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CZ Scorpion
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We’re gearing up for SHOT Show 2015, and starting off with a tremendous bang. The CZ Scorpion Evo 3 looks to be one of the biggest stories of the show, at least now–before things are fully underway. We got a sneak peek at the Scorpion, and I’m here to tell you first hand that this gun has a tremendous amount of potential.
Let’s start with some of the basics.
| MSRP |
$849.00
|
|---|---|
| Chambering |
9mm Luger
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| Magazine Capacity |
20+1
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| Magazine Type |
Double stack polymer
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| Frame |
Fiber-reinforced polymer
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| Grips |
Polymer, adjustable for reach to trigger
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| Trigger Mech |
SA
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| Sights |
Low-profile fully adjustable aperture and post, 4 rear aperture sizes
|
| Barrel |
Cold hammer forged
|
| Barrel Length |
7.72 in
|
| Weight |
5.0 lbs
|
| Overall Length |
16.0 in
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| Height |
9.4 in
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| Width |
2.4 in
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| Safety |
Ambidextrous thumb safety
|
The compact powerhouse does really good things to the 9mm’s ballistics.
Who needs a hard to hold 9mm pistol?
That’s a fair question, and I know that there will be some comments about how hard it is to shoot a gun this size with no stock. Yeah, yeah. I get it. So does CZ. So does everyone else in the industry. Look at the massive popularity of AR pistols now. What’s behind the popularity? Easy. The pistol stabilizing brace. With one of those on the Scorpion (something we have yet to try), it will be even better than it already is.
EDITOR’S NOTE: as I’m writing this review, I just got word of the ATF’s latest letter on the SIG-brace, and (apparently) all of the similar devices on the market. Unless you plan to use it as a wrist brace, don’t bother. If you shoulder the gun, you change it from a pistol to a short barreled rifle, and that’s not good. Ok. More on this as it develops…. Back to the review.
And it is functional as-is. The gun can be held one handed. It can be held two handed. With a sling attached, you can pull out and stabilize it even more. You’re not going to win any accuracy contests, but it is easy enough to get rounds on a torso sized target.
The hand stop provides an excellent way to control the forward placement of the hand.
And that’s what this is for, really. I’m going to call a spade a spade. There are two reasons for the Scorpion’s existence in my view. Like any gun, the Scorpion is a great range toy. Shoot it all day long. Shoot and move. Shoot for distance. Bang steel. Whatever–the Scorpion will eat it up. But the gun has a serious side. It is built for close quarters self defense.
I’ve got an AR set up for home defense. It is a tiny thing with a 7.5″ barrel. Still, I have concerns about what would happen inside my house (and outside the house, and maybe down the block) if I ever unload the way I’m prepared to. 5.56, even from short barrels, may present an over-penetration problem that could be catastrophic. The 9mm is a better option, and there are 9mm rounds that are purpose built for control.
The Scorpion has the ergonomics. The controls are easy to use. The frame offers places to mount lights or lasers. There are very few guns on the market right now that offer this much potential. CZ makes kick-ass guns that run reliably. The Scorpion now joins those ranks. It is big enough to manipulate, small enough for maneuverability in tight places, and it may prove even more attractive when you see what this gun costs.
The sights are incredible. They’re very robust and easy to see.
Shooting the Scorpion
Before we get to the price, I’d like to talk a bit about the nature of this review. SHOT Show is crazy. The weeks before SHOT are insane. CZ shipped us this preview. We ran this gun for several hours, mostly shooting steel.
Out of the box accuracy was solid. From 25 yards, we had no difficulty hitting with the gun–even without the brace. It is easy enough to hold with two hands, and the forward hand-stop provides a great way to find your hold. This isn’t a gun you want to ride up on. The birdcage muzzle device is going to spread a bit of the blast–and the 9mm should burn more of its powder in the longer barrel, but still….
The gun is not easily held with one hand. The first shot isn’t a problem, but followup shots are very hard to make.
The trigger is a serious issue on the gun. If this were to be solely a range toy, it may not matter as much. But the pull is a bit heavy and the travel is marked by some false starts. Our best guesses (being just that) are that the Scorpion’s trigger will even out over time. Or a quick pass by someone who knows his ass from his elbow when it comes to triggers could easily rectify the problems.
Safety selectors are easy to read.
Long range accuracy (for the 9mm, anyhow) is within the Scorpion’s abilities, if it were to have a stock. As is, we could ring a gong at 100, but didn’t try for any shots with magnified optics. As the barrel is close to 8″, the 115 grain bullets leave the muzzle somewhere around 1,250 fps. That’s would give you more distance before the bullet begins its precipitous drop.
Issues?
The Scorpion’s ergonomics are really solid. The grip is flared at the end, which makes holding it easy, but it lacks aggressive texture. The open hollow end is also deceptive–I never tried to insert a magazine into it, but I can imagine someone trying in the heat of the moment.
The H&K style slide drop will be foreign to some, but is incredibly easy to learn and use. And everything else seems incredibly well thought out. Take the placement of the front sight, for example–it rides back a bit so you can grip in front of it.
