors of mine, they are very professional in their procedures involving testing. They are not fly by night ammo junkies, I know Judd is professional in his approach to launching this trigger, they practice research and development in a safe and controlled manner with safely as their priority. Now the nay sayers are welcome to their comments as anyone else. Do I need a trigger like this, no. Do I want a trigger like this, Hell yes! Keep up the good work. I am sure the soldiers feel any thing that helps them not die is a good thing.
IMO, this is a useless and potentially dangerous trigger system outside of possible competition and military uses. Even there it will require users dedicated enough to spend the necessary retraining/training time. Some will buy it though just so they can show how fast they can miss twice.
Actually a very good use for is is the prepared home invader wearing body armor. Running two rounds into almost the same spot has a greater chance of penetration then a single shot or spattering of shots.
I would like to see a test
10 rounds, 5 targets.
1st test; in simiauto
2 rounds in the chest, 2 in the head. Move to the second target and repeat. Go to the 3rd, 4th and 5th
All targets timed, targets 1 thru5 averaged and accuracy
2nd test :
All the same but the “echo” in gaged .
I wonder what if any difference it may make?
Why do we have to degrade to superfluous tricks for range fun?
It’s actually very practical when used correctly.
Useless and potentially dangerous. For $500 a pop, fortunately they won’t sell too many of them.
How Is it dangerous?
I wish they wouldn’t sell too many of them – if that were true, I’d have mine by now! Presently, if you put a $200+ deposit down on one, you MIGHT get yours before January 2017.
Your a douch, i bet they sell more in a day then you make all year , and dangerous ???? People are dangerous…guns dont kill people . People kill people
They have sold a shit load btw…
BTW, the ATF defines a machine gun as any gun capable of firing more than one shot FOR EACH PULL of the trigger. The regulations say nothing about the release of the trigger. Since the trigger must at some point be released, this fires more than one round for each pull of the trigger. I know that they approved it, I wonder how long before they realize their mistake.
why don`t you not point out their errors?
You need to read the NFA law. The letter of the law states “one function of a trigger”. The reset or release is the second function or pull. It’s not illegal.
I read a lot of talk (and hear a lot in videos) about “dumping” a full mag. Grow up people, actual full auto is of limited utility and “dumping” a full 30 round mag at a full auto cyclic rate will destroy the throat of the barrel. Full auto fire is fun when you’re a teenager, just like looking at Playboy. Tacticool mall ninjas, indeed.
If you’re not having fun looking at Playboy after you’re a teenager, then you shouldn’t be on this forum!
First, shooting 30 rounds through an AR at full-auto is NOT going to destroy the barrel. It will not even destroy the barrel of an AC556 (FA Mini-14). Second, while 30 round mag dumps probably have no practical value, 2 or 3 or 4 round bursts do. Third, full-auto is fun! I’m not too old to have fun. And, $500 for having a little fun sure beats $22,000. Also, I still find it fun to look at Playboy magazines, if they happen to be laying around. I have a full-auto/tri-burst AC556. It’s fun, but I plan on getting either the Fostech Echo or Binary Trigger, because that’s what I call “cheap fun”.
It’s dangerous, and not necessary, I feel with all that’s going on now, we don’t need something that the anti’s will surely say turns the rifle into a machine gun, as untrue as it is, I would advise waiting a year.
Why wait a year? In a year we’ll have Clinton/Sanders/Trump, any one of which will be much more likely to ban this than Obama who has to walk on eggshells every time he bombs an Arab wedding, or drones an American.
Can you imagine how easily Trump would ban this? No one would say a word, since hey, it’s Donald Trump, dearest of leaders.
That’s why I can’t support Trump. The man would make Obama look absolutely law-abiding. The whole concept of abusing Executive Orders was custom-made for Donald Trump, who would be the worst Imperial President we ever had.
Seriously? Take a look at hillary, she’s allay said aloud we need to think about doing the Australian gun confiscation thing here in America so, no. Trump may be a loud mouth hard head but so many Americans are expecting him to be the American raised everyman that he’d be either impeached or assassinated the minute he tried to ban anything. Hillary Clinton on the other hand would be Obama 2.0 and go on an immediate border opening, gun banning spree in the name of safety.
