The government is banning bump stocks. There is no grandfather clause. This is as bad as confiscation, folks. (Photo: SlideFire).
When Wayne LaPierre said on CBS’s Face the Nation that the ATF needed to “do its job” with respect to bump stocks, one wonders if he was asking the agency to turn thousands of law-abiding gun owners into outlaws. Because that, my friends, is exactly what is happening.
If you currently own a reciprocating stock you will soon be in possession of a machine gun. Unlawful possession of a machine gun is a crime punishable by up to 10 years in prison, according to the DOJ.
This is not a joke. Attorney General Jeff Sessions published a Notice for Proposed Rulemaking (NPRM) last week. (I’ve embedded it below.) If made final, possessors of “bump-stock-type devices would be required to surrender, destroy, or otherwise render the devices permanently inoperable.”
To be abundantly clear there is no grandfather clause in the NPRM. In other words, this is confiscation on a national scale, folks.
“Since the day he took office, President Trump has had no higher priority than the safety of each and every American,” said Attorney General Jeff Sessions in a statement.
“That is why today the Department of Justice is publishing for public comment a proposed rulemaking that would define ‘machinegun’ to include bump stock-type devices under federal law—effectively banning them,” he added.
Even for those of you who said, over and over: Who cares about bump stocks! They break if not the letter of the law than certainly the spirit of the law. They should be banned! Even you should take offense to this NPRM.
At the very least there should be a grandfather clause for bump stock owners. You have to acknowledge that. Because criminalizing the possession of lawfully purchased firearms and accessories is infringement. It is unconstitutional. Period.
Plus, how do you not bristle at the way this whole saga unfolded?! NRA called for “additional regulations” back in October. Trump wasted no time and kicked the movement to ban these devices into high gear. There was no pause to consider the ramifications of the policy change. Even more frightening, Trump seemed enthusiastic about getting it done.
SEE ALSO: NRA Gets Its Wish: ATF Will (Once Again) Review Legality of Bump Stocks
“By the way, bump stocks, we’re writing that out. I’m writing that out myself,” said president Trump in February. “I don’t care if Congress does it or not. I’m writing it out myself, OK.”
And we accused Obama of ruling by executive fiat.
What’s worse is that this NPRM became a reality despite two prior determinations from the ATF saying a bump stock was a “firearm part” and not a “machinegun”; an open letter from the agency’s association admitting that ATF didn’t have the authority to ban the device, only Congress had the power to; and overwhelming public opposition. Remember, when ATF requested public comment on the ban, 85 percent of the more than 32,000 submissions were anti-regulation.
Yet none of that mattered. You know, when many of us screamed that this isn’t just about bump stocks, this is what we meant. It’s about much more: the NRA belying its core mission to protect 2A rights, Trump breaking his promise to gun owners (“I’ll never let you down”), a rule turning law-abiding citizens into criminals, a regulatory agency acting as a legislative body to satisfy a political agenda. Fundamentally, it’s about betrayal.
Some of my friends in the gun community already believe the war is lost. That it’s only a matter of time before our 2A rights are a thing of the past. Looking what has happened under GOP leadership, with a so-called gun-friendly president — at the beckoning of the nation’s preeminent gun rights group, no less — I’m having a hard time disagreeing with that assessment.
Once the NPRM is officially published by the Federal Register, there will be a 90-day comment period. Please take the time to speak up. Let them know that this overreach is unacceptable. Even if you support a ban on bump stock devices, this isn’t the way to get it done. It should have to come from Congress. Not Trump, not Wayne LaPierre, not from the pencil pushers at the ATF.
OK, Mike. Here it is two years later. The fighting in the streets? Same old protests. Now it’s about wearing a mask, and not having a job to go to. We all have smart meters on our poles. They will just cut off our water and electricity, “for public safety”. Every federal official, elected or appointed, sees the Constitution as an impediment to their ability to govern effectively,for the common good, as they see it. And these are the few ‘good’ guys. Most just want to get theirs while they can.
i see no issue with law abiding citizens owning full auto weapons ,suppressors (silencers), short Barrel rifles, bump stocks or any other weapon of there choice. a law abiding citizen is a person who is not going to perpetrate criminal acts with these weapons and only use them in a lawful manner. all laws prohibiting the possession of these things is a infringement of the 2nd amendment .
Not only do Americans have to worry about getting older, getting wrinkles, have their teeth rot, hair fall out, hair turn gray, and their eyes fail, Americans now get to enjoy watching their economy implode, the government go bankrupt, the USA turn into a hardcore police state, a civil war start, and WWIII break out.Isn\’t life great?
At least we’re living in interesting times.
The NRA traditionally negotiated Teamster style, you make demands, you hold your ground, you only compromise when it meets your criteria, you don’t trust management. The NRA has been wimping out in this area of late.
I’ve missed all the grandfathers; since I was serving in other countries in the military. The military was the worst thing in my life. Supposedly the last grandfather was around 2000… so said the ATF. I said if that were true; then why was I paying 1850.00 for a sear; when I could have bought one for a hundred bucks. I loath the ATF and their heavy handed ways. I also loath the fact that they say hey are just enforcing Washington laws. Wrong, they are writing the laws in the middle of the night in Washington. We need a national anything goes grandfather for all sorts of pieces and parts; that will in the future be something that can make a gun go full auto. Take HK parts for example. Completely legal to buy but one day they will be illegal. We need an across the board grandfather on all parts that people would want to register. Flood this fucking country with registered sears. That is what I’m asking for; because they are draining the country of such things. I’d not give this country one fucking day of service if I could go back again. I’d also transfer to another country; but obama screwed me on that endeavor; now retired servicemen can’t change citizenship at all. Fuck this country; Russia is far more free than this country; I promise you; I’ve been there I would know. Now you could argue jail is not a pretty place and certain amendments are scrubbed; and you would be correct. But freedom; I think we are not as free as one would think. In this country; under freedoms banner; you can be a law abiding citizen one day and a felon ready to serve 10 years in jail the next. More if you resist… assuming they don’t kill you for a parking ticket and said bench warrant. Think I’m joking; try to resit one day. I remember my dad telling me before he died; he placed a rifle; a nice Russian full auto he brought back from the war as a pilot; I had seen it and thought he got rid of it; but he told me he placed it in the house walls in the garage. Give me a grandfather; and I’ll go back to that old house and look for it. I assure you; the new owners don’t know it’s there. Make america the land of the free again.
As a life Member of the NRA for over 25 years, I have watched Wayne LaPierre take the NRA in directions it never created for. Under Mr. LaPierre, the NRA has become the lobbying agent for the Gun industry and not the gun owners. The NRA is going Bankrupt, and the interests for the Firearms owners are not being heard. Look at the Board of Directors and their selection process, a majority are Gun industry folks and their attorneys. Under LaPierre the governing rules have changed to remove any member even questioning the NRA administration. It\’s very sad to an organization that was founded to support and connect the owners of firearms and provide proper safety education. Wake up and take back the NRA.
Personal responsibility, no one wants any.
It didn’t take me 30 years to figure out the NRA is full of $#!t.
back then I was young and very interested in machine guns,
I owned a few registered machine guns in my life I never found my way into any trouble with them actually probably the most careful I ever was back then and for me still today people had couth, sense common or otherwise and the outright fear of GOD.
At that time in my state Arizona AG Bob Corbin singed your ATF paperwork Mr. Corbin sincerely believed the “Law was the law.”
He was one of the finest lawman ever in the Southwest later became president of the NRA by then sadly they had bargained away machine guns to lobby for pistol manufactures as I remember.
Personally I can not support Mr Trump for president, even though he has done a lot of good the bottom line is he violated the Constitution just that one little thing, he infringed.
As a life Member of the NRA for over 25 years, I have watched Wayne LaPierre take the NRA in directions it never created for. Under Mr. LaPierre, the NRA has become the lobbying agent for the Gun industry and not the gun owners. The NRA is going Bankrupt, and the interests for the Firearms owners are not being heard. Look at the Board of Directors and their selection process, a majority are Gun industry folks and their attorneys. Under LaPierre the governing rules have changed to remove any member even questioning the NRA administration. It’s very sad to an organization that was founded to support and connect the owners of firearms and provide proper safety education. Wake up and take back the NRA.
Once the libs see how easily the gov pulls this ban off, where will it go next? When will it stop?
So where is the clause about placing the semi-automatic rifle on your hip and firing it as a ‘machine gun’? This folks is where bump stocks came from……illegal my ass. This country only considers the lower a firearm to begin with and that is the only piece that requires a license so how are bump stocks considered part of a firearm if the barrel is not??
The problem with politicians is they are forgetting to address the fundamental problems with firearm sales and have tunnel vision on the mass law abiding citizens…..
Just my opinion
Are they really so stupid to think this would really impact anything? Maybe over a large distance but this would limit accuracy. This would only even minutely impact Las Vegas type shootings. But even then you may be able to fire faster, but a majority of the shots will only hit pavement or dirt.
Oh. I wish I did own one. My local lea would be hiring after they tried to serve that warrant.
Why does the government want a civil war so bad?
I agree it seems to me the liberal left and liberal govt WANT a civil war…..the thing is they dont realize we are ready for one!
I hope the “bump-fire” stock makers/sellers are destroying their sales records before they are confiscated.
The same effect can be had by threading your index finger through your belt loop and the trigger guard and pushing the AR15 forward. Can they make Belt loops illegal? Better head down to JC Penney and buy suspenders, I guess.
A lawful gun owner for over 50 years… Owning an automatic weapon is already illegal. We all understand this. A bump stock literally turns your firearm into an automatic weapon. Why are law-abiding gun owners opposed to bump stocks becoming illegal? You make it sound like the constitution allows us to be able to own an automatic firearm. It does not. Listen, I am not giving up my firearms to any part of government. Period! If we are going to stand behind the 2nd amendment then it needs to be taken in context. The founding fathers never dreamed that we would have a firearm that shoots 600 rounds per minute. The 2nd amendment was written when we had nothing more than ball & cap firearms. As law-abiding gun owners shouldn’t we be taking the stand against bump stocks and concentrate on common sense gun laws? Does it not make us look unreasonable in the eyes of people that do not understand our love for firearms? Please comment but don’t spew crap and please do not be a dickhead.
Actually the 2a was written before the invention of percussion caps! Your comment marks you as a ant 2a troll using anti 2a talking points.
First there were sticks. The stick holders never dreamed they could shoot those sticks with a tip they made out of rocks 40 or 50 yards and kill something. Then there were stick shooters. The stick shooters never dreamed they could shoot a round rock out of a tube held in place with something made out of a stick and kill something 50 or 100 yards away. Then there were round object shooters. The round object shooters never dreamed they could shoot more than one object out of their shooters without reloading their shooters for every shot and kill something 500 to 1000 yards away, and so on and so forth.. You get my drift, Buzzy?
I purchased a Slide Fire Stock a few years ago. Everyone that purchased one of these got a copy of the ATF&E regarding these stocks. Slide Fire submitted the plans for the stock. The letter from ATF&E states” the stock does not change the mechanics of the weapon and there for is considered an accessory”.
Does anyone realize there has only been one incident where a bump fire stock was used. Granted it was a terrible act by one man. My thoughts and prayers still go to the people and the families that were killed and injured. This was a most terrible act of this guy. He went to a great deal of planning and spent a great deal of money to pull this off.
I have read a great deal of comments comparing drunk driving hammers teenagers etc. This was one very disturbed man. This is going to put an entire industry out of business, how many people are going to lose there job?
There are thousands of gun laws across the country we don’t need anymore, just enforce whats already there.
I guess I should mention Ive never used it its still in the box. I paid about $420.00 for it. I think there should be a grandfather clauss.
I don’t want to even start about how we got Trump. He should be the poster child for birth control. How did we end up with these only two choices for president? This, in my opinion, was the worst choice of candidates since I was old enough to vote.
I will add that I spent six years in the Army as an MP defending this country I dearly love so that we can have a voice on matters like this. It does kind of bother me that the people that never served or sacrificed a day in there life can have control of the laws that are so important. But this is America and you have the right to be an idiot. This is what I came real close to getting killed for.
I think Ive rambled on long enough, I hope some of this makes sense. Just take a couple minutes and think about this on more than one side.
Regarding the state.ent that our founding fathers could never have imagined yadda yadda yadda… OK. I’ll play along… but you have to get rid of your TV, your phone, computer, heck… any means of sending or receiving information that requires electricity. Our founding fathers, when they wrote the 1st amendment, could never have imagined being able to spread political speech at such accelerated rates of speed. So let’s turn off your lights, light a candle, sit down with your paper, quill & ink, and pen your thoughts in a manner more consistent and in context with what our founding fathers would have been familiar with. Fair enough?
Idiots abound in our government, they won’t stop until we are all servants, With no means to defend our selves., And we will enter 1984 type of living.
If 11 million illegals don’t have to obey the law why do gun owners ? Better idea : Ban the bumpstocks but then repeal the damn HUGHES AMENDMENT. Fair enough compromise eh ? 👍🏼
Let them vote. We can vote them out. Trump has made me sorry I ever voted for him. Won’t happen again. Time to vote the incumbents out and Trump out. Darin the swamp again!!
Who are you going to vote for?
I voted for Trump also, and am sorry I did, but who else had even a remote chance of winning?
It seems that either side doesn’t have any incentive to help those who vote for them.
In my lifetime, Reagan signed the Hughes amendment, Clinton the 1994 Federal assault Weapon Ban, now this. So two of the three biggest antigun rulings came from those who I have supported my entire life. I am at the point of saying why bother voting anymore.
I’d like to see that many people go through the justice system and be imprisoned !
If we the gun owners don’t start standing up and making our voices heard. What will they com after next the semi automatic, adjustable triggers .cause you can shoot a gun with a 3# trigger pull faster than a gun with a 12#.
The finger is still pulling the trigger with a bump stock the stock is just sliding.
The trigger is resetting before it fires again.
The bump stock just increase the rate of fire. The trigger is not just pulled and held down like a machine gun is!
Brian, Are you really going to make this argument? It really doesn’t matter how the firearm is becoming an automatic weapon but that it IS becoming an automatic weapon. We have become a country that distrusts our government, myself included, so much that all we see is that the government is taking steps in order to confiscate our firearms. We need common sense gun laws, not gun control (I hate this term), to appease us all. Extensive background checks, a firearms license, a longer waiting period (21 days in California works for us all) in all states, etc. It should be a National firearms license.
The AR-15 is a fine weapon but it is very easy to modify into an automatic weapon. I’ve always believed that guns don’t kill people, people kill people with guns. In a perfect world this is how all people would think but if we are going to allow people to purchase firearms that want to kill others then we need to revisit how people are getting possession of firearms. Many of the mass shootings in recent months have been done with firearms that were purchased legally.
There is no data that proves that confiscating all of the firearms decreases gun violence only that the criminals will find a way to get them. I am not going to go down that road but allowing a bump stock to create an automatic weapon is asinine. Of all the things that law-abiding gun owners should stand up for bump stocks are not one of them. Let’s band together and stand up for common sense gun laws.
Buzz if you think an AR 15 is so easy to convert to fully automatic your either a master machinist or you have an unlimited supply of legal auto sears that go for $15,000.00 a piece. An your a Fool & Idiot if you think a National Firearm License is a good idea. How do you think the Nazis and Communists knew who houses to show up to seize their firearms? You think a 21 day waiting period is reasonable. Just go ahead and admit your life long Democrat/Socialist!
So, to all the supporters of gun control out there who think banning bump stocks, or this kind of gun, or instituting that type of waiting period, or abolishing the 2nd Amendment is the answer to the “gun violence problem”, let me ask you this: The federal government, namely the DOJ just settled a case with a guy who designed a plastic gun and distributed, free of charge, the plans for it via the Internet. The courts determined that merely publishing those blueprints was “protected speech” under the 1st Amendment. With those blueprints and a some cash/credit, one can buy a 3 dimensional printer capable of reproducing the parts for assembling such a weapon. 3D printers using powdered forms of metal can do it that way as well. Thousands of those blueprints were downloaded all over the world. Interestingly enough the three countries that had the most downloads were Spain, the U.S. and Germany in that order. Spain and Germany have even more restrictive gun laws than America.
What now, Skippy? You want to try and slap serial numbers on all the thousands of 3D printers already out there? You can get plans for building those on the Internet, too. Then what? Gun control is an exercise in futility and stupidity; and with the advent of this new technology (and others on the way) will eventually go the way of the dinosaurs. Common sense should tell you that humans will defend their lives and property just as any other animal would defend its existence or possessions (its food, its young, its den). We humans simply have the ability to make and use better tools. Anyone who tries to convince you otherwise should be suspect in their ability to reason critically, or in their motives for desiring such power over others.
Since you can bump fire with your finger and no bump fire stock needed, should be disable or turn in our fingers? Yeah, sounds stupid but no more than the idiotic ban they’re talking about!
The NRA is only about money, any more. The executive officers don’t give a damn about stopping gun control. In fact, they generally prefer it when anti-gunners get elected and gun control gets passed, because the rubes begin a mad rush fill NRA coffers to overflowing.
The National Rifle(droppers) Association is to stopping gun control what France is to stopping the German military.
The NRA supported the 1934 NFA.
The NRA supported and helped to write the 1968 GCA.
The NRA supported the 1984 FOPA.
The NRA did virtually nothing to stop the Bush I import ban, and fought for his re-election afterward.
The NRA did virtually nothing to stop the Clinton semi-auto ban.
The NRA did virtually nothing to assist the defense in the Olafson case.
The NRA supported the Veteran’s Disarmament Act.
If you insist on donating, and are serious about stopping this sort of garbage, you are better off sending your money to JPFO or GOA.
What about the SAF= Second Amendmend Foundation-?
They’re the ones that fight and win in court- including scotus w/the DC and Chicago victories for us all.
There is only two ways to fight this, one is each and every citizen start by not paying taxes, our money is their power, which by the way is unconstitutional in the first place, or the civil war which will not be as neat and easy! Time is coming to do something or just bend over and kiss your back side bye bye! The IRS does not have the manpower to come after everyone!
The god of this world controls the monetary systems- even tho they are faux + fiat based.
FDR sold us by the Ponsi SS# as debt slaves to the IMF @BrettonWoods in 19+44
Only accurate knowledge of truth can make way for –
” freedoms under Liberty ”
” My people perish for a lack of understanding ”
” The American Republic can only endure with an aware, informed and wisdom infused public. ”
– OR – they will become sheep….
I don’t own one of these stocks, but I am not for any ban on firearm accessories. We will challenge any ban all the way to the SCOTUS. If you want to regulate and add them to the NFA registry with a grandfather clause…..then do that. The law suits will be piled for the next 10 years if confiscation of personal property takes place. Guaranteed!! The slippery slope is now in effect. I believe it is going to get ugly very soon by criminalizing law abiding citizens.
It’s bull shit!
Come get it!
Next – Surrender your “hi capacity” magazines or face ten years in prison.
It is NOT a free county if you dictate what we can and cannot have!! What part of shall NOT BE INFRINGED don’t you understand? I honestly get tired of dealing with the massive amount of ignorance out there when I tell people guns ARE NOT THE PROBLEM!!! Cain killed Able with a rock, not a AR-15!! It’s the human heart that is the problem, but rather than address the real issue, we’ll just try and push our authority around and force a ban on a item against law abiding citizens. First it’s bump stocks, next it’s “high capacity magazines” this is EXACTLY how the devil works. He takes things away in small increments because he knows few fight back. If we give them a inch, they will take a mile!! If those in power keep it up they are going to start a civil war!!
Absofuckenlutely Problem is there are already bans in certain states against any magazine that holds more than 10 rounds. All other mags must be turned in or you become a criminal
Just another law to ignore. After a while, it becomes hard to give a damn; 10 years in prison becomes meaningless if you don’t intend to submit to arrest. I just worry about how many bastards I can take with me when they finally come gunning for me.
Remember William Holden in “The Bridges at Toko Ri?” In the end, after being shot down behind enemy lines in his F9F fighter (set in the Korean War), Holden’s character NEVER surrendered. He shot every commie he could get his sights on before they over-ran his position (in the irrigation ditches). They eventually got him, but he took down quite a few of them.