The mag holds 20 rounds.
There could be more issues for sling attachments. I’d like to use a QD single point, but that isn’t immediately available. Still, there are numerous options, so why am I bitching? I guess I’d like to see a gun that is this close to perfect really be perfect.
As far as issues with manipulation, we didn’t experience any. If a round gets off the extractor, or a shell gets stuck, the Scorpion will be harder to clear than a typical polymer pistol. But we didn’t get to test it in anyway that wasn’t staged, and that only provides limited information. All told, we were exceptionally pleased with the way it worked.
Wrapping up
This is only the first look at the Scorpion. We’ll do more with the gun as the pace of SHOT Show 2015 slows down. We’ll put it through its paces in a more complete way. For now, though, we’re smitten.
This gun is going to sell like crazy. And if the ATF’s ruling doesn’t change people’s minds about the use of a stabilizing brace, the gun will be really popular. At the $849 price, it should be an easy decision. That price will likely settle out about $100 lower once demand and supply level off. My thought is that everyone should have a gun like this. It fill a huge void between the rifle and the pistol, and allows for some of the benefits of both.
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Handsome gun.
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Easy to see why you want the hand-stop.
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The big block of the front sight.
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Enough rail for mounting options.
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The rear sling point.
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The easy to attach and adjust sights are great.
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An abundance of polymer.
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Don’t stick a mag in the grip. Won’t work.
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The big flare at the end of the mag.
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This is all of the grip texture.
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The small ejection port.
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Aggressive texture to cut glare.
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The frame is fat, but easy to hold.
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Lots of hook sling points.
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Flip up aperture settings.
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Easy to adjust.
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The charging handle.
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The mag is almost all polymer.
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Easy to see how many are loaded.
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The rear of the mag.
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The front of the mag.
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Polymer feed lips.
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Handsome gun.
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It looks naked without its mag.
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The cage.
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The front is a viable place to grip.
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Inside the lower.
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Take down is easy.
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The size makes the Scorpion very maneuverable.
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The missing grip texture is more of an issue with leather gloves.
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I purchased my CZ Evo 3 last month and I am wondering if anyone knows when and if they will be aloud to sell the stock buttstock so I can make it an sbr. Please advise if anyone knows. Thank you!
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look at FAQs on CZ-USA website. they have submitted paperwork to ATF, to see if Evo pistol can be converted to SBR rifle, for the original factory buttstock, whether it will require x number of USA parts, or not. once ATF replies, CZ-USA will either have to manufacture, or arrange for somebody to manufacture those USA made compliance parts. if ATF says it’s okay without compliance parts, they could start selling the factory buttstocks to those who have approved Form 1 SBR paperwork in hand.
I SUSPECT that ATF WILL require x number of USA made parts (after all, they are agency of “NO”), so that will slow things down.
I purchased my CZ Evo 3 last month and I am wondering if anyone knows when and if they will be aloud to sell the stock buttstock so I can make it an sbr. Please advise if anyone knows. Thank you!
I guess most of you are not familiar with Steyr AUG and Sig 550/551 plastic mags. They use no metal reinforcement on lips and yet last for decades without any damage. Indestructible some of those Euro plastics. Evo 30 rounders will hopefully be in the same category. They cost only $20 each on CZ-USA website which is a bargain. With the original Czech Evo folding and extendible stock, which looks PERFECT on the gun, after getting Evo registered as SBR, it will be pretty cool modern gun, a worthy successor of the original Scorpion .32 ACP. Not as effective as MP-5, UZI, Sterling or other full auto subguns, but the next best thing. CZ firearms rock!!
I think the new Scorpion with shoulder stock would make a great addition to black BTU wearing, masked, armored-up para-military troops that currently serve warrants and keep the peace here in the states.
Just think how badass they would look flash banging and doing cool guy CQB room clears with the sexy Scorpion evos waving about while serving parking ticket warrants to old ladies.
Ordinarily, I would never buy a pistol like this. I consider them rifles with missing parts. But this on is just too cool. I’ll be getting one.
Not sure what this does that my VMAC-45 doesn’t, and for less than $500. It’s all steel, .45 ACP, and takes standard 30 round M-3 grease gun mags that are steel, mil spec, and cheap. The only plastic in or on the gun is the mag follower.
It’s way too heavy to shoot one handed, but from what the reviewer says this CZ doesn’t work well one handed either. I put a piece of pic rail on mine and mounted a light/laser combo under the front end. Can’t think of a better weapon to have when something goes bump at 3 AM.
I’m also thinking my VMAC will be doing service with one of my grandsons long after I’m gone, and long after most of my plastic guns have gone to that great recycling center in the sky.
I think there’s a lot of push back on this platform with several valid points. Personally, if I needed something close to this, I would just get a carbine pistol kit for my Glock or other favorite hand gun. There’s nothing this gun offers that wouldn’t be solved with a carbine kit at our below this price point and you still have the option to carry the hand gun stand alone as desired. Essentially reviews like this are biased and clearly several readers have picked up on this fact. It’s almost like the author is worried about getting further products from CZ rather than present an unbiased perspective. I’m glad this was picked up in the comments written by readers.