I’d love for the Antis to designate one of these 2-shot trigger systems a “Machine Gun”, and require them to be registered. To do that, they would need to re-open the registry, keep it open and then there will be a flood of new machine guns into the registry! Yippie!!!
But, that’s not going to happen. More likely the Antis will use the trigger system to show how there is “no” difference between full-auto and semi-auto to try and have AR’s banned. But, wait – THEY ARE DOING THAT ANYWAY!!! So, buy a few AR’s, a few extra barrels and a few of these binary trigger systems, live free and have fun while you can.
It would mean several hours of retraining for most shooters, this requires a different mind set. Sad to a lot of shooters at the range, as soon as they get a round off, stop to look down range, possibly of forgetting the weapon is still hot, release the trigger and hopefully the weapon is still pointed down range. I try to remind shooters that in a gun battle, you will not be taking time to look to see where your round went, it is just a bad habit to get into. I think this trigger system does have some pluses, well trained battle troops, it should save ammo, that get wasted on full auto. Full auto has it time and place, and you will need several magazines. Running out of ammo gets a lot of good people killed, as well as picking poor cover. This trigger like any new weapon takes practice, to truly be effective.
Who the heck keeps their finger depressed on a trigger while they are looking down range??? That’s nuts. The Binary or Echo trigger amounts to a 2-shot, near-full-auto burst. Big deal. About the same thing as a 3-round burst in a full-auto gun.
Just possibly better since you might eat ammo just slightly slower.
Ridiculous … and fraught with pitfalls….
I might pay $500. to get it removed from a weapon.
I’ll take yours. Nay say all you want, that’s your right. If someone is willing to put the time, effort and money into learning how to effectively use this trigger, then who’s to say it’s wrong? This trigger gives the average person the ability to simulate full auto fire without some gimmicky sliding stock. When using the trigger, you have full control over your rifle, just like a normal trigger. If you do not wish to “Echo”, simply switch the selector to semi and let off the trigger. The nay-sayers of these triggers remind me so much of another group of people who say ” nobody needs ‘assault weapons.'” Just my 2¢
Franklin Armory does sell their Binary trigger seperately, not just in rifles, so this article is wrong on that count, plus the FA Binary trigger is a lot less than this one……Might try a FA trigger when I have money to burn, but will pass on this one.
The FA binary trigger may require receiver modification, and they recommend shipping your received to their factory for a proper installation. This they provide for an added fee of $115 or so plus shipping and FFL fees. Don’t mean to rain on your parade, but they’ll even out in price by the time the whole process is over.
Well, I bought the Franklin Binary Trigger. You do not need to modify your lower receiver to install it. You will likely need to do a bit of hand filing on the unit or shimming, depending on dimensions of your lower receiver. Sounds difficult, but it’s not – I did it in a couple of hours. The key is to get the trigger and hammer pin holes to line up perfectly with the pins so that they can be pressed in by hand. No thumping, no pushing with the plastic end of a screw driver – press in by hand, that’s how you know you have it right. I have mine right. I haven’t fired it yet, but I can cycle it by hand in semi and binary, and it works exactly as it should. There’s a well spelled out procedure for checking this in the manual. Read the manual completely before attempting installation and you will be able to get a perfect installation like I did. Also, there are 3 disconnects: a semi, a binary and one to prevent hammer-follow if you’re too quick with the trigger finger. I don’t know if this is a new addition, but that’s how its made. FWIW, this is a highly precision piece of kit. There is no way you could ever make this thing yourself. There is also no way something like this could possibly be sold for under $300 when high end bolt carriers run in the $300+ range. I can’t wait to try it out in the next couple of weeks.
I also have an Echo trigger on order. If I ever get it, I may keep it, or I may sell it – depends on what I think of the way its made compared to the FA Binary.
A solution to a non-existent problem….or an ammo waster. Mall ninja market for sure.
Flat-top receiver = solution to a non-existent problem.
Forward Assist = solution to a non-existent problem.
Billet Receiver = solution to a non-existent problem.
