(Photo: AP Photo/Bill Haber)
If you’ve ever wondered why the federal government has two separate agencies that investigate the illegal manufacture, distribution, and possession of firearms, you’re not alone.
Wisconsin Rep. Jim Sensenbrenner reintroduced a bill on Thursday that would abolish one of those agencies—the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives—and transfer its responsibilities to the Federal Bureau of Investigation.
In a press release, Rep. Sensenbrenner cited rising government spending and debt as the primary motivation for the bill. “Common sense budgeting solutions are necessary, and the ATF Elimination Act is one measure we can take to reduce spending, redundancy, and practice responsible governance,” he said.
He also noted that the ATF “lacks a clear mission” and has been “plagued by backlogs, funding gaps, hiring challenges, and a lack of leadership.”
Under the terms of the bill, the ATF, FBI, and Drug Enforcement Agency would be required to submit a plan to Congress within 180 days that outlines how the ATF will be dismantled.
The FBI will handle all criminal and regulatory violations of the federal firearms, explosives, and arson laws, and the investigation of violent crime and domestic terrorism. The DEA will take over criminal and regulatory violations of the federal alcohol and tobacco smuggling laws.
ATF property will be either transferred to the FBI or excessed.
Rep. Sensenbrenner also said the ATF has been “branded by failure” and referenced the “scandal-ridden” nature of the agency, a clear allusion to the ATF’s so-called Fast and Furious operation in 2011.
SEE ALSO: DOJ Finds Serious Flaws in ATF’s Undercover Storefront Operations
The ATF allegedly designed the program to allow Mexican drug cartels to purchase illegal firearms so the agency could track and prosecute drug dealers working inside the U.S. But the operation went south, and agents lost track of many of the firearms.
Rather than allow the ATF to dismantle the cartels, the firearms were used to kill thousands of Mexican and at least one American, U.S. Border Patrol agent Brian Terry.
In another scandal, “Operation Fearless,” the ATF used juveniles in several of its undercover storefront operations. These operations were designed to purchase potentially illegal firearms and snare high-level targets.
Instead, the programs cost taxpayers thousands of dollars, and the ATF never succeeded in bringing down any noteworthy criminals. In several instances they also bought illegal weapons from juveniles without any clear direction from the agency’s leaders.
Ultimately, the FBI can do everything the ATF can do, only better. While taking on the ATF’s responsibilities may involve hiring more agents, the cost to taxpayers will be significantly less than funding a totally separate agency.
The bill will be considered in the upcoming legislative session, but has yet to be assigned to a committee.
Abolish all gun control acts and all federal agencies that were created for criminalizing citizens instead of criminals.
All our government does, is spend its time attacking its own constitution and criminalizing citizens with one sided laws that do absolutely nothing too stop real criminals.
The real criminals to citizen, country, and constitution are the political sucks within our government.
When criminals control law and legislation, criminals are created from the citizenry.
we need to over haul that brady bill to, ya know 30 yrs ago my ex wife and i had a slap down .i got a ticket went to court plead guilty to misdemor desturbing the peace. 15 years ago the atf came and took my firearms permit. all because of that thing 30 yrs ago. how many people lost long time jobs because of that crapp bill. it needs to go
Don’t stop there…while you’re at it, get rid of the bloated DHS as well. This is a redundant agency as well. Isn’t our military, CIA and FBI supposed to be protecting our country?
Yes…
Mostly tho any and all un-Constitutional laws- rules-orgs / esp ANY infringement on the “Bill of RIGHTS” = period-!!!
Yes…
Mostly however- END- any and all
un-Constitutional laws- rules-orgs /
esp ANY infringement on OUR
“Bill of RIGHTS” = period-!!!
Just outside of Houston’s Hobby Airport I noted a whole bunch of folk in black BDU’s milling about.
ARMED!
Drove over and the Houston agent in charge told me they, the ATF, were holding drill on the abandoned
apartment complex taken over by HUD.
As I watched, one of the “instructors” gather a dozen or so of his charges, stood beside an opened window
of a first floor CORNER apartment and EMPTIED his 9mm pistol’s magazine into the unit.
There were several agents down the way from this apartment unit.
Good thing no rounds left the unit or went through a side wall!
Many in the group appeared to be office types, as if a bunch of insurance agents and actuaries were deputized.
Two weeks later we read about the siege a the Brach Davidians outside of Waco.
ATF “cowboys” in charge.
bunch of people dressed in black BDU’S.
ATF FORMS should not take more than a MONTH from the time you MAIL it till the time you get it BACK !
Form 4\’s are taking 8 + to a YEAR to get back ! Spend $50,000 for a 1921 Thompson from a person in another state
pay $200 to get it transferred to a FFL dealer your state (8+ month wait for ATF approval ) THEN WAIT ANOTHER 8+
MONTHS TO A YEAR TO GET IT TRANSFERRED TO YOU ! WHILE YOU WAIT YOUR $50,000 gun is bouncing around
in someone else s safe and WHO KNOWS IF THEY ARE TEST DRIVING YOUR GUN or letting it rust or get banged up
while they take guns in and out of the safe ! IF IT IS STOLEN from the person who sold it to you ,does he have insurance or
the money to pay you back ? If it is STOLEN from the dealer does he have insurance or money to pay you ?