AMERICA WAKE UP, THE GLOBALIST ARE COMING FOR OUR CONSTITUTION AND BILL OF RIGHTS, THEY HAVE TO TAKE OUR GUNS, CAUSE THERE IS NO WAY THEY CAN WIN WHEN WE THE PEOPLE ARE PACKING , IT’S NOT FOR OUR SAFETY, IT’S FOR THEIRS, THERE ISN’T ANY BAN OR LAW OR BACKGROUND CHECK OR REGISTRATION THAT WILL STOP A MASS MURDER, THAT IS YOUR RESPONSIBILITY, THAT’S RIGHT IT’S ALL ON YOU, THE FBI FAIL,LOCAL LAW ENFORCEMENT FAIL, GROW UP,WAKE UP, THE FIRST 5 TO 20 MINUTES OF THESE EVIL ACTS ARE ON YOU, AMERICAN UP, IT’S WHO WE ARE, IT’S WHERE WE COME FROM, TRUST GOD, GUN UP, DON’T LIVE IN FEAR,MAKE EVIL DOERS FEAR YOU, THAT’S THE ANSWER AND THE ONLY ANSWER
Lead the way loud mouth.
If they do this, I will no longer support this administration and Trump has lost my vote in 2020 I’m done.
I see over and over again, it’s just a bump stock. Wake up people, this is the tip of a slippery slope iceberg. Once they do this they can effectively ban any accessory by fiat. Ok, you can bump fire with a belt loop, or even just a finger. Well what if they require a 10 pound trigger because of this. If congress would go about it the right way, and just ban the bump stocks and not redefine a machine gun it would be much better. Just a bump stock is not the answer with this method of banning.
Is this the line in the stand?
If not where is it?
We have to decide as a nation.
None of that – when they come to my door
Rambo funny business.
United
“And how we burned in the camps later, thinking: What would things have been like if every Security operative, when he went out at night to make an arrest, had been uncertain whether he would return alive and had to say goodbye to his family? Or if, during periods of mass arrests, as for example in Leningrad, when they arrested a quarter of the entire city, people had not simply sat there in their lairs, paling in terror at every bang of the downstairs door and at every step on the staircase, but had understood they had nothing left to lose and had boldly set up in the downstairs hall an ambush of half a dozen people with axes, hammers, pokers, or whatever else was at hand. The Organs would very quickly have suffered a shortage of officers and transport and, notwithstanding all of Stalin’s thirst; the cursed machine would have ground to a halt . . .”
– Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn, The Gulag Archipelago
Wow. Thank you very much for this! I never knew he said that!
The fact that it can be used as in Nevada means it must go, no matter what you choose to call it. Grandfathering is a non starter – these things must be totally unavailable in America.
But the owners must be compensated as a matter of fairness. Presumably the government understands this; if not a class-action law suit seems in order.
George, your just the kind of fool the left and globalist love! First the bump stock, then light weight triggers, then the redesigned triggers for faster fire, them high capacity magazines! You are not a 2nd amendment supporter as the ATF should be disbanded they have proven many times to be a rouge agency!
Go on, shred the Bill Of Rights. It will come back to haunt those who do.
You Jackasses need to wake up, The NRA IS NOT FOR YOU!!!!!!! They want your money, they don’t give a Damn for your gun rights. Political POS LaPierre isn’t a gun guy, He’s a political shill. He’ll steal your money to go on his trips and use you bunch of Idiots for the Fools that you are. Wake the Hell up for God’s sake. American’s are the most Pathetic bunch of Moron’s on the Planet.
The most powerful country the world has ever known is populated with,
“the most Pathetic bunch of Moron’s on the Planet.”
Despite our problems, I still think we have a chance, far better than most in the world.
Well said. Thank you.
Ok genius…what 2A advocacy organization do you support? I’m guessing none since you are ranting about the NRA and offering no alternative.
If you say GOA that’s laughable, but please give us more of your amazing insight.
You may be upset and overstated the true fact about thoses who are sheeople in America- but Canada, Britain, France, Australia and certainly Mexico are not in OUR league nor have OUR potential to rectify stupidity.
I own a bump stock as a novelty and only have used it once in the several years that I have owned it. The thought of not being allowed to have it, is not that big of deal. The part that bothers me is the way they are going about it. I do everything I can to be a legal and responsible gun owner. The US Government is going to break its own laws to make the bump stock illegal. If they bypass congressional approval and create laws at will, then we are no longer a Democracy. I am not a lawyer but I also believe that if they ban something they have to reimburse you for that item. The ban they are proposing does not mention reimbursement so they are breaking another law. If this ban is allowed to stand when a so called pro-gun administration has control, what will happen when an anti-gun administration gets into office? They will have legal precedence to outlaw anything they want.
I never understood why the BATF allowed bump stocks in the first place-
if they turn a semi auto into ‘full auto’- unless they were just waiting to use an incident like this for more gun controls.
It is because they do not alter the firearms functionality. They make something you can do with any semi-automatic firearm, safer and nothing more. The stock allows you to firmly and securely hold your firearm while bump-firing. With very little practice a person can bump fire with a 2×4 and a screw, with a finger and a belt loop, with a rubber band or if you practice a bit more, you can even shoulder the firearm almost like normal, and bump-fire it. To do so requires you to hold the firearm in a loose and awkward manner hence bump-stocks being a device that makes an existing practice safer. The obvious goal with such a ban is to show that it is actually the semi-automatic firearm that enables faster rates of fire when the trigger is pulled faster which we should all know by now, will lead to an outright ban on all semi-autos or we will begin to see something like minimum 15lb trigger pull requirements and additional mechanics in the firearm to actually attempt to slow down the ability of a firearm to rechamber a round and so forth.
Just a clarification. A bumpstock DOES NOT turn a semi-auto rifle into a full-auto rifle. It would need to be able to alter the trigger to do that. It’s a novelty that SIMULATES full-auto. There is one trigger pull, then one round fired. Period.
Banning without compensation or grandfathering is illegal and sets a dangerous precedent regardless of what you think of this accessory.
Think long and hard about the banning of this item, because there WILL BE, one day, something you like and support on the hit list.
We cannot through any gun owner under the bus. No matter what your favorite gun or gun accessories are. We must stick together and back All of our brothers. Once they devide us and take one persons firearm or accessory,then they will keep on taking. Stay the course and be united, not devided.
Why was my comment deleted? I used no profanity, made no lewd suggestions and spoke only the truth.
Its just a friggin bump stock let it go people….if you are not able to hunt, defend, or have fun shooting because of that then you should not own a gun…also notice how conservatives did all that fear mongering about obama and dems attacking gun rights for 8 years (which they never did) and then look what conservatives do within one year…just an observation
I love how just because people aren’t interested in an item they feel it “acceptable” to just make it go away for everyone else. It’s like me saying that I find it acceptable to ban the brand BMW and Mercedes in the USA… while never owning one or having a desire to own one in the future.
Real bruh, your comment sounds like one of a troll.or a traitor
When government officials take away guns, or talk about taking away law abiding citizens guns, and joke that many gun owners say, “from my cold dead hands” that they will gladly oblige you and kill you to take them. Are’nt they in the government showing exactly why you have your guns? With talk and action like this you cant make a better case for the second amendment. Its about a check and balance against government centralization, tyrrany and overreach. Firearm ownership is meant to be a latent balance of power for the people. Every inch, means a mile. Molon labe’
John, Yours is the best comment I have read so far. It sounds like most gun owners do not understand the Constitution, Or what the second amendment is for or that we are not a democracy, but a constitutional republic. Like Ben Franklin said, A democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on whats for dinner.Liberty is a well armed lamb contesting the vote.I believe that we are at the point in our nation that we will die on our knees or maybe,just maybe live if we all hang together and water the liberty tree.FOR THE REPUBLIC!
Re “[the second amendment is] about a check and balance against government centralization, tyrrany and overreach”
I don’t believe SCOTUS has endorsed any such interpretation. So far the idea of a weapon for self defense is all they have mentioned. Nothing has been said about using firearms to resist Federal officials.
I expect you are just letting off steam, but it’s important not to advocate the violent overthrow of our government. [I realize what you’ve said is far from this.]
Yet, we are saying just that. If our government decides that it is our best interest to have our guns confiscated then yes, we will at that point fight back and attempt a violent uprising with the goal of replacing our form of government with another….which by the way we are also constitutionally allowed to do.
George, you seem to have a deep Misunderstanding of how this Country was formed and why we have the Second amendment! The main reason as was stated that every citizen was a part of the greater Militia to stop tyranny from a government from getting out of control! It was an assurance that the Right to keep and bear arms for any reason would never be infringed upon! If the need should arise it’s “We The People” that would take this Country back from the oppressors be it foreign or domestic! We have already allowed far too many infringements upon the 2nd amendment and it has to stop! Not one single law and infringement on the 2nd amendment has had any effect on the prevention of any crime! It only effects law abiding citizens toward further restrictions and total disarmament!
Our right to own firearms precedes the constitution. Any interpretation by SCOTUS that negatively affects our 2A protection is WRONG. People stand up and say guns are for hunting and self defense…. yeah, have your dream. Firearms are the only thing that allows the people to retain their position of power in our country. Without them the government can oppress us. We have them specifically to protect ourselves from the tyranny of our own government. This is part of a much longer presentation but what is stated here is supported by the personal writings, quotes, letters and speeches of the founding fathers. They escaped tyranny and *never* wanted a government to be able to oppress it’s people the way the governments had they had escaped from. Period.
Nothing was said about resisting the British, either…at first.
The 2A does not give you the right to own a fire arm it gives you the right to be free from a tyrannical government As do all the amendments. Do not alter in any way we are a constitutional republic
So if i get a manufacturer license can i have it if i put a serial number on it and pay the stamp? Im just kidding i would never want a bump stock. Im all for a machine gun though lol
It doesn’t matter if you think people “need” them or not. This is about ATF unconstitutionally changing firearms law. 18 USC Chapter 44, as written by CONGRESS, states that a “machine gun” fires more than one round for one action of the trigger. Whether it’s a bump stock, your finger, or whatever, if it pulls the trigger for EACH shot, it is NOT a machine gun, PERIOD.
Exactly. Thank you.
I stand with you on this topic.
We the people are having our rights trampled on.
👍👍👍👍👍
👍
You are all absolutely correct, however, in today’s environment of lowlife democrats inciting riots in the public square, those who rule are forced to submit in order to maintain order and for obvious political advantage. If we want to avoid this in the future we will require a better system of education or a better system of qualifying voters to understand that mob rule is maybe not the best approach to government. Also, if we seek to influence the masses, we should become better educated ourselves. I applaud those that understand the principles of our government charter and hope we can constantly be reminded how ugly mob rule by democrats is.
The bump stock still has the operator firing one round at a time! The stock is just aiding in the recoil making this happen instead of trying to pull your finger that fast! It’s still is one shot per finger pull! Think about it!! This is just a round about way to get to a ban on Semi Auto’s!!!
And, of course, you don’t need an aftermarket stock to do what the “bump stock” does – all you need is your trigger finger to do the exact same thing.
Look on YouTube for phrases like “bump stock finger”, and you’ll find some videos showing how do it.
My understanding is you can to it high-tech by using a rubber band instead of your finger, but I haven’t checked for videos explaining how.
No one reads or knows the Constitution. It is illegal to restrict arms. SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED is clear. No laws restricting arms were enacted until the 20s,30. Wilson, FDR all Progressive/Socialists helped orchestrate these illegal laws. Citizens are to be armed equal to any Standing Army, so they can repel, riot, insurrection or invasion. This is a birth Right of Americans. Also , Article I,sec 8 describes those powers delegated to the General Government , none include, ATF,Homeland Security, or any of the other 1,000s of Agencies and departments which are also Unconstitutional
If you ever read the constitution, you’d know that a standing professional army is unconstitutional. The constitution allows for a navy and naval infantry only (as originally written). Shall we disband the army and air force, since we’re being “constitutional”?
Fine with me….the corps is all we need anyway…semper Fi!
From Congress?? Since Congress has what right to infringe on my rights??
When comments are allowed about the pending ruling I wonder if it would be worthwhile to make the point that we, the law-abiding citizenry, put our faith in the ATF when they ruled that bump-stocks were legal to purchase. With their reversal of this ruling, my thought is that we might be able to make a case it is unjust that the American people should be forced to give up what was once considered legal property without adequate compensation.
So the ATF states they are legal. Legal to manufacture and own. Now there are million(s) of them out in citizens hands.
One man committed a crime and now you want all of the owners to turn them in or be a criminal. You want people to turn them in without compensation? Not to mention you put a company out of business. You had millions of people spend money on the product you state is legal and now reverse and offer no compensation.
“One man committed a crime [with them]…”
I take issue with that statement. Everyone is swallowing that hook, line and sinker. And speaking of fishy, something smells foul in this whole Vegas case. There has been absolutely zero evidence or proof provided that bump stocks were actually used in this shooting. The audio from many videos does not match the tempo or rhythm of a bumpstock equipped AR15. A photo of a bumpstock equipped AR15 laying on a hotel room floor is not proof. At best it is circumstantial evidence…and I suspect, an opportunistic plant by some agent, and possibly even a set-up from the get go…tho I lean more to the idea of an opportunistic agent…never let a crisis go to waste…let’s use this to thrust bumpstocks into the national spotlight and public conscience. Most people had no idea what a bumpstock even was, and most still don’t really have an accurate idea of what they are or how they work.
I see no practical reason why anyone would need a bump stock.
@ the Nam Vet, It doesn’t matter what you think, it matters on what the constitution says. Unless you went and fought for nothing.
Your opinion is not relevant. The ATF doesn’t have the authority to change laws written by congress. Moreover, congress has no authority to write laws that infringe on the right to keep and bear arms. If you support infringement by either congress or the ATF then you support lawlessnes.
folks are selling them for 500-1000$
And NO WHERE do does anything say you need to keep a reciept or remember there name.
They LOOSE
where are they selling them for that price. 😉 I might need to “research” this. 😀 LOL. Thx.
So if I wear a jacket with a particular type of shoulder padding and hold the gun loosely, does that qualify as a machine gun?
Our gun rights will eventually be gone. The only race in the US that votes majority-GOP is the historic American nation – ie white America. The nonwhite races all vote majority-Democrat. As the mass nonwhite immigration continues, state legislatures and congressional seats, one-by-one, will flip from GOP to Democrats. Enough of this and the Democrats will have the numbers necessary to repeal the Second Amendment.
Immigration is the issue that will decide all others. Trump must invoke Title VIII United States Code 1182 [f] to totally halt legal immigration. He should have done it more than a year ago.
It is one of your beloved Republicans that is doing this. Your beloved Republicans also gave us the most of the other “infringements”. Wake up. Immigration is a BS issue. If an immigrant with no education, who can not speak English can take your job, maybe it’s because you’re stupid and easily replaced. All of you “limited government patriots” want small government, until you lose your job. Then you want the government to do something. Uneducated, hypocritical assholes, the lot of you.
Dewey, illegal immigration is costing us billions to feed, cloth, and give them medical care and you say it’s nothing!! Boy, you don’t have the brains to pour piss out of a boot! You must be one of those brain damaged libturds!!
What “we” pay to “feed and clothe” illegal immigrants is almost literally nothing compared to the money that the government doles out to other countries, not least of which is our supposed ally, Israel. There are bigger fish to fry from a financial standpoint. Do the math. Your last sentence is more insulting to your intelligence than anything that I can come up with, so I won’t respond in kind.
Bump stocks are essentially useless to serious shooters. They make your AR a bullet hose spray and pray toy I would never waste a dime on but that’s not the point and Jeff Sessions knows it. A stock in itself is not a modification to the firing mechanism of the firearm like an auto seer was. Therefore it does not fall under the old 1934 NFA act. End of story. Besides banning these is a waste of time and money. Some clever entrepreneur will just come up with something better and cheaper, then what? Chip, chip, chi[p away at the 2nd?
Jd, any serious shooter can handle one just fine, you obviously don’t know one!
Bump stock bans are just another pig trap.
How does a python eat a pig? Slowly.
They can go fuck themselves. I’m not turning mine in. It should not be law enforcement who take the fall, most are pro-American patriots who support the Bill of Rights. The one’s who go to the doors of American patriots should be leftists.
No mfg for post 1986, so you can’t even register them, with a tax stamp. That’s wrong.
This crazy I can legally own a sub machine gun with a class3 permit but I go to jail for owning apiece of plastic. They should make the stocks class3
There stands the NRA, proud and tall. I have wanted, hoped, and yes, even prayed they would abandon their past ways and start doing the job they have been hired by the American gun owning public to do: protect our rights, but there they stand, squarely against our interests. Just as it was with the 1934 NFA and the 1968 GCA the NRA has abandoned their base and aligned themselves directly against the American shooter. I would hope that their young, up and coming stars like Colin Noir and Dana Lasch wake up and hitch their wagons elsewhere before it’s too late.
I am an NRA member but I recognize that only a bunch of jerks have these; knowing that bump stocks are just a devious method to try to avoid the intent of the laws regarding machine guns.
Are you aware of the circumstances behind the original banning of automatic weapons? I’ll give you a hint: it had nothing to do with crime, and everything to do with the federal government acquiring the monopoly of force against its own citizens in the event of a rebellion. A rebellion which would be precipitated by the central government having been ‘captured’ by Fabianists intent upon passing their socialist/communist agenda into law.
You might want to look up the following subjects before responding:
The Venona Transcripts (that prove FDR’s administration was riddled with Communist agents intent on undermining constitutional government)
The Bonus Army and its treatment at the hands of the US Military
The Business Plot of 1933 which sought to overthrow the government of the US and install a fascist dictatorship, which may have been a ‘false flag’, itself, because the plotters were never punished and it led to…
The National Firearms Act of 1934
FDR’s Supreme Court packing plan of 1937 (threatening to increase the number of Supreme Court justices to 15 and filling the positions with his own picked men to counteract the strict constitutionalist resistance they had to his socialist/communist agenda reflected in the laws he wanted to have passed). After that threat, the Supremes rolled over and passed every un-constitutional piece of legislation FDR proposed. The result has been ever more Liberal (socialist) rulings from the Supremes since then. Rulings that, in the decades since then generally favor government power more than the individual’s rights.
The history of the NFA34 is not as cut-and-dried as far too many believe. The rationale for it was never about preventing criminals from having ‘Tommy Guns’, but about preventing an effective armed resistance to an increasingly tyrannical government.
Greg, you just called millions of fellow gun owners jerks, which means we all know who is the jerk or troll!
Thanks Jay for pointing that out. Not only is Greg the Jerk here but I’ll add in a Douche as well…
LET SEE NO BUMP STOCK. NOW I GUESS IF YOU USE YOUR TRIGGER FINGER AND YOUR THUMB AND YOUR BELT LOOP WHAT NEXT THEY WANT TO CUT OFF YOUR TRIGGER FINGER AND YOUR THUMB AND OUTLAW BELT LOOP. WE NEED A WAR TO GET RID OF THESE COMMIES
LET GO TO WAR AND GET THIS SHIT OVER WITH. AND BUILT A WALL BETWEEN CA, OR, AND WASH. THE STRONG AMERICANS WILL OVERCOME COMMIE BUTT HOLES. THANK GOD.
Spoken like someone who has never been to war. Nap time little boy.
Dewey, those of us that have been most certainly will never shy from the one to protect this Country, just like the situation of how it was created!
What, exactly, are you tough guys waiting for? And, what will your new government look like?
Dewey, I believe I can answer both of your questions. 1. We do not wish to overthrow the United States government. 2. ‘Our new government’ will look like “We The People”. To back up a little, those of us who have ‘been to war’, have no desire to return to that hell. But we fought to protect our Constitution. Even Viet Nam, which posed no risk whatsoever to the United States. But by answering the call to serve, we were protecting the Constitution. And, if and when it becomes necessary to do so again, we will. Against all enemies, both foreign and domestic.
I have never owned nor have I had intentions of ever owning a bump stock. However, I sincerely believe it is my right as a citizen of the United States to own one if I had chosen to do so and I definitely believe that it is an infringement of my second amendment rights, my god-given right to own one if I choose. What has happened to our country, what has happened to us as men that we sit back and take this infringement so easily?
What’s next? Are they going to cut our thumbs off or outlaw belt loops on pants? A bumpstock is not the only way to rapid fire a semi-automatic rifle.
Here is some truth.
– No one alive today was born into a free country.
– The US ranks 23rd in personal freedoms worldwide, based upon a CATO Institute study done in 2016. If you want to know who is first, you’ll have to look it up yourself.
– There is no difference between D and R, they are purely theater to give the free-range slaves of this country the illusion of choice.
– The argument that the 2A preserves all of the other rights is nonsense, it has never been used for such since the civil war.
– Abe Lincoln was not a hero but was a racist and the architect of the all-powerful federal government.
– There is no god.
– You have no actual rights.
Prove anything above untruthful or incorrect.
Comment one isn’t valid.
It’s not possible to be truly free in this life in any country at any time.
When people comment about a “free country” it’s understood in a relative sense. With most people wanting the least possible infringement, interference, or oversight.
Well then Hong Kong or Switzerland is the place to be.