First, the muzzle report of a 5.56, especially inside a dwelling, is deafening. Second, the muzzle flash from a 5.56 will definitely ruin your night vision, even with a longer barrel. Third, it’s overkill for a home defense gun where you’ll be shooting at most 20 or 30 feet. The 9mm is a proven round, relatively inexpensive, and compatible with 9mm handguns you might have for backup. And it will stop any human threat, especially at close range. Why not just use your Glock 17 as some have suggested? A bigger gun gives you more to hold onto which translates into greater potential accuracy putting rounds on target. A smaller pistol is better for carrying concealed but in the home that’s not a factor. With a silencer, Sig brace, reflex sight, and flashlight, this type of weapon would make the ideal home defense gun. I’ve been considering a Sig MPX but think I’ll wait a little while to see how this plays out. There’s definitely a niche for this gun.
9mm Parabellum is a decent SMG cartridge, but not real great on stopping power from a pistol. A snoot full of bullets which arrive on target micro seconds apart from a SMG is a whole lot different than one or two, probably poorly placed, from a pistol. It’s a lot like a shotgun blast. Even the vaunted .45 Colt did at times fail to stop the Morro warriors in the 1899-1902 conflict, so did the .30 Krag rifle round for that matter.
First, the muzzle report of a 5.56, especially inside a dwelling, is deafening. Second, the muzzle flash from a 5.56 will definitely ruin your night vision, even with a longer barrel. Third, it’s overkill for a home defense gun where you’ll be shooting at most 20 or 30 feet. The 9mm is a proven round, relatively inexpensive, and compatible with 9mm handguns you might have for backup. And it will stop any human threat, especially at close range. Why not just use your Glock 17 as some have suggested? A bigger gun gives you more to hold onto which translates into greater potential accuracy putting rounds on target. A smaller pistol is better for carrying concealed but in the home that’s not a factor. With a silencer, Sig brace, reflex sight, and flashlight, this type of weapon would make the ideal home defense gun. I’ve been considering a Sig MPX but think I’ll wait a little while to see how this plays out. There’s definitely a niche for this gun.
This is just another over priced pistol without a niche at this price. Lose some of the rifle items like the over kill sights and get it down to say $500. Otherwise it’s a goner after the first year as there are many in the $500 price range to choose from.
I wish they would compete against the sig mpx and make a carbine version. Just add a longer barrel and a stock. Maybe a mod rail attachment to give you more reach with a longer barrel. A pistol caliber carbine is a better suited gun for what people are likely to face as upposed to an AR15. Most people dont invest enough in training, or live in a place, to be able to shoot past 100yds accurately anyway. I like the capability to be able to carry more ammo, while carrying less wieght, and cutting the training cost. Ammo prices are comming back down but 9mm is almost always going to be cheaper than 5.56
Funny so many so many folks that hate this weapon still read the test…seemed like everyone is an ex super mojo gun master and without actually shooting one or even seeing one can miraculously know how it works………I’ve owned CZ’s for a LONG time …they rarely..if ever fail and are very accurate fun to shoot weapons…I will hold such harsh judgement as to reliability and shoot-ability (and just plain fun factor) until seeing one and shooting one…all polymer is also not from Wal-mart ..i’ve seen some NICE polymer mags. If its that horrible just turn away.
Im with you steve. The SCAR, ACR, and many other modern firearms, use polymer in some pretty key areas. I’ve had tons of polymer mags for a variety of guns and there is a major difference between bad polymer and good polymer. The same as polymer lower recievers for AR15’s. The internet allows you to be who ever you want to be, unfortunately almost everyone chooses to be an a hole. I think there are a few things that could be done to this gun to open its range of usefulness. I am dissapointed they started out with a “tacticool” pistol for the civilian market but give it some time and theyll make some changes to the design.
Should have been chambered in .30 Carbine if they wanted to make something out of the ordinary or maybe in .22 TCM. A more useful cartridge and plenty of ammo out there. With it being in 9mm, might as well use a tried and tested 9mm pistol already on the market.
Nice looking, I was hoping for a CZ scorpion in .380 that is made and is similar to the original .32 Scorpion. I would hope they would offer this in .40 or .45 with maybe an inch or inch and a half longer barrel. My tow pistol caliber carbines work for me because of the stock. Of my two I prefer the Berretta storm. I presume that after it takes off 30 rd. mags will come available.
This thing is neat, I’m firmly in the “good chance I’ll pick one up” group… Though I would like to see a carbine model, just get creative with the barrel extension, don’t do what Kriss or the HK94 did, make it asthetically pleasing.
It’s the innovative and simplistic design together with a 45 acp. pistol cartridge that has relatively no recoil or muzzle rise, that makes the KRISS a superior and attractive weapon. Not it’s looks.
It is now, what the Tommy Gun was then.
Chris, you should own a KRISS, if only because you share names….lol
Sorry, but I love that thing, and will defend it like my child.
Ya it’s an ok PDW if you like 9 mm. or your buying for “cool factor”…… I guess.
You could probably get good with it, but many others are better.