Rail system(s) = solution to a non-existent problem.
Heavy Barrel = solution to a non-existent problem.
AR Piston Drive = solution to a non-existent problem.
Lasers = solution to a non-existent problem.
AR15 / M16 / M4 = SOLUTIONS TO NON-EXISTENT PROBLEMS
The semi-auto AR-15 is a solution to a non-existent problem too! It’s not like they use them in the Military, and you don’t need one to hunt quail or deer.
I love reading you liberals talk about how this. Why you don’t need this to ‘hunt quial or deer’. The Second Amendment was never intended for hunting or personal protection. It was intended to insure ‘We The People’ do not get to the point where we are ‘ruled’ over like our founding fathers were when they formed this great nation. We have watched our rights slowly disappear over the decades to the liberal claims of. You don’t really need those rights. We will tell you what to do. We will give you a check to sit at the house and do nothing. When people start getting wise. There is always a false flag attack somewhere and the news just so happens to be on scene or have a helicopter overhead. Hey it worked in ’86. But somehow the criminals didn’t get the message. They never do. They count on it. This country has turned into the movie ‘Idiocracy’. The patriot act helped it along. This country was never intended fyi have a strong central government. That’s why you have states rights. Next time you see a shooting on the liberal news. Ask yourself this. What would have happened if there was a good guy with a gun to stop it before it happened. You do notice they only attack places where guns are not allowed. Right? Last time I checked. Consider this. It’s easier to buy cocaine and heroin in this country than it is to buy a gun. How long has that been outlawed? Funny you never hear that on the news. The trigger system IS legal by legal definition. But probably not for long if I know the liberal agenda of stripping rights. Living in a free country means you’re going to be offended. Grow a pair and get over yourself. If nothing else. I gave you another viewpoint to consider. We are too pc (politically correct) (in the old days they would call it censorship) But hey. That’s my 2 cents.
I want to see a machine gun in everybody’s hands. Think about it. You really going to break into someone’s house knowing they are armed to the teeth? Lol. Thought not.
Sorry about the fragmented sentences. I get soo mad ( as someone who took an oath to protect this country and the constitution against all threats both foreign and domestic) when I watch it freely give freedoms away with a cheer and can’t see on down the road what they are doing.
Just what I was thinkin. Well said. Deo Duce Vincemus
Amen beother
I am a Democrat,I Spent Twelve years in the Oregon Legislatire. I had a great record with the NRA. They supported me when I ran for U.S Senate. My problem with them is they were always compromising my rights. I am a Democrat they believes what our Constitution says as expressed in the Bill Of Rights. The people would not ratify the Constitution until they reserved certain rights for themselves,Thus the Quote “Congress shall are no laws”. How do you fight a government that is so well equipped that they could wipe you out in 5 minutes or less. I testified that I believed and still do that the citizens,all of us have a right to preserve the concept of the ” People ” to protect themselves from tyranny they to needed to own and possess Machine Guns Anti -Tank weapons and any other weapon they can personally carry! The government should not be afraid of law abiding citizens excercizing their rights under the Constitution? That still my position. my other beef with the NRA is that they promote hunting for the rich and elites,Thay support Game Ranching utilizing public lands. They support fee hunting on public land, they are in cahoots with the policy makers that are making hunting any species a game of the rich! Now they are gating us out of our hunting grounds, Charging ridicules access fees, ever where government land intersects, and the government allows it, at least here on Oregon they do!. And finally on social policy, They don!t care who is elected as long as he is an”Republian” Our “Rights” have no political party. There are serious issues to address ;no time to duck the issues that affect real people. I like them as an organization that is effective in keeping our basic rights, I thank them for their past support and wish them well, I would also ask them to thing about the guy that don’t have a large bankroll and works for a living,like house painters and plumbers. My views are my own and they are public views! Cheers, Bill Dwyer.
Just asking for trouble! Just like the young girl in Ca. With the machine gun! Not for the common owner or shooter! Do not see the use other than Fun!
I’m not picking a fight with this author, just making a frequently forgotten or unknown point about how our rights are subtly being eroded through narative control.