Re your statement, ” The argument that the 2A preserves all of the other rights is nonsense, it has never been used for such since the civil war,” You are wrong, look up “The Battle of Athens,” Here’s a good place to start: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Athens_(1946)
Good ! Nothing but trouble for gun owners and bullet wasters…Gun owners need these like they need crooked barrels. ..NRA member forever.
Are you familiar with the story of the Roman General Fabius? he’d build a wall somewhere, the local barbarians he sought to conquer would kick up a fuss, he’d stop building, wait a bit, then start building again, wash, rinse repeat…until he had them penned in.
(This, by the way, has been the modus operandi of the socialist Fabian Society since its inception, to slowly infect targeted societies with socialistic/communistic ideology, which, needless to say, cannot accomplish its goals without first disarming the populace.)
The Fabianistic approach has been the modus operandi of the gun-grabbers all along. Ever since the National Firearms Act of 1934, enacted to prevent a coup against FDR’s socialist policies, there has been a glacially slow, steady erosion of the Second Amendment, with a concomitant erosion of civil rights, as exemplified by civil forfeiture. With generation after generation schoolchildren increasingly having been thoroughly indoctrinated in the tenets of socialism – and excluded instruction in Constitutional rights – courtesy of public schooling, the Fabianists see their goal as almost within their grasp, hence this latest, highly orchestrated operation as the latest march represents. (You don’t really think those kids came up with this idea, much less the ability to handle the logistics involved, do you?) .
The proof of this has been all the recent open calls for repealing the Second Amendment, where before they demurred at daring to suggest such. They really think they’re in the home stretch, and have only to exert one last push before they achieve their goals. What is needed is an equal or harder push back.
You may not care for bumpstocks, but if you think your own firearms are safe by throwing bumpstock owners under the bus will save you, you will only have gained a short amount of time before your own weapons are targeted. Every piece of firearms legislation enacted federally since 1934 is proof of that.
If only this was told to students in high schools…. instead of socialism….
Amen brother !!!
i read only 10% of the people at these rallies were high school kids the rest were adults that should tell us something also. not only that but the Bill’s HFL owner even used his planes to fly these anti-americas’s to Washington. NFL is hurting for people to buy their over priced ticket’s so they’ll try anything.
being my age i never would have thought that our once great country would have come to what it is now. then again the commies have been working on this since the 30’s and 40’s.
Dear Shithead:
The AG just redefined federal law, USING FALSE STATEMENTS about how this device works. TRANSLATION: he committed an act that he has no legal authority to commit, compounded by using false statements.
It is also creates an ex post facto violation of the law. This is also unconstitutional.
It creates a public taking with no due process or compensation. This also is unconstitutional. (5th Amendment)
It sets the precedent that ANY public official can declare ANYTHING AT ALL contraband to be seized or destroyed with a signature. That doesn’t mean just categories of merchandise. That means anything. Your individual house, for example.
If it is not struck down in court, it is literally the end of America.
Take the NRA’s cock out of your mouth and pay attention to the government cock about to be shoved up your ass.
Or is that what you’re hoping for?
You aren’t the old lady homeroom monitor for firearm accessories. Buy what you like and leave others’ accessory choices up to them. Good grief.
What pisses me off more than the NRA screwing gun owners AGAIN, is the reason this whole shit show about bump stocks was kicked up……that being the Las Vegas fake fake fake fake fake fake fake fake false flag shooting event…..Did I mention it was FAKED? All theater bullshit…..It would seem a lot of gun people missed what was missing in all those videos where auto gun fire was heard…..BULLETS hitting shit and people! I didn’t see one bullet strike anything. As for those ass wipes on the ground who were said to be shot, bullshit…..There would have been screaming, real screaming, blood squirting and flowing everywhere but none of that matter, just the narrative the TV brainwashed masses are eager to believe. For a good detailed article on whats been happening in our country read the following article…..A great article detailing how our government colluding with the main stream media is using false flag terror attacks to try and fool the masses into giving up more of their precious PROTECTED rights…….https://www.veteranstoday.com/2018/03/19/fooling-the-american-masses-with-false-flag-terror-is-no-longer-easy/
Notdownwithit, you are not alone in those false flag BS stories when there is far more proof to the false flags that a real event!
Fuck the NRA!
I give a shit what they, the “Supreme Court, or fedgov has to say about my
God given birthright to defend myself
by any means.
They are not the arbiters, and do not have the final say, about that God given right, which is legally protected by the Second
Amendment.
The NFA of 1934 is still unconstitutional, no matter how long it has been enforced. I have seen a figure of fewer than 2000 Thompson guns in private hands at the time of its enactment. No constituency for the demonized Tommy Gun, and Hollywood got to keep theirs.
The unconstitutional and unlawfully enacted (by shouting match rather than by a recorded vote) Hughes Amendment of 1986
turned the registered full-auto firearm into a plaything for the elite by freezing the supply. Bump stocks were an attempt to regain the enjoyment of rapid fire for the working class individual. The BATF properly ruled that it complied with the law as Congress wrote it.
Semiautomatic rifles have been around for over 100 years. In the early 1980’s Norinco and Polytech of China made it possible for the average man to own one of the world’s most popular rifles for a lot less than the cost of a Colt AR-15. That situation couldn’t be allowed to stand. Hence the Bush ban on Chinese imports and the forced “agreement” by Russia not to export 5,000,000 Tokarev and Makarov pistols to the US. East German, Polish, and Romanian pistols of the same make and model were still OK–for a while, at least. That certainly prevented a lot of crime.
Can anyone cite an instance in which any significant number of police or soldiers refused an order to oppress, round up or murder citizens, or confiscate property when the ones who signed their paychecks ordered them to do so? With all due respect to those who have served in the armed forces or police, and who contribute to this site, I have never met a single government employee whose first loyalty was not to his or her paycheck and the pension to follow. Just ask, and most can tell you to the day how long they have until that glorious retirement.
This is easy. If “someone” gives a individual in the US military an unlawful order, the individual is obligated to disregard it. The old saw about “I was just following orders” has been discredited. If an individual follows an unlawful order (think My Lai) those individuals can be charged under the UCMJ. Those penalties can include the death penalty. Taking private civilian firearms by a uniformed service is illegal by the Posse Comitatus Law. Active military cannot perform law enforcement duties as regards to civilians.
Tell that to the citizens of New Orleans during Hurricane Katrina, who had their firearms forcefully taken by police, National Guards, and members of the military! Citizens were beaten, (89 yr. old woman) arrested, and detained for even possessing firearms during Katrina…Well documented
This NPRM has long distance ramifications. All unconstitutional. Ruling by executive fiat is a dictatorship. Bump stocks or pacifiers to protect against crooked teeth. What’s next?
Trump is wrong and so is his whipped boy Sessions.
T
Thanks to politicians violating their oaths of office, America has more than 50,000 “gun control” laws on the books – all of them unconstitutional. Because criminals are lawless, none of these laws has ever prevented a crime. All they have done is undermine and erode the Second Amendment and burden the law-abiding. Where are the laws that throw politicians in jail whenever they violate their oath to the Constitution of the United States? All politicians who sponsor and support laws that infringe on the unalienable right of American citizens to keep and bear arms are in violation of their oaths of office and should be punished for treason. Until these politicians are held accountable, we really have no one to blame for the loss of our rights but ourselves. We are never free when we tolerate tyranny. If we cannot keep politicians honest with the ballot box, then thank God our forefathers gave us the cartridge box. The first shot heard round the world was fired when the tyrants came for our guns and ammunition. If the legislative onslaught against our unalienable right to keep and bear arms continues, will a second shot soon be heard? The only response to those who seek to disarm us should be a deafening, unified roar of “Molon labe!!”
Something I never hear about anymore is a good old fashion tax revolt. The rallying cry of the first revolution. Stop voluntarily sending your money to the government to pay for your own enslavement. Sunny day patriots talk about lock and load etc., but will crap their pants if they get a letter from the IRS.
What a bunch of morons on this blog, and those who talk of civil war are just plan STUPID PARANOIDS! No wonder those who don’t own guns (I have 5 hand guns and 4 rifles) are afraid of you loosers. Keep it up and we will loose BIGLY.
Just the thought of 2nd A repeal will send us bunch of morons and STUPID PARANOIDS as you call us into an alert mode. And if it does occur just remember that it started with the first initial booom!! Which side will you be in? The losers (loosers as you say)?
Coward…
It’s lose, not loose.
Your support of Fascism is noted.
I think bump stocks are unsafe anyways, you have to hold it loosely to get it to work properly. Unsafe.
If you got to have an adomatic weapon get your class 3 lisence threw the ATF. I did, problem solved.
There is no such thing as a “class 3 lisence.” or even a “Class 3 License.”
You realize that millions of other gun grabbers (Because that’s what you are) consider ALL firearms “unsafe.” And given your grasp (or lack thereof) of either English or the Constitution, what you think is irrelevant.
Booze by definition makes anything less safe.
And as others have tried to educate you, this is literally the precedent for ANY bureaucrat to destroy or seize ANYTHING with a signed letter.
No need to hold stock loose only push forward less than 6 lbs pressure..no barrel rise no recoil will allow 100 rounds in 9 seconds all in a target the size of a tv set.
I believe the government should pay the owners of the bump stocks a fair price for the bump stocks if they want them, Its like anything else you want it you pay for it. They were bought when legal and the owners should be grandfathered.The government better look out pulling this crap with other things down the road!!
i do too, they give enough to illegal alien’s and don’t bat an eye. pay up mr. president. just when i thought we had a good guy to help us. he goes and turn coats on us.i guess you don’t have to be a politician to be a politician anymore.
So, We The People, get screwed once again! We bought the bump stock and now we compensate ourselves with our tax dollars to buy them again just to have them destroyed! No more! The infringements must stop!!
So this is it, then. I’m interested to see how many III%ers actually go out and violently rebel. I’m guessing 0.
Well, they say a revolution can be started by a single pen stroke. I think this is the beginning of something bigger, but I don’t think the ‘war’ is lost as long as we still have the Constitution in place. As long as the responsible firearm-owning community stands up, writes, or speaks up, there is always light at the end of the tunnel.
It looks to me like we need a government agency who keeps track of psychoactive drug prescription history and who is trying to own firearms including who actually owns firearms and who is taking those mind blocking psychoactive drugs.
The burden of proof is on our Federal Government who gave us our Constitution of the United States of America about 229 years ago along with our first amendment and second amendment rights. But as long as the Supreme Court of the United States continues to give rights to major corporations including Big Pharma which infringe on the rights of individual citizens then we as a society are screwed.
We also need to get rid of the Military Industrial Complex’s loophole of “due to reasons of National Security” and demand more transparency from our government which we fund from our already taxed dollars. Remember the phrase, “taxation without representation”?
As long as our Country keeps getting “we the people” into unjust wars then it has special powers. We need to demand that our country give us peace and maintain that peace so we can take our country back.
Using logic against the nitwits on this website is a fool’s errand, Old Guy.
Even though I’m convinced bump stocks are useless, and fall under the umbrella of fanboy accessories, I won’t give the anti-gun crowd an inch. Ban these today, and tomorrow they’ll want to ban a legitimate item.
HAY WAKE UP this is a legitimate item! if it wasn’t you would never been able to purchase plus the FED allowed it to be sent threw the U S mail that broke there own law also what about all the TAX dollars we sent to the government, will that be taxation and no representation, Has the NRA become a child of the government? or will this mark the beginning of the end of the NRA.
I hate to say it but maybe you should secure your weapons because if these tactics dont stop you might need them.
Before all this media circus about bump stocks, dealers couldn’t give these items away. After the Las Vegas shooting and the media focus on the bump stock, they sold out over night and you couldn’t buy one because of the demand. Now they are available again at elevated prices and the Government wants to ban them.
This is what happens when the uninformed media and politicians get involved in issues above their pay grade. Now the Government wants to make criminals out of Law Abiding Americans that own them. This is why many Americans loathe and distrust Government at all levels. It is also the reason why we have the 2nd Amendment right to own guns, to have a free state and protect us from tyranny, both foreign and domestic.
I agree with extreme prejudice. Before I saw that bump stocks were going to be banned, I was positive that owning such an item was evidence that you had way more money than sense. Since the “ban” went into effect, I am wondering why I believed that our government would not obey the screaming mob. I am not a gun collector or aficionado, nor will I likely become one. I am Jewish, and I know because the tens millions of my unarmed forbears that were murdered that trusting xtian/dem mobs is a really bad idea, no matter how much they insist that they are really a fair minded understanding lot.
The incident that has raised so much furor was another school shooting that will continue happening until we install Metal Detectors and Screeners in all of our Schools!
Our politicians did not call for the banning of box cutters after 9/11, or more stringent background checks on those purchasing them, nor any other weapon because they knew it would not prevent hijacking.
They also know that banning bump stocks, large capacity magazines, or banning any other weapon will not guarantee the safety of our children while they are in school.
So why is it that they are not calling for the same protections that were put in place in all of our airports after 9/11, and have since proven effective?
Perhaps the MASSIVE tax cuts for Corporations and the Wealthy have left us unable to afford protecting our school children the way we protect our aircraft!
One of the biggest government/liberal/progressive etc lies is corporate tax. Corporate tax is an expense of business passed on to the CONSUMER! When the taxes become too high, forcing up prices, sales slow or stop putting the workers out of a job.
No, you’re wrong about corporate tax. The tax is on gains and profits of the corporations activity. It’s an excise tax and only applies to federal corporate activity not in the Union states. Most American’s on another note, pay a tax on their income which is not income as determined by the U.S. Supreme Court in many of its decisions on income. Even a current congressman of the 15th District of Florida, admits that the current Tax Code does not specifically state individual American’s liability for payment of federal taxes. He couldn’t be more correct according to 26 U.S.C. Subtitle C, Chapter 24, Section 3402, where withholding of income tax at source is on federal employees receiving any specified federal payment. Section 3403 states that the Government is liable for the collection of tax and Section 3404 says that all Governmental employers are to make “tax returns” and “payments of tax”, not the employees.
And lastly here is some good news if you know enough about federal tax law, and that is if you ever win the lottery and the lottery tells you that it has to withhold federal tax on the prize money, you can sue them in “state court” for acting as an impersonator of a federal withholding agent, upholding federal law on a state operated lottery where the IRS has no jurisdiction per 4 U.S.C. Section 72, extortion and conversion of funds. No one to date has ever sued the lottery but I’m thinking it is going to happen one of these days. Stop giving your hard earned money over to the IRS voluntarily. A W-4 tax form is a voluntary form as you must sign it before the employer is allowed to withhold. Never thought of that???
We need school secured by a fence or a wall, metal detector and armed guards and it will prevent school violence. Problem is if it makes too much sense nobody wants it.
This is precisely why all of you should be hoarding primers, powder, and powder checks.
Civil war is coming.
OUR GREAT “SAVIOR OF 2A” IS A TURNCOAT NY DEMOCRAT.
I figure the war will start during the 2020 run. It almost sparked this last go around.
If anyone thinks this is just about bumpstocks, they are deluding themselves. It’s long been known that the Liberal Left has total disarming of the public in mind. Until recently that assertion had been pooh-poohed by the same Liberal Left as being an example of paranoia.
Until recently, that is.
During the recent “March For Our Lives” in DC, one Ms. Delaney Tarr made it abundantly clear what the strategy was:
Video and text of speech here: http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2018/03/parkland-student-delaney-tarr-when-they-give-us-that-inch-that-bump-stock-ban-we-will-take-a-mile-video/
She and they cannot speak any more plainly than that. Bumpfire stocks today, 10+ round magazines tomorrow, AR-15’s and sporter AK’s the next day after. And then it will be pistols.
Just as Chamberlain found out with Hitler, appeasing these fanatics will only embolden them. Just like with Hitler, their ‘territorial demands’ are endless. They’ve made it clear that they intend to destroy the Second Amendment. Their modus operandi is also clear: divide the 2A supporters by using bumpfire stocks as a wedge. And given the comments I’ve seen, it’s working.
Throwing bumpfire stock owners under the bus only puts you closer in line to that same bus. And when it’s your turn, no one will help you.
It;s time to do some marching of our own. Just like they did, only much bigger. And it’s time to remind Trump of just what Liberals, the same ones who are making all sorts of trouble for him, are up to, and call in the chips. It’s ‘put up or shut up’ time.
When is the March…. is it open carry for effect?
For its greatest effect, I imagine that march would have to take place in DC. Given DC’s Draconian (anti)gun laws, it would really be pushing the envelope as to whether it should be open carry. But then again, such a move would be a direct challenge to those behind the ‘movement’ to disarm America…which can best be termed ‘the Deep State’.
Such defiance would shake them pretty badly. To say it would have to be a ‘calculated risk’ is to engage in understatement.
Well, folks, it’s time to wake up. This is a “throw it against the wall and see if it sticks” kind of test run. If this sticks, and everyone turns in their bump stocks, I will guarantee you that the “black rifles” will be next. That will be followed by all semi automatic rifles and probably pistols. The anti-American liberals, democrats, and foreign countries want to disarm America. Right now, now country would invade us because of all the weapons that Americans own. Once they are gone it’s open season on us. than, mark my words, the candy assed liberals will be the first ones to cry.
I’m pretty sure that “other countries” fear American gun owners about as much as our own government does, they don’t. The main reason that America has never been invaded is the oceans on either side of it and a friendly neighbor to the north.
There is no difference between D and R, they’re all in the same club, the oligarch club.
They don’t even give child molesters this much time in prison but don’t worry, the people that want terrorists to have full access to your borders, kill millions of babies to profit off baby body parts, turn your children and your military gay and transexual, release criminal illegals into your streets, tear down your Christian crosses, …they don’t want your guns. You are all just wearing tinfoil hats.
Article I, Section 9, Clause 3. No ex post facto law shall be passed.
Being the Democrats stand for nothing but socialism and the Republicans are spineless maybe it’s time for a third party.
Wake up America!
Being D and R are two sides of the same coin, maybe it’s time for an actual second party.
I guess it boils down to this. Full Auto firearms have not been legal for the most part in present time – I’m not sure about certain rules or permits that may be available at this time. The bump stock seems to allow a gun to fire without actively pulling the trigger each time you fire, which seems to be what full auto does. So, it was probably something that was coming anyway.
Wrong.
The operation of the bumpstock manipulates the finger, causing it to hit the trigger repeatedly in rapid succession. It complies with the letter of the law, this is the reason the ATF approved it previously.
Why are you commenting if you can’t be bothered to spend three minutes on YouTube to get educated about this issue?
From my view, the far larger point is not the stupid “bump stocks”. The real fight to keep the 2nd A. is being fought in the immigration battle going on. More immigrants from the south, more ready made Democrats and leftists, and then each state slowly loses the gun battle in stale legislatures and there you go. So i”m still with Trump. As far as I’m concerned, he and his administration are fighting the much more important battle to save our gun rights, and that is immigration! The bump stock thing is but a stupid distraction. These kinds of “toys” do one thing very well; they scare the non-gun folks and embolden the left. Already the cries to ban “assault rifles”. Even the left wingers know that “bump stocks” don’t work very well on bolt guns or muskets.
Well, I have more important things to worry about here in Oregon than bump stock devices, they are trying to outlaw ANY semi-automatic firearm that has a detachable magazine capable of holding 10 rounds or more. That unfortunately means most pistols on the market today and this is a real threat to our 2A rights here in Oregon and if this makes it and passes other states will just on the wagon and try the very same thing in their states.
The slippery slope continues and unfortunately, it seems we, (pro-gun/2A rights) are losing the PR war. We seem to be outgunned with media presence and our message has much fewer news outlets. It seems that those who win the 1st amendment battle will most likely also win the war for the 2nd amendment. I’m not sure how we can organize better as a collective whole, or be more vocal. Bump stocks maybe just a pieces of plastic, but also the tip of the proverbial iceberg. That shot across the bow actually hit the ship and we lost that battle with more to come. All of our 2A rights are under attack. Listen to your enemy as they will tell you what they want.
The RNCC and President Trump have been begging me for money every time I pick up the mail, read my email, or visit FaceBook. Last week they wanted me to give money for the First Lady’s Birthday. They MUST be kidding. The president has betrayed my trust over guns (the issue always tied to my vote), the border wall, and “draining the swamp”. I don’t even want to go into his other betrayals.
Well, George H. W. Bush, betrayed me in 94 as well. There really is no difference between the Republican Party and the Democrat Party. 99.9% are only interested in power and the only way to insure power is to invalidate the 1st Amendment. Before that can be done, you must invalidate the 2nd Amendment. Now the Republican government with the cooperation of the NRA (another terrible betrayal), have passed GO.