The KRISS is hard to beat.— https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=mW24BVHNa3A
So is the FN P-90 (my favorite) over a 9 mm. 5.7 x 28 mm.can carry more per volume with superior penetration.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SNYhC2p_RdI&feature=player_detailpage
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=isxrclxTkL0&feature=player_detailpage
I will own these 2 as soon as I get out of California. 10 rounder versions are worthless and neutered.
It’s a shame our 2A rights have been infringed upon.
A PDW with auto double or triple tap capabilities would serve us well.
It would be nice if they came out with mags with metal feed lips and I would love to see it in .40 S&W or .45 ACP. Maybe add some finger groves and stippling on the grip. It is a good start for a 2 hand intermediate shooter, plinker and home defense. Could be much improved.
Where in Florida will we be able to purchase this remarkable weapon from CZ ?
You can pre-order from Impactguns.com
I’m guessing this message don’t land in california?
The range toy/plinker factor is high. Shoot it like a carbine minus the buttstock with weak hand on the forearm. At a local bowling pin match, we have a rimfire pistol category and a couple of times I shot my Ruger Charger w/red dot on the sawed-off pin heads. It was like cheating, I shot personal best times and had the fastest time in the category. Just for fun after my first round I would set up 8 pin tops instead of the usual 5 and my times were were as good or better than everybody else shooting 5 pin tops. This style of handgun is an intermediate to the pistol and carbine for quick accuracy on multiple targets. It could be argued that there are better calibers than 9mm for whatever purpose but certainly you can get the most out of the 9 just shy of what you will get from a carbine. I’m not promoting it but some people may see this a a “Personal Defense Weapon Lite” in that as it’s technically a pistol so it may be legal to carry loaded in a vehicle if the user has a concealed permit (it would be where I live). Is this particular gun a reliable and robust system? I don’t know. But I do believe the average shooter can hit multiple targets significantly quicker or put multiple rapid fire rounds on a single target more precisely. My Charger presently has magnification on top so it only works from the bipod now, but if you have one and a spare red dot you should give off-hand shooting with it a try. Nobody is going to sell their Glock, Smith, or 1911, but that doesn’t mean this type of gun doesn’t have a place in the collection, depending on the shooter’s wants or needs.
Is it even possible to add a Sig brace to it? Also, I seen the ATF’s recent letter.. A few things on it- first one is the ATF needs to STFU and repeal the NFA anyways, period.. Second, these complete MORONS need to quit sending in letters to them asking “is it ok if I shoulder the gun”, they already sent a letter out months ago saying it was, leave it alone! Especially the websites/YouTube channels that continuously bring it up daily.. Leave it the hell alone, PLEASE! It’s like your poking at a hornets nest, eventually you’re gonna get stung.. Last, I don’t see how they can legally ban you from using a “legal” item in anyway you wish.. It just doesn’t make any sense.. Which takes me back to my first point, they need to STFU and repeal the NFA, period.. And the second, people need to STFU and leave the hornets nest alone..
There ya go! Gov’t just wants a piece of your pie. So go ahead with your stock add on and SBR it. $200 bucks stamp is what it takes. And CZ has it’s own stock that you can buy.
Tacti-cool for Tacti-fools. Too big for a pistol, too small for a rifle and made of genuine plasticky parts that cost about $50 bucks and the gun sells for over $800. Haaaaaaahaaaaahaaaa. At least it was in 9mm which out penetrates the worthless .223 cartridge.
Last time I looked, the 5.56 (aka .223 Rem) had laid out several battlefields worth of dead guys, so your “worthless” comment is just that, worthless.
I never thought I’d see CZ create a product with no apparent “demand for the product”! Generally, manufacturers perceive a market need, and they react to it. Rarely will a company make a product, and then try TO CREATE A DEMAND FOR IT. It can be a huge, huge gamble.
Take what I think is typical of many, if not most 9MM handgun users. I believe that there are three types of users of today’s 9MM users. The full size 9MM is still the police duty arm in many many communities, and many guard services still use them. Then you have a group of shooters that enjoy plinking with a full size nine. Those that an EDC have chosen a “compact” nine. Capacities for 9MM Compacts have reached that all-important “comfort level”. Having a Compact in your hand, which made it far easier to conceal, while still putting up to 15 + 1 in my hand, I am still comfortable. The final group of 9MM carriers are those that fell into the “Pocket Pistol” nitche. Pocket pistols generally fit in the palm of your hand. When they first hit the market it was in .32acp caliber. Then the race to 9MM was on. What this group wanted above all else was complete “Its’ not there” concelability . Capacity had to be equal to that of mid-large framed revolvers. By a huge majority semi-autos out sold revolvers. These small handguns had capacity in the 6 + 1, 7 + 1, or 8 + 1 range. Guns in this category can often be found in the bottom of jean pockets, among lipsticks at the bottom of the purse. These Lil’ Guns pushed the development of a whole new breed of holsters, to to safely carry our pocket pistols.