Fact: Guns are potentially dangerous regardless of the means of chambering additional rounds. Seems we have already come to agree with the goverments trampling of our rights so much that we have begun to parrot points of their narrative. At what point did we completely sell out to the idea certain citizens have more rights than others; that some should or should not be able to participate in whatever 2nd amendment activity they desire based on a status like “common” or “civilian” or “professional”? We should all remember, regardless what historians, scholars, or other talking heads in DC say, the NFA from 1986 is certainly anti-constitutional, and unconstitutional by the standards and intent of our founding fathers, amd we shouldn’t even be having a discussion as to legality of this trigger. If you want to argue it is dangerous, wasteful, or silly then argue away. Just be careful not to let the anti-constitutional, anti-second’ers win the narrative war by viewing this device through their paradigm and use words and arguments from their narritive. By refering to someone as a common user you have joined their narative, and the smart ones on that side would love nothing more than to hear this coming from our side over, amd over, and over. Eventually we agree with one tiny piece of the argument, and eventually we corporately give it over forever. Just like 1986. Most people coming of shooting age today wouldn’t ever consider they might have at one time been able to walk into Walmart and buy a full auto M16. In 1976 most would expect the availability of an M16 to be commonplace, amd the idea of not having the ability to buy one absurd. How quickly this right was erased and delegated to what is now almost fantasy.
Jmillerdoc….very well said. When I was a kid I remember walking into Kmart and running to the toy gun aisles .along with just about every other boy. Have you noticed how they are all gone? The toy M16, M1A1 , Thompson machine guns?
I couldn’t wait for my first bb gun then 22. It was a part of the American way.
I graduated from a AAAA high school in Texas. Approx. Every other student vehicle in the school parking lot was a truck and proudly displayed in the truck rifle rack almost without exception was a rifle and a shotgun. We all carried large pocket knives on our belts openly in class, on the halls or the principals office.
I remember the teachers bringing their rifles and shotguns onto shop class for us students to clean. I remember students bringing in there own rifles and shotguns onto shop to clean.
Never seen or heard of a gun or knife related incident. There were plenty of fights behind the school after school hours no one ever pulled a knife or a gun on there opponents , and they always had a knife on them.
Now days even the mention of a knot or gun would get you expelled and the police ARE called on to investigate.
Yet now days you hear so much about gun and knife violence in schools etc. Even though everything is banned.
So much more to say.
I am in complete agreement with you and Imillerxoc.
Caesar was killed on the steps of the Capitol by some of his closest allies Markus Brutus and Caiais Cassious !.They Knifed him to death stabbing him repeatedly. They thought they were saving a Republic from a Dictator. His successor Agustas? Was much worse then his predecessor. so much for the people?. The bottom line is the Constitution has no limits! It expressly reserves the Billl Of Rights for the “People” Congress shall make no law! What has happened to that part?
.
Nice trigger but how many people are going to buy one at or even near the suggested retail when you can get a complete AR15 for almost the same price? These addons are just getting out of hand, buy hey, that’s how they make money! I could think of an awful lot of things besides a special trigger to spend almost 500 bucks on!
Well it actually saves money… Think about it. A grand for a near full auto gun… Or twenty five grand+ plus months of waiting for an actual full auto gun.
Its basically a 2 shot burst.Its a novelty and for that kind of money they can keep it.
Its basically a 2 shot burst.Its a novelty amd for that kind of money they can keep it.
Its badically a 2 shot burst.Its a novelty amd for that kind of money they can keep it.
I am waiting on BATFE to rule on these types of devices, and the Slam Fire/Bump Fire stock, the same as they did the SIG AR15 “Arm Brace”. That being – if its used like a Full Automatic weapon it is regulated as a Full Automatic weapon. With the SIG Arm brace its about usage – so why would these things not have that same (NOT in accordance with laws) reasoning applied ?!
Right now you are committing a Felony if you put the SIG (AR15 pistol) Arm Brace up to your shoulder to shoot the pistol with. How long before you send a bunch of lead downrange with this device and that becomes illegal ?
BATF rules that you can put it up to your shoulder reversing their initial ruling.