I have ceased my donations to anything affiliated with the Republican Party or the NRA. Some will say that I am “cutting off my nose to spite my face”. I am now convinced that my constitutional rights will be taken irrespective of who is sitting in congress or the White House. I will not enrich those who seek to to deprive me of them.
NO MORE OF MY MONEY!
The National Association for Gun Rights is where we should focus our money.
They refuse to give a centimeter on anything that will erode the 2A.
I have been sending my money to them because they have stood up even when the NRA hasn’t. This isn’t the first time the NRA took the other side. I hope that everyone reads this and joins the NAGR.
I understand the whole, “give them an inch and they will want a mile” thing, but there is no good reason to have a bump stock. You can’t hit shit when using one, and they are otherwise useless. Let’s save our energy and resources for the real battles ahead of us.
Aparently the author didn’t read this proposed rule.
You dint have 90 days to,turn them in; you have 90 days to respond to this potential civil,rights violation and infringement upon the 2nd Amendment.
People,you,need to read this poorly written rule full of fear mongering and,voice your, disaproval of it at once.
The fact is multiple,times over the course of,nearly a decade the BATHE has ruled,these systems do NOT qualify as a “machine gun” and do NOT full the NFA.
Instructions in how to challenge this unconstitutional rule are contained in the proposed,rule itself.
Its not to,late to,stop this infringement you just need to tell the rule makers NO!
Problem with that is people have already spoken and 85% said no way.
Rule comes anyway.
Our public comment period does not keep them from changing the rule.
Only thing that will hold this back is Congressional pushback.
Well!!!!! This is now the American way. The minority screws up and all Americans are penalizes. I’ve got friends that have slide fires and they haven’t ever broke any laws muchless killed someone with a bump stock/slide fire. How come no one has brought up the point that you do not need one of these stocks to bump fire?? If someone is coordinated enough and practices enough you can still bump fire.
Here’s the truth, folks. None of us like it but we’re probably past the point of being able to change it, maybe even 75 years ago.
This Nation and its People have changed so much the Founding Fathers would not recognize us as the Nation they founded.
You can go to jail or lose your business just for saying you don’t like or approve of a certain group of people. (Hate speech).
You are forced to pay a huge tax bill every year to support many things even a majority of Americans have said they don’t approve. (Your yearly tax bill takes about 40+% of your income).
Even sadder, we’ve done such a piss-poor job of passing down our values, a majority of our young people are now on the side of the government being our thought police and being our all-seeing nanny. (We let a liberal and corrupt education system teach our kids, without paying attention to what they are teaching)
We’ve allowed the richest business owners to say our labor costs too much, so they could send our manufacturing jobs to third world countries. (And we show we are ok with that! by buying cheap Chinese stuff at Walmart instead of choosing to pay a little more to support those who are still making products here at home)
We have failed to exercise our right to oversee those in government. (Election turnout is frequently well below 50% of those eligible to vote)
The chickens are coming home to roost. Sure, you all can say, “It wasn’t ME that failed in all those things!” But somewhere along the line we have not done enough to help keep this Nation on track. Just as an example, how many of you have NEVER written a Congressman to say you want strong measures to secure our borders? Or at least, you never did back when it actually required a stamp, an envelope, and putting your reasons down on paper?
We’re toast folks. Go down with guns blazing if you choose, but it’s too late to make a difference.
I’m sure I will be excoriated by most on this particular post. However a “bump stock” is NOT a firearm so it really isn’t covered by the 2nd amendment in my view. A “bump stock” is nothing more than an attempt to circumvent the already established law that outlawed “machine guns” or full automatic firearms for the general public.
This is a fight that really is not worth having and talking about how it will lead to confiscation of your AR or magazines or any other part of an operating firearm is absurd. I say again, “bump stocks” are NOT firearms and the second amendment says very clearly “A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.”
Note the phrase “… the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.” This accessory is not an “arm” it is an accessory. This is a fight we who support the 2nd amendment shouldn’t be having. It’s silly and is the very reason that those who don’t own firearms and support the 2nd amendment don’t support those who take every attempt at a reasonable approach to this right as a complete infringement. As I said machine guns are already illegal, “bump stocks” have no other use than to circumvent this law.
It’s my opinion and worth what you paid for it. But I’m a CCP holder, own several firearms, am a member of the NRA and am totally against attempts to outlaw legal firearms by the federal government and I just think getting our panties in a wad over this is just plain silly.
Your reasoning is simply avoidance of the actual issue. By your reasoning and just accepting this ridiculous ban your opening the door to the dismantling of firearms. Technically since the ATF considers the receiver of an AR the actual firearm then the magazines, stocks, barrel, etc. are just added parts so by your reasoning you’d be fine with them banning anything they consider a part. I could care less about bump stocks but I at least understand that banning them opens a huge door for banning other firearm parts.
all guns are a collection of parts Einstein……………jesus
You just made the case for any size magazine confiscation, as they are not firearms.
It do any matter if a Bunp Stock is a “firearm” or not. It’s aomething you have a RIGHT to own. Period.
Machineguns are not illegal.Says as much early in the new ruling. They just cost $20,000-$30,000. This is troll bait!! DON’T waste your time with this commenter.
I understand your point, but looked at impassively all I can see is another slice off the loaf; our loaf.
So, it’d be just fine for the government to “permit” such things to be sold, and then at some point “change their minds”.
At which point, one must “destroy” the item in question or surrender it.
That’s spectacular.
Doesn’t even cost a thin taxpayer’s dime, either, it’s “give it up or break it or go to jail”.
I imagine next will be a “demand” for “magazines over 10 shots”, “every feature from the 1994 Crime Bill”, and then add on “tubular magazines and any firearm capable of holding more than said 10 shots”.
Forget a “forced buy back” like Australia had, they’ll get people to bring their “smashed items” in for verification of destruction and offer no compensation other than “well, it’s the law, so now you aren’t risking prison to keep it.”
Give them another inch, that’s swell plan, the US will be back to front stuffers and side by side shotguns. With a Permit, of course, and likely “minimums” in terms of size.
Where’s that “sarcastic” font when I need it.
Many have said, and I would agree, bump stocks are an accessory. There is already a law that can cover this accessory. People can own automatic weapons if they have a Class 3 FFL – so just make it necessary to have a Class 3 FFL to purchase the accessory. I would submit no law ever becomes less restrictive but rather more as time goes on because of legal challenges. I agree with many that banning this accessory will lead to more items being added in the future through judicial challenge. By the way automatic firearms were outlawed not because of the firearm but rather state, local an city governments did not want to purchase similar armament for law enforcement that Al Capone and Bonnie and Clyde possessed. They wanted to issue the standard 38 special revolver.
This is just absurd, this is a attack on the 2nd Amendment. No I do not own one, waste of money, why not tell us the truth on what happened in Las Vegas….
Too bad AG Sessions doesn’t act like this when it comes to Hillary’s Bengasi, her email scandal, the nuclear 1 deal, and the FBI scandal.
Well, if you don’t like Trump anymore join the club. Just stay home for the midterm elections and the Democrats will take the house. They will impeach Trump and Pence will take over and hopefully fire Sessions. Then Round 2…
That’s exactly what we need, a president whose imaginary friend talks back to him.
Maybe it’s time to start mobilizing, time to get organized and figure who are real leaders are or will be. We need to take OUR Country back!!! I fear this is just the start of the slipery spiraling fall of not only the 2A but our great Country as well!!!
Like unused muscles, our freedoms wither away if not used vigorously and often. The second ammendment needs to be used for its intended pupose or we will surely lose it. Going to the range and hunting are just practice for the ultimate use of our right. We are finally at, or maybe past, the time the founders knew would come one day……the time they included the second ammendment to protect against. Wake up. It may be too late. If so, shame on all of us that consider ourselves patriots. I guess we feel that we have too much material comfort to risk in keeping the United States the best, last hope for freedom loving people.
This is total B.S. The TAG ruled it legal and therefore people bought them. So now they should just hand them over? I say the government should have to pay back the $100+ that they cost to buy. Keep stepping on toes and people will start pushing back.
Folks there is way too much money being thrown at all of this by the Left Wing Nazi Gun Control Folks. Sometimes I even think the Deep State including FBI and DOJ are allowing these mass shootings to happen on purpose. They knew about this killer kid, and did nothing, they knew about the Pulse Club guy and even his dad ws on the FBI payrole and did nothing, they were warned about the Vegas guy and did nothing. Does any of this sink in folks?????
Now they have mobilized a whole population of kids with money and fame, (and probably all the X boxes they can carry). They are coming for all the ARs and AKs, and that is a given. And that is coming soon. But they will also halt all sale of 5.56, .223, and 7.62 ammo too.
My advice is buy what you can now, stock up. And better find places to put it all, before they come breaking down the doors looking.
Remember, there is a reason they can never stop these people even when reported to local, state, and federal agencies. And it is because the monsters are providing the agenda.
Do not follow or comply with unlawful and/or unconstitutional laws. Refuse. Resist. Revolt.
Trump is an authoritarian statist, liar, and warmonger.He has no core. He has no depth. He thinks inherent rights are things to be bargained away. His rule by regulatory fiat is anathema to our U.S. Constitution. Thus, he is a PERJURER who broke his solemn Oath of Office — just as the other liars who have inhabited the White House have done.As such, he is one of the most dangerous, narcissistic, self-adulators to ever inhabit the White House.What an absolute LOSER!!!Anyone who is on the Trump Train is on the road to perdition.Remember, it was not so long ago that he funded Hillary, funded Schumer, and railed for an outright AWB.Beware the man who said this: \”I am a globalist and a nationalist; I\’m both.\”Lock Him Up!!!!! Lock Him Up!!! Lock Him Up!!!Primary this disaster in 2020!I\’d vote for Rand Paul if he decides to run. Absent his run, I\’ll write him or his father in.I will not vote for Donald Judas Trump.
When The Pistol Arm Brace was first approved I said They won’t be approved for long. Thus I bought a number of them as I use them on Macs, AK Pistols, SIGs Pistol Brace that lets you insert your pistol, and so far all of the Fold. Now I never ever put the Brace to my Shoulder as that makes it Illegible. And Pigs Fly. When the Bump first came out I said interesting, and I can bump many a firearm without must effort. The Macs of course are an easy bumper, and they climb The Pole with ease.
Point being, when the bump first came out I will guess All Of US said it won’t be approved for long, so I better get one now! Now they decide they F’d Up and want to UN-approve them. First off I do not think they will take away any of them, but you ain’t gonna be buying them ever again. We will be back to the Good Old Accepted Stamp, pay to play, and as a life long Gunner since age of 12 or 54 years and counting It ain’t gonna hurt US as they should never have been approved.
Enough, time to go shooting for the 4th time this week. Life Is Good. And, The 2nd is Just Fine, don’t worry, WE are to big to come after anyway.
The mass shootings that are driving the extinguishment of our gun rights were rare before the dangerous prescription psychotropic drugs found in almost all mass shootings were legalized about 30 years ago. Because most mentally ill people aren’t criminally insane. And these drugs cause people to do things that they wouldn’t do if they weren’t using them.
The government knows that these drugs are dangerous and has outlawed giving a commercial driver’s license or keeping a commercial driver’s license for anyone who has ever used these drugs. Rather than getting the drug issue solved, and with it the mass shooting problem solved. The government is allowing these drug fueled mass shootings to continue so that they can be used to take away our gun rights.
Slide stocks, high capacity magazines, assault weapons, etc. would be non issues if these mass shooting weren’t occurring.
Actually, if “bump fire” stocks make a machine gun, what about the “bumpfire” technique? Since just about any semi-auto rifle can be caused to fire rapidly via the well established technique, wouldn”t that make any longarm with sufficient magazine capacity to justify it’s use a “machinegun.”
I submit there’s much more at stake here than a bunch of plastic stocks.
So true
No worries gentlemen. The solution might be something like LAW ABIDING CITIZENS GUN OWNERS SANCTUARY CITIES IN EVERY LOCATION IN THE USA THAT LEGAL LAW ABIDING GUN OWNERS RESIDES. It a shame that the 2nd A can not protect us but the illegals who are in sanctuary cities are better protected under the umbrella of the federal, state and local leaders (elected by the people) with our tax dollars. They sure look like untouchables and have more rights than a law abiding citizens of the US of A. “The doctrine of non-resistance against arbitrary power, and oppression, is absurd, slavish and destructive of the good and happiness of mankind” New Hampshire Constitution of 1784
I don’t own a Bump Stock and don’t see the practicality of it. The way I see it, full auto is a waste of ammo, the third round is in the trees.
Nevertheless, when I heard the NRA get on board with the ban, I quit my membership. THAT IS NOT THEIR JOB and they are not representing gun owners when they propose infringements. You only have to betray me once to lose my friendship and support.
OK. So we dump LaPierre, NRA, Trump, and the justice department. Then what have we got? I’ll tell you what we’ve got. A fractured, disgruntled, wounded bunch of 2nd amendment thumpers who stand to lose to a well structured, oiled, machine of antis backed by millions of dollars that doesn’t come out of their own pocket. I don’t like the way this was handled one bit either! And I’m holding my nose with the rest of you purists, but, We all hang together or we all hang separately.
As having run a statewide sportsmen’s caucus, and having been privileged to set behind closed doors, what seems like betrayal is often not the case! To borrow a phrase from the movie Oh Brother Where Art Thou, “We’re in a tight spot here, boys!” Watch the nightly news on whatever station you want. Many states and municipalities have already passed draconian laws, some even banning Assault (their term not mine) rifles and magazines. We have got to get smart and vote. That’s the only way we’re going to stay on top. Even though his views are conservative, I have a friend who always votes for a third party because he says it is his right,. I’ve explained to him that when he votes that way he’s voting for both main candidates, but he continues to waste his vote “to send a message” as he says. We have got to be smarter than that. You can think that the NRA and any other group that appear to you to be acquiescing are selling us out, but that is not always the case.
We’ve got popular opinion against us, news media against us, the east and west (populace) coast against us, lying congressman, many state and local committees, town boards and legislatures against us and on and on. The movement of the school kids and the attention the media is giving them has hurt us bad, And they know that. They have managed, in the general public’s eye, to put gun owners, and pro gun organizations as being the bad guys, blaming violence and shootings on them (US)! It is no longer a matter of “truth will win out in the end!
If my back is against the bluff and I’ve got a lion in my face ready to eat me, if I have a ham bone, I’m going to throw it to him if I have to, to keep him from eating me and worry about what happens when the ham bone is gone later. Maybe someone will drop me a rope, but the point is, we’re in the battle of our lives and being fractured will only insure we lose. I’ve got family and close friends (not shooters or hunters) who have always been sympathetic to the 2nd amendment, and even some of them have bought into the “weapons of war” and “the NRA is bad” crap. Remember, most people who are uniformed, will go with the flow. JM2CW..
I’s say you have the right of it. The NRA are not purists, never have been. They are political which is what we need in this battle. Compromise is the heart of politics and sometimes you have to give a little to survive. We’re going to lose this fight in the long run, but at least let’s drag it out as long as we can. But, you have to realize, many of these mind numbed students are already voting. Many more will vote in the 2020 elections. That will put the liberals firmly in power and they’ll never again let go of it.
A recent television series set in the American Revolution pretty well savaged George Washington in their portrayal of him. So now they are chipping away at the very foundations of our country. The 2nd Amendment is not their goal. It’s just a stepping stone in their agenda. It’s the total transformation of America from what we once knew. They will tear up the despised Constitution and link hands with the UN and announce a new age and a new America.
I was born over 60 years ago as a relatively free American. But, the rot had started even then. I’d like to have a few vestiges of that left when I die, likely not so very long from now. I’m not sure I’ll make it.
Amen!
Try learning about Jury Nullification and pass that information around. fija.org
Do your research – Republicans have passed more anti-gun legislation than Democrats in the last 50 years. Thats a fact. Just like Mark Twain said “It’s easier to fool the people than convince them that they have been fooled.” Republican/”conservative” politicians and their 1% masters have always been the biggest threat to freedom and democracy. Oh and President Barrack Obama never took my guns, never even threatend to – but the sitting Republican President has.
The only reason obummer didn’t take your guns was because of the republicans in congress. Living in Illinois, obummers home state, I can tell you he voted for everything even close to GC during his short term as a legislator. Comments like yours, is why I’m afraid….
I believe their should be a a way to get rid of bump stocks,without mass socialistic configation, maybe ofer a way to get reinbursted for the purchase or a tax credit , something besides draconian confisgation. Not American. We the people should flood our state congess and senate reps, wih email,faxes and one calls, tell them no .sessions and he ATF need tohear fom us.
We must not start travel this path
But, the Leftists will allow Sanctuary Cities for bump-stocks… right?
Great debate. Two cents: As regards PR and organization, GOA, NRA, OK and etc need to coordinate between themselves and then communicate coordinated message to gun-club presidents who then disseminate to members. Would be best way to organize a nation-wide activities… Regarding bump stocks: They destabilize the gun – make it much more difficult to control with real precision. “Gun Control” is controlling the gun, not letting it hiccup all over the place…
It started about 9 years ago. We will be disarmed in less than a generation because the government must have complete control. Other “rights” will fall too.
One of the main reasons that the federal government needs control is the unsustainable debt, which continues to grow. As this debt grows it becomes more important every day that the federal government must disarm the populace in order to save their own bacon. When the government inevitably defaults on its debt, an armed populace will be the nightmare that keeps all politicians awake at night. Our government WILL fail, by its own doing, and we, as law abiding citizens, must be prepared to fight the tyranny that will surely follow.
Trump and the Republican’s objectives were:
MASSIVE tax cut for Corporations and the Wealthy, ( a plan that will bloat the federal deficit by at least $10 trillion over the next decade, even if you factor in economic growth. This will make cuts to Social Security inevitable).
Deregulation for their big banking supporters (who caused the financial meltdown in 2008).
Elimination of regulations on clean air and water, etc.
Their campaign to elect Trump was full of unrealistic and adolescent promises they had no intention, nor hope, of ever instituting (anyone remember that Mexico was going to pay for a wall along its entire northern border?) The Republicans never insisted on tightening border security decades ago, when it may have made a difference, because all that undocumented low cost labor put pressure on, and has all but eliminated union jobs in this country. Meanwhile, the Democrats looked the other way under the guise of humanitarian concerns, while campaigning for, and anticipating millions of future Hispanic voters.
Contrary to the propaganda used to garner your votes, Trump looks out for Trump, and the Republicans look out for the interests of Corporations and the wealthy, not commoners!
The Democrats tend to give lip service to the interests of commoners, but in reality, they represent the interests of the Corporations that fund them as well.
The fight we should, and should have been united against, is to get the money out of government! Checks and balances were put in place by our Founding Fathers, and a lot of citizens died achieving and protecting them, but Corporations have slowly bought all of them up over the past several decades.
Our “Free Press” is owned or controlled by a handful of Corporations!
Our Legislative Branch has been corrupted by the need to raise millions of dollars to fund ridiculously expensive campaigns that amount to little more than propaganda!
Our Executive Branch is beholding to the same Corporations and special interests, despite what Trump claims!
Our Judicial Branch is appointed by the same corrupted politicians mentioned above.
Government must be publicly funded and supported so that it represents the interests of the public, not just Corporations and the elite!
They love things that are easily demonized (like bump stocks and large capacity magazines) because these types of hot bed issues increase the polarization that prevents us from coming together and demanding that our government follows the mandates of our Forefathers!
So, what you are saying, then is, we’re screwed? It’s always the lesser of two evils. Where would we be if hilliary were president?
Yes! well put.. Common citizens don’t have money to buy elected officials, corporations do. Government for the people has been sold out. They may know what you care about and feed it back to you to get and stay elected but they care about the money and their lavish lifestyles and power once in office. They want to divide the people and get them angry and afraid of the other people they don’t understand. The higher the perceived ‘threat level’ wheather from gun grabbers, Islamists, transpeople, China, Mexicans, regulations, government itself… the more control they exert over the population and the harder it is for that population to see what we all have in common and work together for those goals. The thing is, our guns won’t save us, and having no more guns sure won’t save us or ‘them’ either. Getting big money out of politics might save us and allow the people to matter again, to express their concerns and work out the compromises that reasonable democracy is based upon. ‘We the People’ vs. ‘We the Corporate Interests’…
Let’s use the RICO statutes and take politicians money, houses, toys. Should I say our money? They have continued to deny our freedoms, do we need to print wanted posters for the crooked politicians and offer a reward for information leading to a conviction. There are many who know where the bodies are buried. Because your father was a crook, should it automatically be past on to the kid?