You’re neglecting the fact that this was designed as an SMG and is widely used as such in Europe. It’s recieved acclaim and success there. Here at home, I’ve been wanting a 9mm carbine that I can SBR, or that I would have used a Sig brace with, but AR parts are so expensive, and confusing, and they’re hard to get running properly. There really aren’t many options for a 9mm rifle out there. When I get one of these, I’ll be getting a tax stamp for it, and it’ll probably make both my wife and I very happy as a little concealable home defense rifle. I’ve been looking for that for years now.
Im just an old man who knows nothing about black plastic guns good or bad. But I am confident and comfortable with my Kimber pro carry 2 1911 .45.
Works fine and accurate with any round I run through it.
Recon I’m outdated !
just a range toy! for $800.00 i culd buy a medium-grade, AR- pistol, or full-sized rifle.
idk wht the KRISS costs, but Glock owners, there ya go. add an extended barrel and voila.
just my $0.02.
+ 1 on the KRISS
Okay, if you want a toy, one that is too big to really shoot one handed, too small to effectively use two handed, (no shoulder stock), all the while shooting a low knock down cartridge, sorry to those that love 9s, but it is true, then buy this firearm.
For the people looking for an actually effective self defense weapon, there are too many to list better suited out there!!
There is nothing fast, intuitive, or anything else except a bulky weapon for playing with at the range or plinking.
As for those thinking about over penetration, let us get serious for a moment.
When was the last time you heard about a round over penetrating in a gun fight and injuring someone?
Yes, is can happen, but even most stray rounds do not hit anyone, except with police shootings, might have something to do with the number of rounds they fire and the poor training too many of them have.
I has been shown over and over with testing, a 5.56 is less likely to over penetrate than a 9mm is, with almost any kind of ammunition! But seriously, just when does it happen, except in posts like this?
This is an ugly, easy to shoot your finger off, weapon, looking for a place to be sold! One could do much better for just about any situation than this thing. However, it will most likely make for an interesting collector piece in a few years, kind of like the Gyrojet Piston, except you will still be able to buy ammo for it. 🙂
You know what’d be REALLY neat? If CZ came out with a version of this “pistol” that accepted their super-cool P-09 magazines. THAT’d be neat. Then, those of us with CZ P-07s and P-09s would have mag compatibility between the two platforms.
That was one of my biggest disappointments with the EVO. I’d SBR one of these if it had mag compatibility with the P-07/P-09 series and use it in our club’s pistol carbine two gun runs. As it is, if I have to carry different mags, I’ll stick with my P-07 and Sub2000 using cheap Glock mags even though I’d really like the superior ergonomics.
Whoever said this was a “Mall Ninja” weapon was SPOT ON!! No self respecting guy w/any ops background would buy one of these- would buy more ammo/mags for the kit they already own.
Ridiculousness!!!
No self respecting guy with any background would care what others thought about them for buying one of these weapons, 10s of thousands of which are used by militaries and police forces around the world.
9mm Luger, that is a real yawner. 100+ year old cartridge that only existed because that is the biggest bullet that could be stuffed into the original 7.65mm Luger case. Without the full auto capability, it is no better than any other 9mm handgun.
.45 ACP or 10mm Auto, or a 5.7, that might have been interesting. As is, I will pass thanks.
Hear here!
+ 1 for JKnTX’s wisdom
So its capacity is one more than a CZ P-09 and I think a Springfield XD, but weights 3 lbs more. I am trying to see the benefit of this thing other than a fun gun.
“This gun is going to sell like crazy” No, I don’t think so. Not among people that are thinking about purpose, it won’t.
“And if the ATF’s ruling doesn’t change people’s minds about the use of a stabilizing brace, the gun will be really popular” Again,it is very doubtful. This gun is a novelty, at best.
“At the $849 price, it should be an easy decision.” I do not wish to offend the author, but come on, dude. I wouldn’t give $200.00 for this POS.
“That price will likely settle out about $100 lower once demand and supply level off. My thought is that everyone should have a gun like this.” Well, all I can say, is that I am glad you are not in charge of my armory. No offense, I understand that writing stuff like this is how you get paid, and most of us have a boss.
I love all you idiots calling it a POS having never handled or fired one. As far as not selling they have already pre-sold the entire year’s run so I guess they know more about the market than a bunch of whiny Internet trolls…
Great coverage of the shot show ,unfortunately I live in Massachusetts and 95% of everything at the shot show will never be available to us here.We cant even order ammo on line.That god I still have my gen 2 glocks and preban mags otherwise i would be in deep kaka
Sounds like time to go west, young man, go west.
Stop before you get to California and hang a right.
This place is a joke lately- are you fricken serious? Almost all polymer AND polymer feed lips on the mags- yeah right, that’s gonna last really long…
Save your money and buy a Glock 17 with real steel-reinforced magazines (32rd), and if you absolutely need to, an extended bbl. You’ll still be cheaper than this abomination, and you’ll have a firearm that can be a range toy, but is also a serious defensive tool.
Of course, if you have more money than brains and want a POS that will break very soon, knock yourself out and buy two of these skorpion crap slabs.