Putting the sig brace on your shoulder was NEVER its intented design. It’s a legal device for a pistol stabilization. The ruling just stayed true to the letter of the law involving SBRs as would shoulding a pistols buffer tube. Just like a ruling on this trigger. To the letter of the law the ECHO and BFS triggers are NOT machining guns as defined by the NFA and the CGA.
Any review as far as the feel, pull weight, accuracy, etc.?It’s an interesting idea, but I’m surprised they’d not go one more step and make it an ambidextrous selector. If they had, I’d already be figuring out how to justify the purchase to my wife.
I agree about the ambi safety. That was my first thought when he mentioned the semi position for a decocker. I really expected to see that. For $500 I feel like it should be a no brainer
You have to ask permission from your wife to buy a trigger?? MAN UP !! Maybe u shouldn’t have a new trigger or a gun if you are a weak man, you may hurt yourself. I hope i didn’t hurt your feelings.
That was an (apparently misguided) attempt at a self-deprecating joke. Sorry if I confused you. Maybe I should have included emojis to help along the humor-impaired.
Never understood why one man will disrespect and degrade another man, for being a good MAN, husband and father. I personally pass every purchase over $150 or so by my wife. She returns that RESPECT. Therefore when WE decide WE have the money for a firearm or accessory. WE make the purchase.
As for this trigger, I’m good with what I have. And more power to those that want it. We as Americans have the right to own and possess the same weaponry as our government. They have no right to regulate any weapon in the hands of a responsible citizen.
Thats just too funny. I’m sooo glad I’m not a “we”. I buy shit when i want and dont ask anyone’s permission. My girlfriend has her money and i have mine and it will forever stay that way. If my girlfriend was supporting me, then things would be different, but thankfully I make way more than her.
Are you kidding me? I will be buying one (or two) of these trigger systems and I will not be running it by my Wife. We’ve been married for 20+ years; she doesn’t need permission from me to buy a fancy new purse, piece of jewelry or watch; I don’t need permission from her to buy gun stuff. I expect to be happily married for at least another 20 years. But, to each his own.
IraqVeteran8888 on Youtube just put out a video review on this trigger system. His setup has an ambi selector switch. $200 deposit and they start shipping in April. heres the video – http://youtu.be/PYThNUVZrYM
Wonder if you could pair it up with their DefendAR bump stock for an even higher fire rate!
I doubt they would work together. I have the fostech AR stock & it’s fantastic. Unless the gun is over-gassed (such as using a suppressor) i think the trigger would pull and release TOO fast and the hammer would drop and follow the bolt home.
like what happened to this guy using the binary trigger…
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UVJHVqgXRVI
Potentially useful, but I can see this requiring extensive training to use under pressure to full effect , it’s hard to over come the ingrained muscle memory to release the trigger immediately after squeezing, and depending on the situation, an unanticipated second shot can cause unwanted collateral damage. (Or waste precious ammo in a survival situation.)
Actually they should be teaching follow through on targeted shots which means for a brief time the trigger would be held down anyways. Which should be enough time to flip the selector to semi and or safe. But I do know what you mean for some people it may be difficult.
I already conditioned myself with a semi auto to fire a second round. This would be little more then reconditioning myself not to.
“Other rapid fire triggers, like Franklin Armory’s Binary Firing System, are only offered with complete firearms.” This would seem to be a completely false statement.
http://franklin-armory.myshopify.com/products/binary-firing-system-trigger-pack
Thankyou for that information. I have just emailed them to get a review trigger.
The description also says “It is imperative that the BFS™ only be installed, adjusted, and/or repaired by a certified Franklin Armory™ armorer. ” So not a diy job
B.S., it’s a do-it-your-self job. You will need some small diamond-impregnated files. You can get them at Harbor freight for about $10. You just need to file down the two circular protrusions on the bottom of the device until you can hand-push the trigger and hammer pins. It’s a tedious job, not an overly difficult one. The only way you will mess up is to use a high speed electric grinder, and even if you do and overshoot it, you can recover using the peel-away shims provided. I can’t believe there is so much negativity about this device. I just don’t get it!