Selling a device that is intended to make a semi-automatic firearm into a machine gun is clearly an attempt to bypass the NFA Laws of 1934 that banned ownership of machine guns without a special license from ATF. This equipment should have been regulated at the first instance. It should be the same for bump stocks. There should be a way for those who already own the device to apply for a license to continue to possess it. During the term of the Department of Justice is publishing for public comment a proposed rulemaking that would define ‘machinegun’ to include bump stock-type devices under federal law…” You and all others have the opportunity to comment and ask for a regulation to be included for a “special license” to keep your bump stock. Look up where to make your comments and submit a well-written comment to the DOJ stating your case. If enough people comment they will modify the language in the rules.
And a ban on “Machine guns” isn’t a violation of SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED? Get your head out of your…well, you figure it out.
Bumpstocks are an accessory. Gimicks and accessories have been made for years. This makes me think of the 28th Amendment, where congress and the people who write the laws, screw us out of our freedoms, daily. If they can’t get it done during normal business hours, they have a special session, at 3 AM. while we sleep. To use an accessory as a method of calling a firearm a machinegun is absurd. Keep your hands off the 2nd Amendment, lest you dash you feet on a rock.
There is no 28th amendment. FB can circulate that meme a gazillion times and the amendments still stop at 27.
US CONSTITUTION Article I Section 9 Clause 3. “No ex post facto law shall be passed.”
‘ex post facto legal definition – A law that makes illegal an act that was legal when committed, increases the penalties for an infraction after it has been committed, or changes the rules of evidence to make conviction easier. The Constitution prohibits the making of ex post facto laws.
I said back in October that the whole Vegas evidence pointed to more than one shooter and different locations and was a set up! Now does anyone else see what I meant !? Tyranny starts in small increments then bam, gotcha!
When is a government too big? When the law abiding citizen is turned into a criminal with a stroke of a pen.
Laws are ineffective against those who would break them, yet these elected morons can’t see past their own stupidity.
It is much easier easier for them to create criminals from the law abiding than to actually target the real ones.
Those who swore an oath to defend, protect and support our Constitution should be removed for lying to the American people. But it that will never happen.
If politicians can violate the Second Amendment, which one is next?
Great article, but it should include a direct link to make it easier for us to comment on the Notice of Proposed Rule Making, aka the Trump-Sessions executive decree:
https://www.regulations.gov/comment?D=ATF-2018-0002-0001
Confiscation in 90 days with felony conviction as penalty without due process (congressional and state decision) violates The Constitution and sets a precedent for Liberal fiat to confiscate other weapons in a future Democratic administration. The 2nd Amendment is clear… “shall not be infringed”. Under Article V of The Constitution, the only legal way to dispose of that requirement is a decision by two thirds of the House and Senate that approve of the proposal and is then sent to the states for a vote. Then, three-fourths of the states must affirm the proposed Amendment or change. I voted for President Trump and approve of his performance so far. However, the current proceeding for handling the ban of bump-stocks is unconstitutional and therefore illegal. For many Americans, it is seen as an initial salvo against our 2nd Amendment (and The Constitution in general) and validates the decision to utilize that amendment in the defense of our freedom and The Constitution. It could be said, this development is justification for resistance against tyranny under the provisions of the 2nd Amendment by some Americans and a solemn duty to do so by others under oath to “Support and Defend”…
The State (Guvment, Law enforcement…etc.) would love to make this a felony. They realize those that have these types of toys, have assets that can be taken. I’m not just talking the bump stocks or even the ARs. They will be taking your home, your life’s savings and everything else to supply their never ending need for revenue. It is not about safety it is about revenue and control…. That is what all governments do after a time…and 2A is the only thing that has kept them at bay for so long. But piece by piece 2A is becoming the Bastard Child of The Bill of Rights.
With the exception of the civil war, name me a substantial exercise of firearm ownership on this continent to halt the United States government’s efforts at revenue control.
Don’t put law enforcement in that generalization. Most of us are lifetime NRA members and rabid 2nd amendment supporters who agree with you. We don’t make ANY laws, rules, or ordinances. We don’t “steal property for revenue” we don’t profit from enforcing law. We care about public safety. Be pissed off all you want, I agree with you until you start spouting nonsense like that.
I don’t think he was referring to law enforcement officers, I think he meant law enforcement bureaucrats?
The actions of our politicians and bureaucrats could end up putting you and your fellow officers in some uncomfortable positions however!
Well boys and girls, go to Home Depot and get yourselves a plastic bucket, seal your bumpers in there REAL TIGHT and then go bury it upside down in the back yard because my fellow Americans, BEFORE THE DAWN OF THE FIRST DAY OF 2020, YOU ARE GOING TO NEED THEM. YOU CAN TAKE THAT TO THE INTERNATIONAL BANK!!! “THEY” HAVE “INVESTED” IN 2 MAJOR, COSTLY FALSE FLAGS TO GET THEM AND THEY ARE NOT LETTING UP UNTIL THEY DO. YOUR POTUS HAS DEMONstrated TIME AND AGAIN HE IS NOT THE “LEADER”, NOR THE “FIXER” HE CLAIMED TO BE. YOU ARE BEING SOLD OUT 24/7/365 BY THIS GUY. NOTHING HE IS DOING IS PERMANENT BECAUSE HE ISN’T FIGHTING “DRAIN THE SWAMP” NOR TO BRING THESE “CREATURES” WHO ARE COMMITTING TREASON TO JUSTICE!!! WE ARE THE FROG IN THE POT AND THE WATER IS STARTING TO HEAT UP!!! Y’ALL BETTER GET YOURSELVES READY FOR WHAT’S COMING AS IT’S NOW WRITTEN IN STONE. THERE IS NO WAY AROUND IT. “THEY” WILL TAKE THE MID-TERMS AND TRUMP WILL BE DOING THE NIXON SHUFFLE BY THIS TIME NEXT YEAR. THEN THE FAUCETS WILL OPEN.
Oregon will have a voter initiative on the 2018 November ballot to ban Assault Rifles and crimialize ownership of existing banned firearms. The State of Oregon will be effectively disarmed.
I may not give a crap about “bump stocks” especially since I see from Youtube that you don’t even need them to bump fire a rifle. And you can actually, according to Jerry Miculek train your finger to be just about as fast as one that is emptying a 30 round magazine. Since I don’t own one, why should I care? Well here is why I care. First off, to make someone a felon like this is plain BS. We have a Constitution that strictly bans Ex Post Facto Laws right in it. Anyone can see that this is an ex post facto law. 2nd thing is that not one singe bump stock has ever been used in a crime. NOT ONE. Oh, I know, there is a picture of one on a rifle in Las Vegas, but guess what? According to people who have checked if you put a big pod on a rifle with a bump stock it makes the rifle to heavy for it to work right. That’s right, it makes it malfunction. SOOOOO….that sort of shows that a bump stock wasn’t used in Vegas. Friends that have military experience all say it was a belt fed machine gun. 3rd…we ALL need to start learning about the power of the jury. No one can face 10 years in a cage for this without having the right to a jury trial. Even if you have to lie to get on the jury, (a prosecuting attorney asking if you ever heard about jury nullification or whatever question he/she may be using to keep you from being on the jury…LIE) you can either HANG the jury, making the government that has the unlimited funds they create out of thin air, retry the guy or convince the rest of the jury to hand down a NOT GUILTY verdict. I’ve see the bump fire OK letter from the ATF. It’s available on line. If I owned one of those things I take my copy right to jury and let them read it. EX POST FACTO LAWS ARE UNLAWFUL under the Constitution. Banning a “thing” that does nothing is nothing but a THOUGHT CRIME and is a violation of EVERYONE’S RIGHTS. If “they” can ban a thing by a “law” when no victim is shown, they can ban whatever they want.
The way things are going the young generation better wake up.
Stop attacking the NRA. Disagreements on policy positions should be debated freely. But attacks on a vital ally that defends a basic right are out of bounds.
Regardless of the eventual outcome,….there will be MASSIVE non-compliance. In case you are a little slow on the uptake here,…this signals the start of the next “Revolutionary” conflict. Only this time it won’t be fought with muskets….
Another stupid idea from the Trump people. Do you know that when they take our guns away, only bad\mails will have guns.
I brought my gun stock when it was legal and no one is taking it away from me. You can not get all the guns in America. their are millions. And it is our right to have them.
Sessions and his Department of Just Us can blow me…I’m not turning in shit.
It’s not the bump stock, it’s not this or that, it’s a corrupt government taking more of our rights by the minute.
People just don’t get it, every time someone says, I don’t care about that thing, as long as they don’t come for my thing.
They are coming for your thing! Every time you give them an inch, they take mile’S, people need to wake up, but then again, it’s probably to late.
Our corrupt government is taking our guns, taking our second amendment, taking our rights.
We are not a free country like we fought for, our forefathers who died fighting for our rights are looking down on us right now, tears streaming down their faces saying, grow a backbone man, and kick some fucking ass, or roll over and be a bitch, because that sharp pain you’re about to feel, is your government celebrating how easy it was to punk you out
Just as we know that the NRA and a growing number of Republicans are part of the problem, you can see from the comments on this article that certain gun owners are too. Don’t like a certain firearm or accessory? Jump on the “Ban It!” Bandwagon! As if their compromising chickens won’t come home to roost in their own gun safes before the fascists are through! Ladies and gentlemen, keep working toward a peaceful and pro-liberty solution, but prepare wisely should politicians and activists force us on another course.
First they come for bumpstocks then they take your belt loops.
It’s out in the open and democrats are openly calling for repeal of the 2nd amendment.
Anyone reading this that isn’t a member of the NRA should think about a membership.
Even though they dropped the ball on bump stocks they and the millions of members of the NRA are one of the only effective things that stand between you and total gun confiscation.
Or you can choose to be a freeloader and let others do your heavy lifting.
Last time I posted this I was responded to by a liberal who condemned the NRA and said he lobbied his senators with his opinion. I respect him for that, we all should let them know how we feel ALONG with a NRA/ GOA membership.
https://membership.nra.org/
There are two Constitutional problems with this. First, it is a “taking” without compensation, in violation of the 5th Amendment. And it is an ex post facto law in violation of sections 9 & 10 of Article I.
An ex post facto law is a law that retroactively changes the legal consequences (or status) of actions that were committed, or relationships that existed, before the enactment of the law. In criminal law, it may criminalize actions that were legal when committed.
Has anyone ever seen a gun of any type shot by it’s self. But because poeple are to blame they want to push it off on something that can not speak or write or blame the company that make the item .
Bump stock ban is a symbol of oppression. Congress refuses to fund a wall between U.S. and Mexico to stop illegal immigration but they want to rebuild the Berlin wall in the name of the bump stock ban? Anyone supporting this ban is a commie and it show the the red menace is alive and well int the U.S today.
Exaggerate much? I understand (and agree) with the basis of your post, but your cry seems to be more ‘wolf’ than facts.
Honestly???? Who the FUCK are YOU BULLSHITTING??? Saying he’s “Crying Wolf” when the FACTS are RIGHT IN FRONT OFYOUR STUPID, IGNORANT FACE!!! Or are you a PAID PROSTITUTE for “Them” who goes around calling GOOD, RIGHTEOUS AMERICANS “CONSPIRACY NUTS”??? Area 52 is SPOT ON CORRECT!!! It’s SHITHEADS LIKE YOU who are the REASON THEY ARE WINNING!!! And “They” ARE winning!!! ASSHOLE!!!!
Exactly right.
The issue is the word “NEED”…. . No, I do not “need” a bump stock. Donnie tRump does not need another million dollars, NO, but that does not stop Agent Orange from perusing more money? . I do not need a car, no, but it makes life easier and more enjoyable. . The word “need” has to be removed from the conversation. Freedom means the ability to satisfy one’s wants and “needs”.
Today îts bump stocks tomorrow it’s your AR-15.
Actually, it will probably be magazines, or more likely ammunition. Already, a Democrat lawmaker has said “…there is nothing in the 2nd Amendment protecting bullets (sic)”
True..true..true. They are starting to with this and end up up with all banned. Soon we can only have a baseball bat.
If you don’t like it, get out and vote in every election. And make sure those you vote for believe in and support opur Constitution, because most of the current elected officials don’t fully support our Constitution, they just give lip service to the concept. Vote, Vote, Vote!
I’m a large advocate of the NRA, I love guns and have a unique collection of rifles, handguns, shotguns, and more. This unique collection however, is not the modern collection you would expect. The collection is entirely historical, with guns from WW1, WW2, Korea, and Vietnam. I’m sorry to everyone that owns a bump stock addition to their firearm, but quite honestly it’s a good decision to ban them. look and listen to Ronald Reagan’s speech at USC in February of 1989. We don’t need to take away the guns for home defense and the wepons that hunters use, but I do not believe that a machine gun should be used for home defense or for hunters. This is obvious as there are plenty other options for home defense (probably the best being a shotgun) and plenty of options for hunters rifles (Specifically the bolt action as using an automatic firearm is almost unfair to other hunters as you have an advantage, it almost like cheating if you miss a shot.
I meant to say should not here is the link to his speech https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=nG4V_6pCLVo
Where does it mention “hunters” in the 2nd Amendment? You sound more like a Joe Biden than a Joe Bailey. Do you also advocate firing your home defense shotgun in the air?
We have to take advise from you what best to use for SD and Hunting? Not your way of thinking. Collection of firearms are not limited to relics. Any law abiding citizens are free to collect whatever pleases them as long as they comply with what the 2nd A and regulation*** allow them. Your 1st A right seems to nudge law abiding 2nd A right.
“The right of the people to bear arms shall not be infringed.” Tell me how this isn’t infringement! .The Founding Fathers knew we needed guns for a variety of reasons. But the most important reason was so WE could form militias should WE need to protect “the state” (our new government, and our God given, Constitutional rights). “Regulated miltia refers to the way militias and armies fought – in regulated lines – not possible with pitchforks and torches They wanted us to have weapons every bit as deadly as our enemies. So the ban on full auto guns is an infringement too.
The argument goes something like this, it has previously been ruled that Bump stocks are not firearms but merely a part that can be added to a firearm in order to modify the rate of fire. Therefore it is no more an infringement of the right to bear arms than banning bayonets on civilian firearms. Aftermarket modifications don’t equate with a general class of commonly owned, factory produced, firearms. I’m not agreeing with their NPRM, just answering your question.
No, well regulated as it meant at the time referred to well trained, I.e., the person knew how to handle their firearm, and properly equipped, I.e., having sufficent powder and ball.
You’re incorrect in that assertion. “Commonly used to describe the Napoleonic era British foot soldiers, the British Regulars were known for their distinct red uniform and well-disciplined combat performance.” To be a “well regulated militia” meant being equipment and trained in the same manner as other foot soldiers of the day, the British soldiers being the example in reference as they were the opposing force.
The only thing I have to say is READ “Behold A Pale Horse” by William Cooper written in 1991. Later died a convenient death.
Download the PDF and go to page 225 and read the first paragraph…..
“The government encouraged the manufacture and importation of
military firearms for the criminals to use. This is intended to foster a
feeling of insecurity, which would lead the American people to voluntarily
disarm themselves by passing laws against firearms. Using drugs and
hypnosis on mental patients in a process called Orion, the CIA inculcated
the desire in these people to open fire on schoolyards and thus inflame the
antigun lobby. This plan is well under way, and so far is working perfectly.
The middle class is begging the government to do away with the 2nd
amendment.”
You already know Obama was caught giving guns to the drug cartel, but who else did they give guns to?
Really? You’re going to bald face lie and try to assert that it was President Obama who personally distributed firearms to Mexican drug cartels? Try this instead, “The FBI, in a poorly conceived attempt to track firearms shipments to Mexican drug cartells, delivered automatic weapons to cartel members.” Unless you’re willing to assign the current mistakes of the FBI to the current sitting President, try to stay within the boundaries of facts.
Are my jeans now a machine gun? The problem is a semi-auto rifle can be “bump fired” by looping your trigger finger through a belt loop and pulling the rifle forward. Never mind the fact, that it can only be aimed in a general direction. –Lots of videos on youtube.
As for the rule making. Consider it a good thing. The alternative is new legislation which would likely impact all semi-autos. –Speaking of new legislation, the 2nd amendment groups should be asking for reasonable restrictions against the media for sensationalizing mass tragedies, as the continuous in your face coverage only serves to encourage another event .
WHY DO THEY MAKE CARS THAT CAN DO 180 MILES PER HOUR BECAUSE PEOPLE LIKE THEM BECAUSE IT’S NICE TO KNOW THEY CAN SHOULD WE BAN THEM?
Current Bump Stock owners should be Grandfathered but stop anyone making them as of April 15 2018
Obama, Hillary, Trump, exactly which of these people did you fear would make 2nd amendment weaker and “take our guns”? Think!
Bump stocks were legal, some people purchased them, just for fun. I never wanted one. Here is the problem. 2017 Bump stock legal. 2018 bump stock illegal, you are a required to turn them in to government. 2020. AR15 & AK47 are illegal, you are a required to turn them in to government. 2021 .223/5.56 & 7.62×39 ammo is illegal, you are a required to turn them in to government. 2023, all semi-automatic guns, pistols, rifles & shotguns and ammo is illegal, you are a required to turn them in to government. 2030 all firearms, air riles and bb guns are illegal, you are a required to turn them in to government.
2035, Get in the boxcar, off to re-education camp for all conservatives and other undesirables. Think it can’t happen? In started the first time in 1935. It can happen again.
Every law abiding owner of bump stocks should go, take or send their property to a sanctuary city. They won’t be touched there.
If we thinking Americans can’t stop this ban, I worry about my fellow law enforcement comrades and military brothers and sisters who will be ordered to confiscate and make criminals out of so many.
Oh whoa is me!
Well, This certainly puts the camel’s hump under the tent. NFA was the nose.
He doesn’t have enough money for a wall yet he will need to, at least, quadruple federal penitentiaries for holdouts? Scare tactics if you ask me.
we have kids trying to write laws on guns most of which have been dumded down by left wing libs (fed edu) i voted against hillary may not be able to vote for repub i don’t believe i will ever vote for dem i’m 73 yrs old & if people young & old don’t wake up you will have the wealthy elitetist & poor if we will start executing these animals who does this kind of violence you will see violence reduced
Fire up the lawyers. Of course that is what this is all about. Lawyers got to make more money.
my god,,the tin foil hat crew is here in full force,LOL.those bump stocks were junk anyways,they catered to the poor redneck who can’t afford a REAL full auto,good thing they are getting banned,takes a bit of the heat off NORMAL minded AR owners,at least the tin foil hat on to tight crowd is a VERY SMALL percentage of gun owners,and dont matter much in the voting process,so let them cry,calmer heads will make sure the 2nd stays alive and well.and NO,,bump stocks are not a firearm i agree,but they do turn a regular AR into as close to a FA as you can get if you can’t afford the real deal.which is why they’ll be banned,so not every wacko can just go out and buy one to cause damage and further reduce our cause,now if you do own a bump stock sure as hell would NOT turn it in,no matter what the overlords say,and i’m pretty sure these thing will be hidden away and enjoyed in the country by the people who saved them,and it’s not like they are to terribly hard to make yourselves,yes,it’s apisser that we can be regulated this way,but that’s just the way it is,,and as much as some of you think you have your small revolution,the fact is,that’s never going to happen in any numbers to affect anything,the government makes the rules and there’s not a whole hell of a lot we can do about it,other than vote the ones we dont want out,but then,how do you know the next one wont be as bad once elected,so the only thing left,is if you’re a serious gun enthousiast,KEEP what you have no matter what,dont let them win,the more they see NON complinace,the more they’ll realize,the people are ARMED and always will be,,so THEY need to thread lightly,
Its funny… We have more racial hatred than I can remember in my life time. Although, being a competitive shooter and around large numbers of guys of many colors all the time, we all get along wonderfully. In fact, I can’t think of a single firearms enthusiast I know (and I know a very large number) who isn’t a peace loving individual. It seems most (99%) of the problems we have stem from politicians and the media…not us individuals out here in the world trying to make a good life for our families. So…instead of saying things like, they better not come for my guns, etc. etc., why do I never hear anyone say, they are ready to fight back against the individuals creating this problem…the traitorous politicians??? No, not by voting them out and voting in another traitor. By literally fighting back. At some point, that will be the ONLY thing left to do. And it seems we are getting very close to that point.
2 nd Amendment, is all ready gutted it was intended for we the people to own and posses weapons period.
Just to add and be clear I believe we the people should be able to own machine guns, if our military has it we should have it, 2A is about resisting a tyrannical government and self defense. Not a sport or hunting.
Amen brother!!