I’m guessing you’ve never shot a CZ. You should really check them out instead of bashing them. Your bias attitude of GLOCK sickens me. I’d imagine this gun is as reliable and accurate as their others. I don’t have one yet so I can talk specifics but I’d put my CZP07 against ANY GLOCK ANY DAY!!!
You must own stock in Glock. You’re their biggest cheerleader!
Marvelously funny from reading both “sides”. It is still a weapon designed to meet a supposed demand, it is not one designed to create one.
Is the barrel threaded, suppressor ready?
Why not keltec’s sub rifle for a short plastic gun in hicap 9 mil? Half the price and a stock. I just wish they made in .45acp
I found this article lacked substance and focus. Forget about my opinion that a 556 for home defense is just plain insane. Unless you hate everyone in your house and the houses next to you.
A pistol of this type has a very limited market and in 9mm virtually none with a 20 round capacity. Those of you in executive, VIP defense will attest to its serious limitations. Furthermore, how a particular weapon looks is the least important issue yet you seemed obsessed with it. Handsome? Really?
Then we get a brief synopsis on Sig’s arm brace. Then more about how it looks. A brief paragraph on the uselessness of the staged malfunctions.
Then, the apparent serious issue of the hollow grip (a valid point) yet you just brushed over it. If you look at the picture with the caption “the big flare at the end of the mag”. First that’s the previously mentioned hollow grip and even if it was the “mag well” it’s still not the “mag”. Poorly written, poorly edited and uninformative. Come on guys up your game a little.
Well said
When I was boy, we were taught to pick up the shotgun and shoot them in the guts or in the BLEEPS, if we had to defend the house. Didn’t matter what gauge- made a wound like a bloody rat hole at close range and real tough for the docs to fix.
Cool gun; wish they would have made to accept CZ 75b magazines! and sure make the hollow handle hold a fully loaded spare magazine too! Should have tested with hollow points?
Definitely looks like a fun range gun, but for SD, I’d rather have a Glock or some other 9mm proven design with a high capacity magazine.
I have been looking at a Skorp for over 2 years. I didn’t buy the originals as I didn’t want to deal with an oddball round.
This new model is really nice looking, but I miss the old school style of the originals.
For me, I will have to wait to buy, I still want it with the original UZI style vibe to it.
Its just a range toy, right?
This a civilian version of cz sub machine gun it does have a stock from cz or an adapter for m4 stock if you want to pay200 for sbr stamp
my question is if sig braces are a no go will cz make a 16 inch carbine version?
cool!!! gun. you and I know the govt.won`t allow this for long.
the price doesn’t seem right, too high.
9 mil. ughhhhh!
cool!!! gun. you and I know the govt.won`t allow this for long.
the price doesn’t seem right, too high.
9 mil. ughhhhh!
I expect price will make or break this one, and the price looks right to me – it also brings attention to their brand in general, especially here in the US, smart move in my opinion. Then again, I may be biased because I’m a CZ fan.
Very cool. Wonder if it is possible to add a folding stock and SBR it. Would be a handy little package. I agree that 9 mm is better for HD. Right now I am running a 9 mm Tavor in that capacity.
I love it, but our dear ATF just shot the Scorpion through the heart with it’s latest letter…sad.
Is there room to attach a suppressor.
My first thought is that this will be an excellent substitute by price wise of the mp5 family, even the POF (Pakistani ordinance). CZ has an excellent reputation and has been making the scorpion for many years. Now while the article did not specify, only pictures, there was only safe and single fire, vs the original that was a fully automatic capability. Would be nice to know the importer, distributor for further sales.
My first thought is that this will be an excellent substitute by price wise of the mp5 family, even the POF (Pakistani ordinance). CZ has an excellent reputation and has been making the scorpion for many years. Now while the article did not specify, only pictures, there was only safe and single fire, vs the original that was a fully automatic capability. Would be nice to know the importer, distributor for further sales.
“5.56, even from short barrels, may present an over-penetration problem that could be catastrophic. The 9mm is a better option,”
Actually this is not true, many tests show that almost all 5.56 / .223 (especially self defense rounds) over-penetrates through walls and people less than handgun rounds, even hollowpoints.
I thought the same thing. Especially if your using a frangible 5.56 round for home defense. Nonetheless, CZ makes awesome firearms. My CZ-75 is one of my favorite handguns and is a tacck driver.
I can see this Scorpion as being something fun to have at the range, but I’m not sure if I want to spend $800 plus for a fun gun.
I thought the same thing. Especially if your using a frangible 5.56 round for home defense. Nonetheless, CZ makes awesome firearms. My CZ-75 is one of my favorite handguns and is a tacck driver.
I can see this Scorpion as being something fun to have at the range, but I’m not sure if I want to spend $800 plus for a fun gun.
Can you please cite a source? I did a quick search and found nothing corroborating your statement. I’m about to make a decision to buy, and this would change things for me. Thanks in advance.
A good starting point is DocGKR’s “best choices for self defense ammo” (Google it). In that article there’s a section on penetration. As you can see, after going through wallboard, .223 / 5.56 tends to penetrate through ballistics gelatin less than handgun rounds.