I am a soldier and lifetime member of the NRA. I believed Bump Stocks are a piece of junk and no sportsman in thier right mind would purchase one. It does not make my firearm more accurate, safer, or more reliable. I don’t even like the three round burst with a service rifle. I enjoy the sport, and will work to get young people into the sport so that they know the responsibility of owning and using a firearm. Teach going d marksmanship skills so that they can compete if they desire and have some skills that our military needs. No one I have competed with or gone hunting with would never consider a bump stock, I have to question the judgement of anyone who did. Just remove them, cut them up a bit, take pictures and throw the the junk into the recycling bin. When you are serious about the sport and respect the weapons we use, you might just enjoy it, oh and don’t mention you ever purchased a bump stock
So because you don’t like them our freedoms should be suppressed? my goodness what happened to shall not be infringed or is that not fitting your ideals either?
Well I don’t own a bump stock but I do own Ar-15’s and Ak-47’s. I am troubled by this action. I know I would not be turning in anything freely! This corrupt Government should open it’s check book up! Why is there not a lawsuit against the Fed’s the States and the Manufacturers of these bump stocks. This isn’t only about rights but money too! I paid for it; pay me!
“When you are serious about the sport…”
It’s not about sport numb-nuts, it’s about preserving liberty.
Well said. I could not agree with you more!
As all people who believe in the Constitution should!
So..your entire basis of ‘ liberty and freedom’ fall on whether or not you have a bumpstock?
Thats pathetic.
Fellow shooter here as well.
Toss the bunpstocks in the garbage
This old ‘Nam Marine says “EXACTLY”!!!
Exactly! WTF does “sport” have to do with it? What part of “shall not be infringed” does this “sport” shooter not understand! It’s not about a POS bump stock! They start there and next they take away our high cap mags and then they take our ammo.. wake up man it’s called death by 1000 cuts, stand up now! don’t wait until they take something you value away.. because I promise you, by then it will be too late!
You claim to be a soldier and NRA member; I’m surprised you missed the target ENTIRELY. You obviously do not recall, AT ALL, the evolution of the bump stock from its inception as merely a plywood cutout and a few rubber bands. You also fail to address how easily that underground elements can too easily make operable weapons in their basements or wherever, let alone the bumpstocks. Those nefarious elements of society are merely the low-grade “miner’s canaries” who remind us how far off course our ship has gone, so to speak. Those “miner’s canaries”, unfortunately, especially include politicians, who all too often forget what it was they were elected to do.
The issue was NEVER about the firearms; it was ALWAYS about the oppression by people who have lost any sense of democratic civility and social responsibility and I refer here to politicians and bureaucrats who STILL, after thousands of years of mankind pretending to have philosophically evolved beyond evil, continue to abuse the God given rights of those they have pretended to possess the managerial acumen to manage. Apparently, we still feel we need politicians in order to keep the wheels of civilization turning, but they are a constant reminder of man’s own dark side.
The difference between guns and not having guns is the personal and civil discipline we use as individuals to not abuse them, and yet, without them, we run the risk of letting a lack of political discipline on the part of would be tyrants to enslave us all. If you still haven’t caught on, they key word here is DISCIPLINE, and while you seem to gloat over the claim of being a soldier, you are, in heart anyway, a gun-toting Liberal.
Sorry there, Sport, but NONE of this conversation is about “the sport”.
The same thing can be said about anybody putting a better stock,scope,extra magazines,sling etc.etc.etc.!If it’s not your thing,then ban it?Come on brother,that’s just where it starts
PC is obviously a Democrat plant, or just an idiot who didn’t read a single word in the article….
A democratic plant? If we don’t all agree with you then you have to throw a label. Everything PC said is correct, and as a veteran I thank him for his service. And his opinion is welcome here. He fought for the right for you to express your opinion. Stop bashing people and recognize the right of free speech. And bump stocks are a piss poor reason to attack a vet.
You are part of the problem. So what if you don’t care about bumpstocks? Plenty of people do. I don’t own one or plan to own one, but I don’t support a ban. ONE person used bumpstocks for evil despite thousands of them being in the hands of the public. You are no better than the politicians who want to restrict or revoke the rights of citizens because they themselves don’t exercise those rights or will be unaffected by said restriction & revocations. Just wait, when they’re coming for something near & dear to you, remember you supported their incremental & insatiable method of infringement.
And bootlickers like you are what’s gonna cost us all of our rights.
Bravo Sierra, pure, unadulterated Bravo Sierra.
I have a feeling there is going to be a lot of canisters buried in back yards all over America for the eventuality of the need our Founders envisioned when crafting the 2nd Amendment.
Go pound sand PC. You are at best a Fudd, but more than likely a liar and own no guns.
I don’t like bump stocks and I don’t own one, but they are not a machine gun by any stretch of the word and the language used in the NPRM bans all kinds of aftermarket parts by simply redefining by changing the language of certain parts of the laws established by Congress – which neither Sessions nor the President can do legally because that entails a Congressional amendment to a law.
It is this type of demagoguery that allows further infringement to occur – easily, swiftly. Not that you care, since like I said above, I doubt you own guns, much less support anything involving the 2nd unless it is the dismantling of it.
Go back to tumblr and twitter where you can espouse your astroturf position to the jackasses who will fall for it.
So, you’re cool with something you own that is legal now, being deemed illegal and you now must destroy it or face prison if the “rules” change.
Spectacular.
Nor very smart, are you !
While i agree that bump stocks are nothing but a gimmick, and a way to waste ammo for no other purpose than to put a goofy grin on someone’s face, i disagree with banning them. What’s next? Light weight/short reset match triggers? Then the AR15/10 platforms? Then semi autos all together? At what point do you draw the line? Just because i don’t care for something, it doesn’t mean someone else shouldn’t be able to have one if they so choose. It’s a very slippery slope that once headed down, there’s no stopping or turning back.
If you are truly a soldier (from the USA) and an NRA life member, you would know the 2nd amendment has nothing to do with sport. It is the stumbling block to the fall of the rest of the bill of rights.
Hmm, so if next time, some clown in the WH determines with his mighty pen he doesn’t like your sporting rifle you teach with, you Okay with that? I don`t own a bump-stock. Never did, never will, but I don`t agree with what Trump is doing. He hasn’t the right. Oh, and by the way, I`m prior military and a lifetime member of the NRA and GOA.
I would also suggest you read or view on Youtube the interview that G. Edward Griffin did with Norman Dodd when he was lead investigator of the Reese Committee in 1953. Dodd’s function was to research any un-American activities of charitable foundations. He and his colleagues found the mythical Pandora;s Box. You really need to read the whole thing:
http://www.supremelaw.org/authors/dodd/interview.htm
Your rationalization supporting a bump stock ban is far less popular than the “common sense” call for a ban on ARs (closely followed by a ban on every other scary “assault rifle”). Libs never go for the whole enchilada. They take one bite at a time to feed their insatiable appetite.
I was a soldier and am a member of the NRA. Everything I dont like should be banned. Grrrrr.
PC, you sound like a liberal. Just the fact you don’t own or like bump stocks does not make you an authority on them. I do not possess a bump stock but do not condemn anyone who does. Your opinion is not law. If I had a bump stock, I would not let a boot licker like you define me. Are you also for banning rubber bands and belt loops? You completely miss the ramifications of what is taking place. This is just an inroad to take apart the 2nd. It is not the government’s or your right to tell me something is legal and then take it away just because some dumb shits like yourself don’t like it.
Reality check here guys. Bump stocks are not firearms. Don’t get me wrong on the 2A. I have been an NRA member since 1969.
We do have bigger fish to fry and accessories such as this do not help out cause with the general public.
A couple guys mention hunting in their comments. I am of the opinion, the industry pushing the AR format as a hunting arm has perhaps even hurt our cause. Remember folks, 95% of Americans do not hunt and we have to be mindful of that if we do not want them mandating to us. It up to us in some cases to self regulate.
The masses do not know the true intent of the 2A and quite frankly….they do not care.
1st really objective rational comment I have read so far, try finding the dictionary definition of “machinegun” and show me where it includes the descriptive term “bump stock” …..
Folks, from the very beginning of this government charade, the only origin of the term “bump stock” is the one that the original Manufacturer tagged onto his product when he decided to start producing it. So, here we have a commercial descriptive name for a new product being used arbitrarily to designate something called a “machine gun”?? A bump stock is NOT a GUN, my fellow Americans, it is merely an ACCESSORY! Much like a scope to give a better sight picture for distance shooting or a sling to assist in carrying a weapon, or a cotton patch to help clean the fouling and debris from the barrel, they are ALL ACCESSORIES FOR A WEAPON!! As such, a scope is NOT a MACHINEGUN, a sling is NOT a MACHINEGUN, and a cotton patch is NOT a MACHINEGUN and the same goes for ANY other accessory for ANY other weapon, handgun, rifle, or other weapon used to launch a projectile into the air!
I also don’t own this rifle accessory, I don’t own any rifle on which this accessory would ever fit in any way, shape, or form, and, if I DID own an AR or AK type weapon, I wouldn’t have the foggiest urge to buy one of these ammo burning ACCESSORIES to install on my weapon!
Man has a few inherent flaws in his character and one of these flaws is this: he finds something that enhances something which he really likes to do and he can’t seem to keep his big mouth shut about it! I know it’s really ego boosting to brag about catching the biggest fish ever but a smart man will keep the fishing hole where he caught his whopper to himself. It will give a man a really warm fuzzy feeling to present his dearly beloved with a “new” fashion accessory for their anniversary but a smart man will not share that he found that “new” ring on Craigslist [NEW! NEVER WORN!] or bought that super smelling bath oil online from “Oils ‘r Us”.
But, in the few years I remember reading about this new innovative gun stock, there has been nothing but speed test videos by various people and groups, bragging rights of how fast some guy fired his el cheapo AR using a bump stock, or some other “open skull, check for brain” idiot spouting off “how easy it was to buy one of these “neat new stocks” for my already fast firing .223 or .556 shootin’ iron!!”
I was an avid hunter and outdoorsman from a very early age up to age 25 when I was discharged from the military. I had sold or given most of my guns to friends to keep for me when I enlisted but, after returning home, I found that I had lost the interest or maybe the urge to kill other warm blooded beings. So I didn’t return to the hunt. I have killed small pests when the need arose but I have not, since 1968, bought a hunting license or participated in any wild game hunt. My choice, nothing more, nothing less, I just didn’t feel a need. I had so many other ways to enjoy the outdoors, and to be truthful, if I was invited on a pig hunt tomorrow, I would give it some careful thought. I find feral pigs to be a nuisance in many areas of this country AND I love a good grilled slab of ribs or a smoked backstrap once in awhile. But hunting for other than the need for food for a family over the winter is not one of my activities any longer and hasn’t been for 50 years.
And to finish, I found this sentence to be very important to me: “It up to us in some cases to self regulate.” Guys, if we can’t keep a careful rein on our own responsibilities as citizens who took on the ownership and use of firearms AND call out those we see who abuse the responsibility of that ownership, then that small minority CAN and WILL make more trouble for the rest of us than anything else I can think of that we could ignore doing for the health and safety of the sport. How many shooting tragedies did it take for this president to be convinced that the ONLY way to solve the “problem” is to OUTLAW the accessory using any means available to him and his constituents including arbitrary CONFISCATION?
I have heard, so many times, someone say to me, “But what can I do, I am only ONE person??” Well, take a closer look at what ONE MAN CAN DO!!! You may want to re-read the first few sentences on page 3 of the 55 page bill in question provided above. This proposed ban on bump stocks, as being “machineguns”, was single handedly brought about by one man shooting up a crowd of people in Las Vegas last October and killing or injuring almost 900 of them!! ….. ONE MAN!!! ….. LESS THAN 6 MONTHS AGO!!! ….. And it didn’t take the cogs of government to mesh and turn so rapidly as to bring about a CONFISCATION OF SOMEBODY’S PERSONAL POSSESSIONS mere MONTHS later!!!
WAKE UP AMERICA!! BEFORE YOU HAVE LOST ALL THAT YOU THOUGHT YOU HAD FOR RIGHTS IN THIS LAND AND ARE SCRATCHING YOUR SUBSERVIENT HEADS WONDERING WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED …..
I understand some of the furor over this as it is a start. However, I see no need to own one personally and would not buy one legal or illegal.
A possible need? How about as a tool to lay down suppressive cover fire in the event we do end up in a civil war to keep the 2A….operational success or failure depends upon deployment of all available assets…bump stocks are a necessary tool we hope to never have a use for…you don’t get rid of a fire extinguisher just because you never use it.
“Some of my friends in the gun community already believe the war is lost. That it’s only a matter of time before our 2A rights are a thing of the past.”
You mean that your 2nd Amendment rights will be restricted beyond what they would consider “reasonable”.
“The Sky is falling” “The Sky is falling”. The gun industry and all its pardners and a new generation or two of shooters and gun owners are their own worse enemy. They believe all this horse shit about the government coming to take your guns put out by the NRA and all the dooms day believers in order to sell more crap and gain more members.. So now we got a new generation running around in the woods in no see me suits carrying every type of automatic weapon they make all to the smiles of the manufactures and the NRA who run to the bank with pockets full of cash… We as Americans are so screwed when we listen to these assholes that we run out and buy every damn gimmick they put out including bump stocks. Everyone has their own taste thats what makes up Americans… I purchased an AR-15 years ago and kinna liked the rifle but thought to myself what in hell do I want this for and ended up selling it to the local Sheriff’s Dept and went back enjoying my 788 Remington.. The NRA should do more to intercept all the crap out there and should have taken the lead in getting rid of bump stocks.. That is one of the reason after 70 years I no longer carry a NRA card. We will be a constant struggle until people and the gun industry both wise up and quit trying to get around federal gun regulations .
Well, aren’t you the ultimate Fudd!?! You don’t care about an AR15, so no one else should. How much are they paying you to plant these communist thoughts and to attempt to derail the obvious logic. Once the average man is sufficiently disarmed, those with control of arms will gladly nail your coffin shut. They will spit on your constitution and toss it in the hole with you, and have your brother cover you both with dirt. Then they will bury him too. All of the politicians and SPECIAL people will be all that’s left,…and maybe a few lucky bootlickers.
Fake gun owner…. propagandist…commie retard…bolt actions are not going to preserve popular sovereignty….
Popular sovereignty or the sovereignty of the people’s rule is the principle that the authority of a state and its government is created and sustained by the consent of its people, through their elected representatives (Rule by the People), who are the source of all political power.
In other words, if you voted for Trump, you empowered him to appoint Jeff Sessions and his NPRM. That is Popular Sovereignty at work.
Fake gun owner my ass… Ive attended more gun shows and bought, traded and sold more fire arms over the last 55 years than most of the cowboys on here. besides having a FFL license for several years. I was just making a point that the industry is constant in trying to find some way to get around federal regulations. and I never said no one should own a AR-15 I just said I had no use for it. an example is making your own untraceable firearm. People who go for that shit are defeating the purpose of gun ownership and falling into the trap that the anti gunners want. When you ass holes make comments on here about killing police, and threats against authority you are just proving my point of how far you are moving the legal gun owner into the gutter. And Guns America you should never in hell allow such comments on these posts.
Depending on where you live, they already have. In N.Y. you can’t purchase a lever or pump action centerfire rifle if it holds more than 10 rounds in it’s fixed magazine. This is no semi-auto with a bump stock. A Winchester 1873 in 357mag is one example. I’m sure you’re ok with that also. This is all besides the fact that the 2nd amendment has nothing to do with sports or duck hunting. It has everything to to with Americans remaining free people in a sovereign nation.
So when telescopes are deemed “sniper accessories” you’ve already got iron sights ready to get mounted.
Or when “armor piercing ammunition” is made illegal, you’re ready to “chop up and destroy” that “armor piercing military style sniper rifle”.
#askingforafriend
“Before a standing army can rule, the people must be disarmed, as they are in almost every country in Europe. the supreme power in America cannot enforce unjust laws by the sword because the whole body of the people are armed, and constitute a force superior to any band of regular troops”
The Federalist Constitution October 10, 1787
I tried to warn people of all this talk and it started over 25 years ago to get to this point. Were here now what are “We The People” going to do about ti? Voting sure hasn’t helped!
To those who say they don’t care because they don’t own bump fire stocks, or think they are junk, or silly, or unnecessary, please refer to pastor Martin Niemoller’s quote from WW2: “First they came. . .” Once they come for everyone else, and no one stands up because “it’s not important to me”, when they finally come for you, you will be alone and there will be no one remaining to stand with you.
I have several points to make:
1 This is a war inwhich communism is playing a large role, ( they don’t realize they are communists but are, Liberals).
2 They want Absolute Power, like The Former Soviet Union, where the masses have all the same, ( nothing) and the government has everything. That way they can pass any law and there isn’t anything you can do about it.
3 the major breakdown to our country has already began by the depletion of sound reliable news, which was supposed to be a means to inform the public, not a propaganda machine for for the would be or want to be Government.
They lie to the masses and everyone falls into line.
4 These Absolutists will do anything to take total control, including killing us.
5 They are in fact, trying to disarm us, and it is happening behind the scenes by inlarging the list of citizens who are prohibited from owning firearms. Take a look at those stipulations, and how easy it is to get on it, and how hard it is to get off it.
6 Bump stocks are not the first. Automatic
Firearms are so expensive that only rich people can have them, so that being fact,
They have already denied us of our 2A righ, alone, by pricing us out of them, and other fire arms will be on the “Too Expensive list” very soon.
7 Education of our children is being weaponized by the Communist, (remember, they don’t realize they are communists). They think that they are showing our kids a better way, but in fact, this “Better Way” has been tried and tried again all across the globe, but where they seldom don’t teach History, no one seems to realize that. Or do they?
Last I checked, The Communist Party was not aloud to hold a Political Office in the USA (may be wrong, but don’t think so),
So why aren’t the keepers of law trying to inforce that, unless they are part of the problem.
I apologize for the rant, and agree or not,
It’s happening.
We really have to pay attention and read between the lines. This war has created a real division in the country, and the enemy knows it and encourages it because all the way down through history, devide and conquer has always worked, and trust me, this time is no different.
So true…
Very well said.
It is worth repeating, sharing everywhere.
Is that you, John McCarthy?
Who is John? Was that Joe’s brother?
McCarthyism (Joseph) is maybe what we need.
A smarter approach of course.
I believe that the ones who do know what they are, want nothing more than the destruction of our country, so they can pick up the pieces, reconstruct them into a Absolutist’s
Wet dream.
The left already use a form of McCarthyism.
Every time they yell “racist” or
“Homophobe”, they are doing damage without any proof of their accusations, but it is intended to discredit the opposition without a any foundation of a substantial argument.
Folks, please don’t drink the liberal coolaid and start trying to determine what I “need”. If we open that door, Freedom will not last long. If you think the liberals will stop after bump stocks, you are sadly mistaken.
If you think banning bump stock is common sense regulation, please review the facts. Out of all the public shootings that I recall, a bump stock was used in one. My common sense tells me that one more law aimed at bump stocks or a certain type of rifle or the capacity of a magazine or how much ammunition an American citizen can own will do absolutely nothing to control this problem of the heart. My common sense tells me that instead of focusing on what law abiding citizens do not need, if we intend to really address the problem, we should be discussing what law breakers and criminals do need and that is accountability. We should start at the very top of our lawless government in Washington with the obvious wide spread corruption and continue through every thug who protest by breaking the law and destroying the property and who interrupt the businesses of law abiding folk.
We also need our school children to be taught a sense of Patriotism and respect for others before it is too late for our Country. That is what my common sense tells me; we should address the cause of the problem rather than to make some addition restriction against individuals that are already following the law.
Wake up America and we better get off our hands and face this very real treat to our Freedom head on. Thank you NRA and thank you TN Firearms Association for sounding the battle cry.
Bumpstocks were absolutely used in Las Vegas
The NRA isn’t the only pro gun organization in the USA. If you don’t like what they are doing, join GOA or National Organization for Gun Rights or whatever. Just join something that suits you, that fights for us.
because of one person who uses the bumpstock illegally we have to ruin it for all the law abiding ones. thats the corrupt politics….just go out in kill someone in the name of gun of gun control and get your political way……….instead of blaming the person where the real problem is
HA! You dumba$$es voted for the ‘tard who’s POTUS and now you’re whining when he takes away your “toy”, which endangers everyone around it?
Do you know what the military defines anything that makes the rifle or sidearm fire outside the manufacturer’s specs? A MALFUNCTION. Your toy/malfunction enabled the deaths of 58 and the wounding of 851…in one incident.
You have no rights to modifications to firearms protected under the Second Amendment. And if your “toys”, which enabled these mass deaths, continue to contribute to further deaths you will see your Second Amendment rights forfeited.
In the meantime…HA! You voted for the a$$clown in office and he’s taking away your toys! Obama didn’t do that, did he?!