There are also other tests out there (Google .223 / 5.56 drywall penetration – the NJ DoCJ has a test too) that show that many .223 / 5.56 rounds tend to fragment and tumble after hitting drywall. There are also other tests, like the Box O’ Truth, that show .223 / 5.56 penetrates more than handgun rounds in some instances… however note that he tested XM193 ball, and not modern defensive ammo that’s been proven to be far superior (because it upsets and fragments much more violently inside ballistics gelatin) such as Hornady TAP FPD.
Either way you look at it, both .223 and 9mm, .45, .40, etc. are all going to penetrate drywall easily to some degree and to a point.
Box-O-Truth (google it) exploded the “5.56 penetrates walls more than pistol calibers” thing long ago.. The real problem with 5.56 is how LOUD it is. But then my HD choices are 12 GA buckshot and a 10MM pistol.. better ears ringing than return fire, and if time allows earplugs are fast, anyway
Jim, it’s all going through the walls and furniture.
And in some cases, you may actually want it to anyway.
But if your worried about it, and you have neighbors or family beyond your target, shoot low or at a downward angle.
The criminal will go down with a leg or waist shot and present a low lethal shot immediately after.
Collateral damage minimized if not completely eliminated.
Dry train often in your home.
Get to know ballistics better.
Both are fun and interesting.
If people learned how to aim, they wouldn’t have to worry so much about wildly firing their HD ammo.
You say your getting ready to make a decision on a HD firearm purchase? (1st tip; don’t buy the above)
Go 3 gun or more depending on how many rooms you have.
1. Remington 870 12 GA express pump-7+1 (20 GA youth even better) shorter, ease of use, cheaper ammo.
2. S&W M&P Sport 5.56/.223, or go with a Bulgarian. AK 74 5.45 (very inexpensive to shoot)
3. Full size pistol; Glock, S&W M&P, or (my favorite) Walther PPQ (M1)
9mm’s are easy to operate, but .40, 45acp, 10 mm. are a much better choice. ( more is sometimes better)
After that, pocket pistols for strolling around the house.
S&W or Ruger stainless .357 & .44 mag revolvers in the bathroom or garage might be the call.
These are my choices and I know people are all different and everyone’s needs may vary, but that CZ is just fluff, and something you don’t need right away.
I hope this saves you time, money and anguish on your upcoming HD decision.
Russ , I agree with you completely except for the fluff , ha . I’ve never owned anything bigger caliber wise than the .45 but have had most of the others .
A couple of years ago I went to Tanfoglio and bought two 10 mm’s . 4 3/4″ and 6″ barrel for a hunter , basicly copies of the CZ75 . Between the two about 2500 rounds and so far everything has worked like it should . Have used every ammo you can think of .
Going house to house there’s no way the military wants the 9 mm and all I know had .40’s or .45’s . That should tell you that this should be unacceptable for home defense if you’re serious . The 20 gauge would be my choice also and is . My idea is not just to put em’ down but put em’ down in the next county . Overkill ? Dead is dead .
Collateral damage ? That’s the last thing I worry about . If worried get a BB gun.
Most importantly the gun ” must ” fit you whatever you buy .
Hi dennisbartlett , your reply to me is exactly right.
Ya that Tanfoglio looks like a real ass kicker.
You could use it as brass knuckles if you didn’t want to waste ammo (or court costs).
For a 10 mm; I really like the Glock 29. It’s compact and holds 10, and with the mag finger extension, holds well.
Please don’t get me wrong on that “fluff” part. Maybe I should have said “extra cheese”
CZ is an excellent manufacturer.
I just mean that the gun above is for when you already have the one’s you need.
More like a fun gun, cool factor, or “gotta have in my collection” gun.
Tacti-cool but is it going to fill a specific requirement? Wouldn’t a Glock with a 32 round mag fill that same requirement with less bulk, easier handling and a long record of reliability? Or substitute your favorite hi cap pistol in place of the Glock. I doubt this one will have a long production life.
How about it filling the requirement of being fun and unique?
If this ends up being as good as it seems it will be (jury is still out as very few people have it yet) I see this as a really fun range toy (maybe I’ll change my mind when I actually get it, we’ll see) and also a great alternative home defense weapon for those who either can’t afford an AR or can’t easily wield one, like women and older folks. Glocks and some other pistols can be limp wristed, my guess is this cannot. Handguns can be pushed out of battery fairly easy or malfunction if something comes in contact with the slide if it’s fired… this gun probably won’t have that problem. Handguns can be difficult for some to rack, while this will likely be much easier.
Handguns have their place and are great and all, but like ARs (which I also love) they can be kind of boring because they’re so ubiquitous. Who doesn’t have one? Who hasn’t shot one? Who hasn’t discussed and argued over almost every aspect of it to death and seen pictures upon pictures of them online?
On the other hand who has a gun that looks and is operated like this? Of course it’s not the first of its kind but it is by far the most appealing when you consider all the factors.
Let’s make a wager- I’ll run my G17 and you run this crap slab. We’ll fire 10,000 rounds in hot, sandy, muddy, wet, and then snowy conditions. After your crap slab’s magazines have broken and/or the plastic feed lips are out of spec, you’ll be loading single-shot, which will slow you down considerably. There is no contest in the reliability dept- this thing is a toy- and notice how no mention of the “adequate” accuracy- that means the skorpion accuracy sucks elephant dong, and it’s how unscrupulous gun writers gloss over it without actually lying.
Also, the sights are “amazing” to the author?! Really, how about “basic or tiny?” If old A2-style flip-up apertures amaze Dave, then I think a set of Troy tritiums would make him stroke out.
This thing is a mall ninja toy, and you
I’m with you, Sarge. I have a Sig, a Beretta, a Glock, and a Browning Hi-Power…all with approx. 30 rd. mags. Take any of them over this pos anytime. I have a Mac 9 I never shoot because it is too awkward.
I wouldn’t go so far as to call it a toy or a crap slab quite yet. Certainly it has a lot of an appeal as a range toy but the gun has been out for several years now as the CZ Scorpion Evo 3 A1 (vs. this S1) and has been in use by the Czech Armed Forces as well as some of their police. A couple of other countries’ militaries/police forces (Royal Malaysia Police, Philippine Coast Guard, etc.) have been using it too. By all accounts (and admittedly there aren’t nearly as many as there will be once more civilians in the US buy and test it), reliability is not an issue with this gun and from what I gather this new S1 version is the exact same gun, just in semi-automatic so civilians can buy it. So, you may end up being right, or you may not. We’ll see.
Also just because the mags are polymer doesn’t necessarily mean they’re not tough. Have you ever heard of PMAGs? They’re the industry standard when it comes to AR magazines and considered the most reliable ones you can buy. They are all polymer except for the spring.
As a CZ fan, also a Glock fan. To those who calls it a toy or a range gun, You are right to say it is being used as a full auto assault SMG ala MP5 by other countries that don’t get Colt, Sig and big company advertising . The “crap slab” magazine which is plastic just as the Glock’s will last as long as you take care of it. There are videos on YouTube with this gun firing as many rounds as you can put in it and with CZ’s reliability, I don’t think longevity of parts is a problem. As always, these haters are obviously ignorant about CZ’s.
Apparently you do not keep up with the firearms world to well. The CZ Skorpian has been exhaustively tested by numerous military and police forces in the EU, Mid East, South Amerca, Africa, and other regions. Many times side by side with the Sig MPX and newest iteration of the MP5. Quite a few militaries as well as police special operations groups have gone with the CZ Skorpian and the CZ P07, CZ P09 pistols as their duty weapons over the competition primarily for their ruggedness and reliability as well as price. You run your G17, and while your reloading your first mag, I’ll still be shooting my CZ P09, and I will be doing it with a wet muddy or Sandy gun (your choice) and I will be doing it at 50 yards accuratley. CZ Brno has been making high quality firearms for a lot longer than Gaston Glock has been around, and they have been providing firearms to professionals , military, competetive, and police shooters for way longer. If you are going to comment on a firearm, try to know something about them first.
I think you will find Glocks in service with more military and police agencies worldwide than CZ.
And how about another wager: someone shoots you shoot your G17 with a less than ideal grip, and someone else shoots the Scorpion, and we’ll see which one malfunctions because of a “limp wrist” (YouTube/Google it, it’s a very common problem with Glocks) and which one still operates just fine.
Well I have this CZ scorpion I’ve shot 5000 rounds through it I haven’t had one malfunction but if you think it’s junk (sarg) that’s your opinion it’s like ass holes everone has one but this little gun rocks it’s a keeper. I’ve filled out my paper work to SBR this can’t wait to shot it with a stock.
Own 3 glocks and 3 CZs….cant count how many 1000s of rounds through each (dirty, wet, sometimes i don’t even clean them) and they fire every time.
oh…”this one time i shot at a guy with my .45 and missed…but he died anyway because, hey…its a .45 (sarc!)
This type of gun’s accuracy is far less influenced by most of the factors that affect a standard pistol, especially under stress. Cold shaking hands, jerking the trigger, or losing the sight picture under recoil are some examples. Halfway between a pistol and a carbine. But it’s like computers and the internet or cellphones and texting – the people that were saying they were unnecessary years ago are all regular users now. Back in the ’70s a revolver (or maybe an old Colt 1911), a pump shotgun, and a lever or bolt action were all most folks cared about, and there seemed to be plenty of negative opinions about the type of things that are the big sellers now. Not that I haven’t been guilty myself…
Now since the final AFT ruling on the brace is in that you can put a brace on your pistol however if you shoulder it you are redesigning the brace into a SBR. Lets just try to get SMG’s legal again because I would really like this in a SMG 🙂
easy..there are other doo-dads one can put on the buffer tube to lend modest ergos and comfort to shoulder and cheek, just choose other than the sig brace. May not work as well, but might work well enough. It’s still a pistol that way and there is still no illegal way to hold a pistol..yet. The issue with the sig brace is that the BATF are reacting to it’s usage as a stock. Fortunately Sig is challenging the ruling, we’ll see what happens.