Practically every mass shooter is a Democrat, as are the vast majority of inner city thugs who collectively commit mass shootings on a weekly basis. And they do so in Marxist Democrat controlled cess pools which surrendered most of their 2A rights decades ago. A rotten, father-lacking culture is the root of our moral decay. And the responsibility for that rot falls squarely on the shoulders of Marxist filth like yourself.
You’re either intentionally lying or repeating lies. The facts are that mass shooters as a group don’t have a particular political leaning and the ones who survive don’t describe political ideology as a motivation. Get off the Faux bandwagon.
You sound awfully happy. Cowards like you will soon lose your rights also. Oh wait your a Democrat your party murders millions of babies each year, Assist in medical suicides, want open borders and, protect illegals in this country. Yet you all are more than happy to see American citizens imprisoned for exercising their 2nd amendment rights.I will never use my firearm to protect any anti-gun democrat even if it was a President or any other democrat politician or Liberal period. I would not want to offend them so I could not possibly defend them.
This is a warm up people! If bump stocks can be classified as machine guns, then assault type rifles will be next! Then all guns may be made illegal by redefining what a gun is. Australia has done this same thing, especially when it comes to mass shootings to promote their ideology of gun control. They just change the definition of what a mass shooting is. Banning bump sticks will do nothing to stem the tide of violence. More guns has proving to make things safer.
I have dealt with guns most of my life. 55 years to be correct. All the manufactures have don everything in their power to product parts to enable ar’s and the like to fire faster. They keep pushing the envelope and are making it extremely hard to say we need these devices. The guns issue is exactly like the smoking issues of the past. raising the price of cigarettes, making it illegal to smoke in government builds, then public buildings, then not in public. soon they will be ban and I myself could care less. But this is how our government works. Take a little and loos a lot. I guarantee that this bill will have 70 pages of other bull that will make a lot of guns illegal. I don’t understand how these people think. The crime rate in our country is way down. These evil idiots that kill school children would have done it with knives if a gun was not available. Stop blaming guns and understand, the socialist government has taken punishment from the school, punishment from the parents, and god from the schools. What do these kids have to be afraid of. Nothing!!
I will bet you that these adults and kids that do these things are brainwashed by holly wood and war games. Hey boy are you a loser? Well go shoot a bunch of people and you will be known all over the world. Give your life for our cause to get rid of those scariest guns that just jump up and kill people. You will be loved for it.. Want us to stop them? Medal detectors at doors armed guards, and counselors that can tan there butts along with letting the parents take charge of their children. And spank that ass if it is needed.
Who said anything about a Bill of Needs?
Where do I go to turn in my thumb and belt loops?
The government will make thousands of law abiding citizens criminals because the bump stock came with a letter from the BATFE that it was deemed LEGAL. Most WILL NOT TURN THEM IN.
And thank you for your comments, everyone’s email address on this website is accessible through search warrants, and as such the government knows where to start looking. Your presents on the WWW is well known. You won’t have to turn anything in. They will come and get it.
You say “DIVIDE AND CONQUER” ?? That’s exactly what this GUNS AMERICA site is trying to do! But you egotistical fools are too wrapped up in your own self indulgence to see it. If your not supporting the NRA you are clearly dividing us, . . . exactly what the anti’s want.
Seriously folks after they banned the sale of automatic hand guns and rifles some sixty or so years ago and regulated the hell out of ones existing at the time did you really think they would allow this bump stock deal to continue unabated ? Seig Heil mon Furher . Please forgive me my attempt at German subservience.
Anyone with any common sense knows the bump fire stock slipped through under a technically with the ATF. They turn a rifle into a machine gun in a goofy looking way. Stop complaining and keep the gun rights we have now, some of the best in the world. Yes I know they will keep coming for our guns and try to pass stupid laws. We have to fight the laws that dont make any sense.
When the tyrannical Government comes knocking for our guns you can bet your ass they will have fully automatics. We as Americans should be able to own anything that our police have in this country. The one thing we have in our favor is there are millions more of us and everyone knows were the Barney Fifes are in their communities. The Government doesn’t want to go there they might win but the costs would be great. You need to ask your local politicians like Sheriffs were they stand on this. If they would enforce anything on us then they need voted out or run out whichever way they want it. Its time we American citizens are given Sanctuary this is our country. I am a veteran and my oath has no expiration. Politicians take the oath and have no intention of honoring it. They have their fingers crossed because they do not believe in a higher power anyways.
We throw honest people in jail without blinking but protect known criminals like Mueller, Rosenschwein, FBI add DOJ crooks, the Clintons (all of them), crooked judges, most Democrats and so one. Why?
No BUMPSTOP Ban
So all we need to do is follow the liberal playbook and find a judge to put an injunction on the order and it will be tied up in the courts forever. Worked for libs on all those immigration orders. Republicans are supposed to be helping us get our rights back not taking more away. Can’t say I’m too impressed with Republicans at the moment.
If we had a Justice department they would be fighting against this new law that will do nothing but increase the regression of our civil rights. They continue to chip away at our rights but it is OK for the federal government to give away thousands of guns in the fast and furious scheme that kills Brian Terry a border patrol officer, don’t know how many were killed by the Obama/Holder operation by terrorists in France and Mexico and the government has no problem with that since no one has been held to account. I am sorry but Jeff Sessions is a deep state spineless kind of guy ater recusing himself to the likes of Stewart Smally!
So the constitution means nothing to our Government. They want to pass and doo ex post facto laws. Amazing how corrupt this nation of law makers has become. Oh but wait, if they don\’t keep making stupid laws then they won\’t have that cushie job making 3 or 4 times the average family. I think the senators and representatives need to go back to how it was designed. A volunteer position. And just go to DC for special sessions. Spend the rest of the time where they belong in their districts with the people that elected them!
This is the kind of ruling that just might make some law abiding citizens join the ranks of the “I can’t take anymore of this” and flip out . More people will be killed, the government will become more onerous and the out of control spin speeds up.
Killers are killers. They care not whether the victims are old or young. An old life is as precious as a young life. The killers were also children at one time.Mass murders have existed since the beginning of time, even when guns and bumpstocks were unheard of.
I foresee visions of past history repeating itself with a free society being stomped on by government stooges that listen only to those that agree with them. When these people realize what the hell they have gotten themselves into with their “peace at any price” thinking, alas it will be too late to turn back.
So the constitution means nothing to our Government. They want to pass and doo ex post facto laws. Amazing how corrupt this nation of law makers has become. Oh but wait, if they don’t keep making stupid laws then they won’t have that cushie job making 3 or 4 times the average family. I think the senators and representatives need to go back to how it was designed. A volunteer position. And just go to DC for special sessions. Spend the rest of the time where they belong in their districts with the people that elected them!
These damn things should of never passed muster to begin with, it’s almost like they were allowed just to create this exact situation. Given enough rope to hang yourself.
Just Shut Up. Who are you to tell anyone what they can or cannot have. IDIOT
Bumpstocks should never have been created. They have no purpose in bearing arms. They’re not to blame for any tragedy, but are an easy non-entity to eliminate. Machineguns and other nfa covered items could be registered when various laws took effect. Bumpstocks are just plain stupid and dangerous and I’m glad to see them go. There are those out there that would buy ANYTHING to make them feel like “real” soldiers. Want to fire on full auto? Buy a machinegun. Save your money and buy a legit nfa LEGAL full auto. This isn’t “giving something up”. It’s getting rid of something that shouldn’t have happened in the first place. Only folks I’ve ever met that owned or wanted one were folks I did not want to spend range time with, because Indid not TRUST them to be SAFE … without the bump stock!
“Save your money and buy a legit nfa LEGAL full auto.” $30,000 for a $3,000 rifle, no thanks.
I dont own a bump stock but if any ATF shows up at ANY LAW ABIDING CITIZEN’S home to remove anything involving the 2nd AMENDMENT they should be met with resistance.
I personally don’ own one of these. I found others who thought they were cool. I shot a Friends Ar-15. A waste of ammo. That said, this is the beginning people! You better step up! I mean Marches in Washington Protesting this, and any other ban on any gun on the market Legal to own. You people make me sick! You hide behind your keyboard and make comments.
Any local, or State Or Agency ever shows up at my House will have to kill me for my Guns! That’s a promise! I am Angry. This is what the second amendment is about. When a Government becomes Tyranicle we as citizens have the right to form a militia and throw the bums out. The problem is all talk. Your Police dress like Soldiers. They will soon be asking for your papers. If every Jew had met Hitlers Henchmen with a Gun. He would have been defeated before he got started.
Too many Idiots have the ‘Hey, it’s not mine” or “does not effect me, bump fire is stoopid (misspelling intentional)” and they are costing us are Rights. These same Idiots will say that “Machine guns should be illegal” even though Military and Police have them. We are living in a Police State as is. How many will Fight, or will they cowardly Bend the Knee?
Yep!
As the law stands as far as owning an Automatic Weapon you need to have a FFL license for a fully auto weapon.
So what’s the difference between the Bump Stock and a Thompson Machinegun that no special permit is required?
They both are basically the same. Rapid Fire! I can pull the trigger on any of my rifles to put out the fire power of a bump.
If you think you’re going to be able to out -gun the Fed’s when TEOTW-SHTF comes you are dreaming. Get real guys
the only thing a bump will do is eat up a bunch of ammo real quick and make you feel like a Rambo/Combat Hero.
I probably own more guns than most of you and I don’t need or want a fully auto or a bump to make my day.
Besides all that if you do have a FL for a Fully Auto the ATF now has the right to inspect your premises at any time.
I prefer my privacy and anonymity when it comes to what I have in my gun safe.
An FFL has nothing to do with automatic weapons.I think you’re confusing it with the $200 tax stamp required to purchase a fully automatic weapon or a suppressor.
What you don’t know about NFA item ownership is a lot Jim.
By the way I did not notice that the Second Amendment said anything about having duck stamps and Deer tags it’s not about hunting.
I thought Rules and laws were written to protect the innocent not criminalize them!!
Bump stock and the intended purpose or reason to have one yes or no it matters not. It is really about freedom, Liberty and Due process to the Nth degree.Infringing on the 2nd Amendment puts us on the Proverbial slippery slope
If you own a Bump Stock or not who am I to judge.
I believe we are innocent until proven guilty
I understand the need and desire to Prevent Crime and wanton death and destruction, But I also believe we should endeavor to teach civility instead of political correctness and tolerance
Stop politicizing everything.
Bump stocks are harmless, if you have been fooled into believing they fire like a machine gun, you have not fired machine guns.
Oh man, this is not a good precedent.
I didn’t ever want one nor do I even own an AR, but I will defend your right to have both.
In 1776 all US citizens had the SAME weapons as the military and law enforcement of the period. So our founding fathers did get “it” right! Nothing needs any re-writing except one thing, anyone who infringes on the rights of others shall be imprisoned.
New take on an old one. Seems apt right now with all the non-freedom lovers posting about how they’re happy about the proposed ban. You all make me sick!
First they came for the bump stocks, and I did not speak out—
Because I didn’t want a bump stock and they are dumb.
Then they came for the “high” capacity magazines, and I did not speak out—
Because I a good hunter don’t need more than 5 rounds anyway .
Then they came for the AR15, and I did not speak out—
Because I own only bolt action rifles.
Then they came for my bolt action “sniper” rifle—and there was no one left that was armed to stop them.
The Second Amendment should read according to its original intent: “the federal government shall not regulate firearms so that the state governments can maintain posse comitatus militias to hunt down runaway slaves and suppress slave rebellions.”
Almost every comment here is a self-congratulatory “I told you so, they’re coming to take your guns.”
I think that they should license gun ownership based on the results of an intelligence test.
YOUR AN IDIOT. YOU CAN SUCK ON A BUMP STOCK.
I thoght it wierd when i first saw a bump stock, i will admit, but there are more devices to achieve rapid fire, even just by altered parts, the thing these uneducated folks don,t know is its still possable to fire two semi auto pistols rapid fire one in each hand, if you carry 4 or even 6 semi auto,s thats 60 rounds fired in less than a minute or possably less than a round a second, and can be reloaded faster than an AR 15, first its bump stocks, next its semi auto,s, 2+2=4 its easi to see where this trail leads
Banning bumpstocks won’t solve the problems of poor government officials!
You have forgotten something in the list of what it makes illegal to own. A bump stock may be a 150-300 dollar part. Echo and Binary triggers are 400-500 dollar parts and they are explicitly called out.
I’m surprised anyone believed Trump when he said he was all for the 2A. He’s never had that as part of his ideology. His ideology is basically lying and through it swindling people. It is what he is good at. This should be an impeachable offense. And when you add in his butt buddy Cox of the NRA, you’ve basically got a swindling team made to milk people who trust that someone is actually on their side.
How many of you NRA members have been called even this week for donations? I bet every one of you. What are they doing with it? Living high on the hog and perpetuating their worthless existence. People say we can’t afford to be divided right now, but we can’t afford to stand behind Cox either.
This commentary above sounds just like a DEMOCRAT who has infiltrated this page!! Obviously he/she/it has no idea of WWI or WWII and the socialistic form(s) of government that confiscated firearms, formed a helpless society, created death camps and desired to rule the world. Get your head out of your ass. OOPS forgot that DEMOCRATS love that smell and thrive on blindness.
I believe you have completely misrepresented the NRA. Are they playing politics with the latest political issues, YES. Should they be doing this…I believe no, they should be standing firm, remembering history on this very same political issue which has come up several times over the decades. But….to infer that the NRA is in some way deceptive, dishonest, and operating just for the money, only means you know nothing of the history of the NRA’s achievements.
Currently who does more for gun rights, and the defense of the second amendment than the NRA? No one is the correct answer.
Now, does Trump have any experience with Washington and liberal ideologies? The answer is NO….which is why Americans who truly are loyal citizens of the USA and are proponents of the Second Amendment, voted him into office—they all wanted an OUTSIDER.
Do you think this Outsider is facing more political opposition than any other elected president? The answer is YES overwhelming. He’s being run over daily by his own party, the opposition and The Press and Media. And furthermore, Trump’s strategy is to use the very same political tactics as the liberal leftist democrats in order to force them to reveal who they really are—for which I an grateful for, because never before have Americans in general, have a front row seat to witness the absolute un-American anti-American, people within both major political parties, doing all they can to destroy a duly elected president with outright lies, deception, and criminal acts.
With that said, Trump is making a mistake IF….IF, he ends up supporting this ban when it’s all said and done. But IF THIS IS ALL THE MISTAKES HE MAKES….I say, America still has many years of fight left in it, enough to have even more gun rights than we have forty years ago.
Do you see more and more states like Massachusetts and its gun laws springing up? No, in fact we see the opposite trend, with more and more states showing more support for the second amendment.
Are there elements of anti-second amendment groups springing up and losing their fights when it’s all said and done? Yes, we are. And you’ll find that it’s the NRA which is the strongest force in leading the charge, supplying the majority of energy to win these legal battles, one battle at a time which results in the overwhelming majority of fights in OUR FAVOR.
But you, …..you are not really at part of the NRA and the pro second amendment Americans are you? I think not.
When I first read about bump stocks a couple years back I said to myself this is tradgedy waiting to happen . Bump stocks have absolutely no good purpose other than being a novelty for for yahoo’s. Give them up without a fight because your gonna not only cut your throat but everyone else’s too. We all have a lot more pertinent problems right now to deal with without splitting hairs over a toy.
Stop giving ur monies to the NRA and see how fast they change their tune.
Congress has the obligation to write a comprehensive statute defining and outlawing these. That said, the states have already started banning them and ordering confiscation.
The way around this is simply to require bump stock owners to obtain a tax stamp for pre-existing bump stocks, no different than silencers.
And yes, owning parts that if mated with an existing weapon, make it capable of firing more than 1 round per trigger pull is owning a machine gun. It may be a gun part, but the capability to add it to the gun without significant modifications to the gun, is in fact owning and possessing a machine gun.
Look, in my personal world-view, the gun is not the issue. Its the people who possess the guns, and the society in which the possession is held.
Fifty and sixty years ago, people owned guns, respected them, and firearms training though optional, was readily available to kids and adults. What happened was a series of events: 1. The assassination of Pres. Kennedy (who was a life long member of the NRA by the way); 2. The assassination of Martin Luther King; and 3. The assassination of Robert Kennedy who was running for office.
By the time Bobby Kennedy was killed in Los Angeles, it was still legal to send a check or money order to a gun distributor with postage prepaid and your gun would be mailed to you. There was no record-keeping of any kind, no one checked to see if the felon, crazy, traitor or you name it was buying a gun; there were no background checks. It was illegal for a felon to own and possess a gun, but that didn’t stop anyone anyway.
After the GCA of 1968, it required that a form be filled out, and the gun-seller had to ID the person and keep records of the sale.
Prior to that, machine guns, short barreled rifles and “silencers” were likewise “outlawed”. The point of the National Firearms Act was to require people who wanted to own and possess such guns and accessories to fill out paper work, pay a tax to buy the tax stamp, and of course depending on the state of residence and local constabulary approving it, the gun was yours to own legally.
After the NFA and GCA, Pres. Reagan’s administration pushed to ban armor piercing ammo and the sale of machine guns manufactured after 1985 to reduce the “population” of machine guns in private hands (excluding law enforcement and military), and, insure that they become so expensive and rare that no one in their right mind would use one for anything more than hobby or museum purposes.
You don’t have to outright ban bump stocks. They can be included in the NFA by an act of Congress, and owners would be required to pay the tax stamp and register them. Any future purchases would require the usual paperwork for NFA type weapons and PARTS to convert a non-NFA to an NFA weapon.
I don’t have a problem with reasonable regulations. I do have a problem with unreasonable ones. This is unreasonable because it represents confiscation. We don’t do that in the US.
This is nothing but a step down the slippery slope!
At risk at being labeled a sensationalist, or chicken little imitator, or tin hat conspiracy theorist……this is the first of the governments (all>> local, county, state, federal) confiscation of firearms or firearms related property or gear. The 2A was created by men who knew and experienced despot government (The British) and wanted recourse in the new American United States against their own government making the populace defenseless against its, if any, despotic actions. The 2A is there for exactly what has happened here !
Let’s revue the fate of unarmed people world wide in the 20th century. Why the 20th? It’s fresh in our minds and it’s coming to the United States, from the Government of The United States…..soon.
In 1929, the Soviet Union established gun control. From 1929 to 1953, about 20 million dissidents, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
In 1911, Turkey established gun control. From 1915 to 1917, 1.5 million Armenians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
Germany established gun control in 1938 and from 1939 to 1945, a total of 13 million Jews and others who were unable to defend themselves were rounded up and exterminated.
China established gun control in 1935. From 1948 to 1952, 20 million political dissidents, unable to defend themselves were rounded up and exterminated. 10,000 (estimated) were murdered out of camera view in Tiananmen Square.
Guatemala established gun control in 1964. From 1964 to 1981, 100,000 Mayan Indians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
Uganda established gun control in 1970. From 1971 to 1979, 300,000 Christians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
Cambodia established gun control in 1956. From 1975 to 1977, one million educated people, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
56 million defenseless people rounded up and exterminated in the 20th Century because of gun control:
You won’t see this data on the US evening news, or hear politicians disseminating this information.
Guns in the hands of honest citizens save lives and property and, yes, gun-control laws adversely affect only the law-abiding citizens.
Take note my fellow Americans, before it’s too late!
The next time someone talks in favor of gun control, please remind them of this history lesson.
With guns, we are “citizens”. Without them, we are “subjects”.
This is the most valuable comment on this board I’ve ever read. It cannot be overstated. But, it still falls on deaf ears because ‘educated’ people believe it can’t happen again. That’s where we are as Americans.
So, I feel it’s far too late for Americans to ‘wake up’ to the loss of freedom. It is upon us. It is today. While the poorer people from every walk of life argue about every petty piece of propaganda, a few people with unimaginable wealth buy and sell oppression with absolute disregard for anyone other than their ‘idea’ of what is right. . .for THEM. That’s where we are as Americans.
Whenever I hear someone in public office; whenever I hear a judge or a lawyer; whenever I see a group of reporters I cannot help but have a very realistic vision of them begging for mercy before being summarily executed individually. I’m really no longer an American citizen: I’m a subject of the crown. I no longer have a voice that accounts for anything.
This most recent event (bump stocks) will be interesting. Donald Trump just handed Hillary Clinton a victory. Republicans, in general, have abandoned their base because of their hatred for Donald Trump. Democrats. . .well. . .they just do what Muslims, Somalians, Mexicans want them to do. NONE of those sons ‘a bitches gives a shit about anybody or anything but themselves. This’ll be interesting.
My only concern is as someone else said, or lawmakers will try to attach all kinds of other bans/restrictions to any legislation that bans rapid fire devices. As far as bump stocks and binary triggers, I’m surprised the ATF ruled it as a “gun part” that was legal in the first place, as the only purpose is to increase rate of fire. As pointed out, all that does is burn through ammo. Makes accuracy worse! Binary triggers are inherently dangerous. So you pull the trigger for one shot and you MUST take a second! Someone or something runs across the range… you have to hold your trigger finger on the trigger until the range clears. You can’t decide to NOT take a second shot… unless there’s some additional control I don’t know about.
I don’t like the outright ban, but I thought there were rules against converting a semi-auto into a full auto already. It was short sighted to allow bump stocks in the first place. So some people are going to lose some money over buying them. It’s not like they are going to send someone to your door to get them, not unless a neighbor complains repeatedly. Easy enough to tell a sheriff “there were 3-4 of us shooting at the same time, that’s what the neighbors heard” and be believed once in a while, but repeated calls might produce a search warrant. You can have it, just can’t use it. I know of at least two illegal machine guns people own that aren’t properly licensed, one a conversion, one the real thing from the start. One inherited a Thompson from an uncle who had it for a long time, I think it was passed down through family from the 20s or 30s. He just rarely shot it in auto mode… rarely shot it at all. Don’t know where he is now or remember the name… an old USAF acquaintance from 15-20 years ago. No one is knocking on doors looking for these things unless you give them a reason. Even if they make retailers send out letters, no one will show up at the door without reason.
There are so many guns in The United States it would difficult to confiscate them all.
If you are a law abiding Citizen and all your firearms are all registered then they know exactly what you have.
If you are a criminal or your furearms are not registered then how will they know what you have?
As an NRA member if your firearms stolen how can you be reimbursed if your firearms are not registered?
So we see hypocrisy is not the sole province of hoplophobes. Evidently, it’s OK to ban bump stocks if you have no interest in them, or if you cannot see in them some purpose besides recreation.
So lock, stock, and barrel (pun intended) we accept a requirement to justify possessions forced on us by manipulated masses, via the coercive force of government and their fifth column of “one-world” sycophants.
Isn’t that exactly what’s being done to us with respect to magazines and “evil features”? I have no need for a bump stock.
Nor do I have need of a sports car or cigarette lighter. Those have killed far more people than have bump-stocks.
It’s no wonder antis are making headway. Divide and conquer. They understand simple concepts.
Wish the firearms community did.
Y’all rednecks voted for trump and now you get what you deserve. Nothing. Obama or trump both work for the same people. Stupid racist.
Put a pacifier in your weeniewasher and quit crying, socialist pig, Clinton lost. Live with it!
I feel sorry for the poor guys that have to try and come take them from me. I committed last time, and I will again, however I feel the only answer to this is going to be a 1776 one.
This will not only affect “Bump Fire Stock’s” you Idiots that say you “I have no Problem With Ban, Because It’s Stupid Bump Fire”, do dot realize the Law they are Passing & Signing not only Bans Bump Fire Devices but also any “Device” that allows a fire arm to fire faster than originally designed. Your “Franklin Binary Trigger”? Felony to possess. A Gieslie or aftermarket Trigger? Illegal under this Law. I will blame you in 5 years when U.S. goes full UK and bans all Personal Possession of Fire Arms. Shall Not Infringe is in the Constitution. We should be able to own Full Auto what ever we want in US. But because of Idiots Like You, who think that “Hey it’s they other guys stuff that is being outlawed, not mine” and the F*cking NRA, who Betrayed Gun Owners Again, that US is such a Shit Hole now. We fought a War for these rights and the Framers of Constitution warned about a Government that no longer acts with the Citizens best interests at heart will need to be removed. What side will you Idiots be on when they start kicking doors in to Confiscate? Every Fire Arm Purchase since Clintons Bill has been Documented and the old “I lost it in a boating accident” will not fly, they will tear your shit apart until they find every weapon that is Registered Under Your Name. You Idiots Enable the Left, you Commie Rats.
I AM WITH YOU ALL THE WAY. Could not have said this better. They will come, they will bust down your door and they will kill and/or if you are lucky spend the rest of your living days in some concentration camp. FROM MY COLD DEAD HANDS!!!!!
Those who have purchased them must be compensated!!
I don’t believe I would vote for Trump a second time.
He might just be a one hit wonder like an old radio song.
Only time will tell, but I’m sure not happy when he says one thing and then does something else completely different.
He is the first President who really doesn’t seem Presidential.
Yeah Right OldGuy…..if you like your doctor …..you can keep your doctor……if you like you insurance plan ……you can keep your insurance plan………Very Presidential
If this becomes law donate your bump stock to someone homeless that won’t relinquish it , then they will have shelter ,medical and 3 meals a day for the next 10 years,they don’t seem to be able to get help any other way………..
I guess the real question which involves everyone is our Constitution of the United States of America a living document or a dead document?
Unbelievable how righteous “legal” gun owner want to decide to threaten to challenge and keep what classified the AR-15 as machine gun. Not so legal gun owner, now are we? Threaten to fight? Tsk tsk. You complained about infringed. But, you are ok about losing your vehicle when vehicle can be use as a weapon.
You have to give Trump credit for using his words within sentences like head fakes on the basketball court.
First he says one thing or feins one direction and then does something completely different by heading in an about-face-direction. Just look at how many people within his cabinet have been on their way out while he was telling the American public and the world something different.
Although I voted for the guy because I could never sleep nights if Hillary was in the White House I’m not getting restfull nights recently with all this talk from retired judges to high school kids about repealing our Second Amendment.
If there’s an upside to this it’s “IF” Trump’s presidency is in tact at the next presidential election and “IF” he decides to run for re-election he’ll be doing it without any votes from 2nd amendment supporters.
So now, by law, you own a machine gun, why couldn’t you optionally get a tax stamp and pay the fee, like you would do if you wanted to have ANY other machine gun? And if you didn’t want to do that, couldn’t you just take apart the rifle and surrender the “bump stock” pieces parts making that weapon once again legal?
You can’t get a tax stamp because of the Reagan signed 1986 Firearm Owners Protection Act that bans any new full auto weapons from being sold to the public. Unless, perhaps, if your parts making the rifle full auto were pre-1986 manufactured. And sure, you can surrender the bump stock, but that isn’t the point. The problem is the industry pushing the limits of the law, selling pricey accessories to people with more ammo than sense, then trying to roll it back and tell people the hundreds of dollars they spent were wasted.
I DONT OWN ONE BUT WHEN WILL THEY WANT MY AUTOMATICS THATS SCARY LIEING ASS WIPE TRUMP ARE WORST THAN ODUMBA AND HILLIARY AND BILLARY CLINTONS………
I am a gun owner and I for one will never give up carrying my gun and leave my family and I defenseless. First of all bump stocks and machine guns have only been used a few times in contrast with other gun crime which in itself is lowest in gun carrrying states. The left are lunatics who live in a dream world utopia that never existed nor will it on earth. Second of all no matter what they say do they think 2nd Am folks will just turn over our guns and gun attachments. The reason we have them is first of all to protect ourselves against crime and government if need be. The folks who want to take them. How does any dum ass think this is going to turn out well. Do they really think that our real Americans won’t fight and will allow this BS? Lol if they do then I have a Bridge for sale, anyone interested????
Looks like a 4 yr term now
It doesn’t matter if I like bumostocks because I don’t. They are for people who have experienced full auto fire, although they don’t even remotely resemble an engieered full auto. They are for those not worried about accuracy nor barrel longevity. But, that’s not the question here is it.
The real question is, Why! When there is a tragic event, are the victims turned into liberal pawns. For f**k sake, people are writing the shooter making him feel like the real victim. This will only encourage these srupid movement’s! As well, it also makes me think some of these people are encouraged to commit acts to further political agenda of taking the 2nd amendment out of the American way of life.
The left feels as long as keep stoking the fire, enough people will willingly submit their freedom’s. And many will. For the simple fact that many people speak about the constitution in a big tongue and cheek, will tuck tail when the establishment makes its move. And they will!
Larry king said “The second amendment was poorly written, and needs to be updated.
Exactly what the update should be the left never has said the answer. If they did state the truth this early on they would face severe backlash and republicans will continue to hold the majority.
Remember. What comes forth from the mouth, is not always the hearts intent. So, they will continue to insult the intelligence of the “TRUE”conservative” by waving thier gun grab around like a gun “law”. Well we’re not buying it nor are all consevative people going to stand buy and allow it to happen.
When they show up at the door to gun grab, they will massacre the family who says, nope not me. They will have to kill me to take my families belongings and God given rights to a secure and healthy life.
On your knees or your back is how this will wind up going down, and they will spin it as the liberal media always does.
The “Slide-Fire” Stocks were sold with an ATF Letter enclosed stating to the Buyer that the Slide-Fire Stock was/is 100% legal. Sounds as if we may have a Convoy and a huge debacle. One would think, they will have a huge problem making this Bump-fire Slide-Fire attachment to be totally illegal. The Buyers that kept their ATF Letter of legality one would think, must be Grandfathered to keep their Slide-Fire, Bump-Fire Stocks with paying the additional $200 Tax Stamp. A Law that is nonsensical and non enforceable is null and void in the eyes of the Law. MOLON LABE !
Congress should rule on this , not the executive branch.
The NRA spearheaded this ban and did nothing to protect honest people. I am sure the NRA will support a future semi auto and hi capacity firearm ban too. I am no longer a member. ROGER
Saying…I don’t have one…don’t want one but I don’t agree with just banning and confiscation. Not really constitutional in my opinion. That said..the NRA’s silence is not stunning to me. Keeping “bump” stocks is an argument we probably can’t win…allow them to be grandfathered…want ’em registered like machine guns..let’s open the flood gates and allow new machine guns into the mix. Has there been a legally owned machine gun used in a crime? I would love to own a submachine gun…but not now.. The gummit allowed registration of them in the past…why not now? . We all know there are thousands of machine guns and other devices out there. But this will be taken to court and I can not see the courts allowing confiscation of legally bought merchandise
Come and get them if you really want them, don’t expect cold dead hands be ready for that warm blood American pointer finger and eagle 👁 ….
hang in there guys just remember if you don’t support the NRA …. you are the LEFT.. we’re the last of our breed!!!!!!!
Gun owners need to find a date and set it in stone. Protest by taking off work for one day. Imagine over half of the US without work force. A lot of shit will stop moving but I bet at the end of the day you will physically be able to move. Give up your rights and you will be some dictators bitch or worse boy toy…. hell I would ban US pizza shops before bump stocks🤭
ATF did same thing with the Street Sweeper Shotgun, by ruling it a NFA device
Expostfacto Law should grandfather all previous purchases, if NRA would fight it, public opinion has ruled on this one
Prelude to an “assault style” weapon ban…
So now the govt is seizing legally aquired property without compensation. Since the penalty is the same as having a machine gun, watch as every Tom, Dick, and Larry accross the country with basic metal fabrication skills say “fuck it” and start making their own auto sears, lightning links, and dedicated full autos from scratch. Shits about to get real.
Horseshit. The whole “bumpstock” issue is a red herring. Bumpstocks are novelty items. Anyone can build a bumpstock or a bumpstick in their garage in a half-hour, and people who know anything about semi-automatics can bump-fire a rifle or a shotgun or a handgun WITHOUT a bumpstock or bumpstick. So, will the fucking gubbmint imprison you for 10 years because you know HOW TO bump-fire? That cosses the fucking line, don’t you think?
This is bullshit first then what else is the president going to banned …later were ot goimg to be able to own guns….this is how the president wants to control us
That’s just the beginning! Black scary guns will be next. Once that door is open it is only a matter of time.
Million gun m,arch on Washington D.C. Who’s in?
NRA and other gun groups should’ve been organizing one weeks ago. We’re sitting silent for no reason at all. Time for class-action lawsuits if they try to impose this without a grandfather clause protecting those who have ATF letters that legalized them in the first place
And in other news, THE SKY IS FALLING! THE SKY IS FALLING! Film at eleven.
If bump stocks were of any real tactical use, then I’d consider a ban to be an infringement on our Second Amendment rights. Does anyone SERIOUSLY believe that bump stocks give a tactical advantage to a user in a defensive situation? No, they are good only for two things: Range toys, and Las Vegas style mass shootings. We should just grudgingly accept the bump stock ban, and concentrate our efforts on the repeal of REAL Second Amendment infringements, such as the Hughes Act, the 1968 Gun Control Act, and the 1934 National Firearms Act.
For real?
The powers that be in favor of this rule change will never repeal the gca or nfa. The idea that we should suck it on this because then maybe we can repeal those has a zero percent chance of working.
Stop any and all gun bans protect our rights
Now it’s the bump stocks, next it will be magazines with more than 10 capacity, then it will be semi automatic rifles, then only single shot guns allowed, leading to the ultimate goal, confiscation of all weapons and repeal of the second amendment. Where do we make our stand. We need to pick our battles wisely. I, for one, will not give an inch, the battle is now.
Not a fan of bump stocks. With that said. I don’t believe they should be banned. This is huge. And not in a good way. Something needs to be done about this mess.
This is ridiculous I don’t have a bump stock have no need for it bought my AR to predator hunt with, but this shit of these presidents just doing what ever they want is t right it’s about time the American people take this country back the constitution written by our founding fathers they knew times would change that’s why they wrote it the why they did and we should not let anyone change it !
The bump stock is merely an overpriced piece of plastic that increases the semiautomatic rate of fire …. it does not turn the firearm into a fully automatic one. The same thing can be accomplished with a board and a couple of dowel rods, or even with a solid hold and a thumb through the belt loop on your jeans! Even though I have no desire to own one, I’ll do my part to fight turning lawful owners into criminals. What’s next? An order to turn in all of our magazines over 10 rounds? Or 5 rounds? Don’t think that will happen? Do some research and you’ll find it already has. We must stand against ALL infringement of the 2nd Amendment rights we hold dear, not just those that affect our own collections or we’ll be relegated to single shot muzzle loaders and slingshots!
It’s also a good idea to call the Whitehouse Switchboard and tell
President Trump what you think of this move.
Also, remind him of his promise to SUPPORT the 2A. Not stomp on it as his predecessor did.
Remind him that making criminals of a good part of his base WILL hurt him in 2020
Can you say EX POST FACTO ?!?
Since I didn’t give them authority to ban anything to do with firearms whatsoever, and neither did anyone else, their attempts to enforce their illegal action will be rejected with all necessary force, like any of their other multitude of crimes.
Again, the law abiding are punished for one bad actor. Speak up on the public comments, remember, there are more of us than there are of ” THEM ” No Ban Of Bumpstock, or Grandfather them in…
I certainly am against this proposed ban, it infringes by Fiat on the second amendment, and because the BATF has already made a ruling previously, and based on mechanical principals showing that the device does not create a machine gun there has been no change in the device to alter that
Does anybody know if they have started taking comments on this yet?
The fact that Trump and the NRA has set this precedent is scared me more than Obama ever did. The fact that with nothing more than a pen he outlawed a device that was approved by the ATF and used by over a 100,000 law abiding citizens. No grandfather clause or buy back of the $100 million their own report says law abiding citizens paid with the approval of the ATF. I can not think of one other legal item that was confiscated by the government like this.
Just remember Australian gun rights were stripped away by their own Conservative party.
So you’re looking just at specifically what he did. The precedent it sets is way more troubling. If he can break the law by enacting regulation, then what is to say he can’t just regulate away parts of the constitution? When he does that, it may not pass a judicial review, but that doesn’t mean much to the people wrongfully incarcerated or murdered by the police state.
Though that said, the government with my money shouldn’t ever be used to “buy back” anything. It should be whoever initiates a law or in this case regulation without law behind it. All of that money should come directly from Trumps campaign fund and if he can’t afford it from that, then it should come directly from his own funds. If he or whoever initiates can’t afford to pay for it, then they should be permanently barred from election or assignment to public office, including appointed positions until they have successfully paid it back.
This is where “We the People” should take action. EVERYONE should comment on this NPRM and state your case. Don’t think some organization will speak on your behalf, the power is in numbers. Every individual who supports or opposes this NPRM is obligated to comment.
When the legislation was first introduced everyone had the opportunity to put in opposition to it too your representative into the ATF directly. I did so. To cry about it now when so many had failed to won’t change anything. We need seriously to take a look at our leaders. We need to make a change. The change we were offered under Obama was a sham and a mind to change that were offered by Trump is a lie, you were on lockdown by organization that were all members to and pay into, both United States of America which every working person has paid into and secondly the NRA. There should not have been in discussion over bump stocks, binary triggers and such, being bump firing can be done without either or any. So when somebody unfolder’s there firearm and pulls forward allowing the trigger to bounce on your finger is that now mean that your finger must be banned? Yes it is that ignorant. This is a Showboat. This will turn into our Firearms gone, unlawful search and seizure, and possibly even our first amendment destroyed are right and ability to say what we wish as we wish…….. Wait that’s already gone thanks to political correctness crap. Unless you are part of the vocal minority you will always be the buried majority.
When the legislation was first introduced everyone had the opportunity to put in opposition to it too your representative into the ATF directly. I did so. To cry about it now when so many had failed to won\’t change anything. We need seriously to take a look at our leaders. We need to make a change. The change we were offered under Obama was a sham and a mind to change that were offered by Trump is a lie, you were on lockdown by organization that were all members to and pay into, both United States of America which every working person has paid into and secondly the NRA. There should not have been in discussion over bump stocks, binary triggers and such, being bump firing can be done without either or any. So when somebody unfolder\’s there firearm and pulls forward allowing the trigger to bounce on your finger is that now mean that your finger must be banned? Yes it is that ignorant. This is a Showboat. This will turn into our Firearms gone, unlawful search and seizure, and possibly even our first amendment destroyed are right and ability to say what we wish as we wish…….. Wait that\’s already gone thanks to political correctness crap. Unless you are part of the vocal minority you will always be the buried majority.
Thank you for taking the time to publish this. When all of the furor erupted, I bought six. 5 for the v a ours I have, and one extra. I will not turn them in. I will use them, should anyone try to come take them.
Sure you will, for about 15 seconds before law enforcement turns you and yours into Swiss cheese. But hey, it sounds tough.
Better than kneeling before the masters
The author does have a point about this ban, no matter how much we might agree with it or feel that it is in the best interest of the public interest, should have come from Congress and not from the Executive branch. However, if this is how bump stocks are finally banned, then so be it. This abuse of power is done in the better interest of public safety and by no means without precedent. I don’t know which makes me smile more – that the bump stocks are finally getting banned or that His Orangeness has betrayed all of you to do it, without explanation. But her e-mails, though!
One ban down, untold more to come.
Yes, abuse of power does have precedent, lol, what an argument.
A half a million people being turned into felons unless they submit to the destruction of their constitutionally protected property is not the minor insignificant thing you understand it to be.
Reality, a lot of blood, *your* blood, will be shed over this. But you are too dumb to remember the 90s.
The level of stupidity in your comment gave me herpes, AIDS, cancer, and a migraine.
Last time I checked a bump stock didn’t kill anyone……as a matter of fact guns don’t kill people….people kill people. Every law abiding gun owner has a choice and 99.9999% of us do.
I can see it now. Thousands and thousands of law abiding citizens have just become felons. Thousands and thousands of non-complying bump stock owners are off to jail for 10 years. All I can say is that it better be a very big prison!
NY did it when they passed the “SAFE Act”. I had over 20 Felony counts in my gun safe. To see this at a federal level is Very disturbing. These kids and the media are gonna start another civil war.
I guess I haven’t been around long enough, but the silence of the NRA on this is astonishing to me.
Check out their NRA ILA news page, crickets…
I kinda understand non gun owners and the fudds being opposed to ownership, their only knowledge is Las Vegas.
But the NRA?
This whole thing is dirty and disappointing.
I honestly didn’t think this to be possible, I figured a ban of some sort would come about, but nothing this severe.
The truth has not been told about Las Vegas, just the another facade of the government.
Let’s follow shithead logic here:
Find deranged lunatic.
Contract deranged lunatic to go on shooting spree at a particular place and time.
Insist deranged lunatic must murder himself at the conclusion.
Yup, only a shithead could believe that scenario.
If Obama or Hillary had tried this there would’ve been a shit storm. But the Trumptards and the Fuds at the NRA are just letting this silently go through, what a betrayal. This sets an extremely dangerous precedent.
You are right on all fronts, and I can imagine it is because the stocks are not that popular. But the silent fail to see the precedent, and will lose much more down the road. Today it is bump stocks, tomorrow it will something even more egregious.
They are going for all centerfire semi autos. It’s pretty clear.
All I ever wanted was for my government to leave me alone, but my rights I will defend.
Most who drank the Kool-aid will NEVER admit they were fooled!
that’s a NEAT TRICK Eddie, how’d you manage to post that FROM THE FUTURE???