After waiting a YEAR & A HALF and the PRICE has GONE UP to $60,000 are they going to pay for the WAIT and the CURRENT PRICE ? What happens if the DEALER GOES BANKRUPT with your gun in his inventory , by law it\’s his till ATF says otherwise ! ATF GET OFF YOUR ASS AND DO YOUR JOB OR GET HELP TO DO YOUR JOB !
That\’s $200 tax to get it to (ATF) dealer then another $200 tax (ATF) to transfer it to you ! ($400)
MG\’s are running $5,000 to $500,000 and higher ! Dealer to Dealer Form 3 taking 2 months the you wait another 8+ months !
While I agree that the laws are the primary problem I also don’t think we should miss the opportunity to disband an organization that seems to be more focused on firearms than anything else. It’s their core mission. So transfer that to an organization where that focus has to compete with plenty of others making it more level on the playing field at worst case scenario. Anytime you have an agency like BATFE with only a few ‘regulatory’ categories they tunnel vision and seek/create a problem to fit their solution instead of the other way around to justify their existence and appease a gun loathing administration. So fix the laws but also don’t pass up an opportunity to get rid of an unneeded/excessive(in more ways than one) federal agency.
Government agencies once created last forever.
Repeal the firearms acts, first! They have never been constitutional and were only allowed because they CLAIMED to be regulating commerce! Now look what they do. If these are repealed (starting with 1934 and going all the way through) then there is no need for the BATFE and no need to transfer more responsibility to the FBI. Crimes commited with firearms should be punished as severely as crimes commited with any other weapon/tool/explosive, etc. “REASONABLE RESTRICTION” IS THE ANTITHESIS OF “SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED!”
do a way with the atf let some one take it over back a lot of years ago my dad went to a woman that lived not to far from us that sold beer and luq on sunday my mother called and called they did not do any thing with her all they want is your guns
I once called the ATF Hotline to report a former firearms retailer who had moved his inventory into his home and was selling as his personal collection. While maintaining his FFL, he bragged that he was selling the guns (at prices above retail) to anyone who had the money; without ID or background checks.
I was transferred from one agent to another, neither of whom even cared to take my report. When I stated my dismay, the reply was: “you’ve made your point”.
I have had interaction with ATF and find them dysfunctional at best. I support Sensenbrenner and his effort.
The remark about ‘Fast & Furious’ going “South” is both figural AND literally! Still I would not place the blame on the Agents. Instead place it where it belongs, on the leadership especially Clinton and Obama who wee so gung-ho to make guns illegal that they liked this scheme. Also it was not just Brian Terry who was murdered, there was another Agent who was working with the Mexican Federals who was ambushed and murdered along with a number of Mexican Agents. They did get the part right about thousands of others who were murdered by these firearms and I blame then President Obama and then Secretary Clinton for this mess.
Since no one else has said it, I will:Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms should be the name of a convenience store, not a government agency….
It is the right move to get rid of ATFE. Basically all it did is infringe upon the 2nd Amendment rights and, on top of that, it, like most of the Federal Government is Unconstitutional. Read Article I, Section 8 and you will find a list of the areas in which Congress can Constitutionally make laws. You will not find Education, Healthcare and Health insurance, Housing & Urban Dev., Agriculture, Transportation, Energy, Labor, Environment/Climate change, Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms, nor explosives to name the most obvious ones.
The FDA is the most egredious. It was set up to test medical drugs to verify that they were effective and safe to use. Then in 1992 Congress passed a law that allows the Drug Companies, the people they were set up to monitor and control, to pay all the FDA salaries and bonuses. So it has become the Lap Dog of the Drug Cartel. Now they do not test drugs, they just approve what the Drug Companies send them. In 2014 (the last year I have seen data) drugs, takes as prescribed, killed over 106,000 people. Now I’m seeing numbers like 128,000 per year killed by drugs with no info on how they were taken.
The point is that in 2015 after they data of over 106,000 was killed by drugs the FDA did not ban any drugs, they did not even require warning labels on the specific drugs involved, they did NOTHING.
The EPA started out as a group to help protect the land from destruction by natural events like hurricanes and earthquakes. It has degenerated into nothing but a way for the government to get controls of more and more land at the expense of the legal owners.
Our Government is about 80-90 Percent Unconstitutional and Congress continues to fund all this and even make laws aiding and abetting the illegal things, after taking an oath to Uphold and Defend the Constitution.
The NATION is in a bad situation, maybe even as bad as it was when King George gave the colonies problems and brought about the Revolution.
ELIMINATING THE BATFE IS LONG OVER DO AND SHOULD NEVER HAVE BEEN ALLOWED TO BE CREATED IN THE FIRST PLACE! THE ATFE PART IS LEGAL IN AMERICA. WHAT IS ILLEGAL IS, IN SOME CASES, THERE USE. THAT IS WHERE THE FOCUS SHOULD HAVE ALWAYS BEEN AND ALWAYS FOREVER BE! IF AMERICAS CITIZENS ARE TO REMAIN FREE!
Yea, eliminate the law and congress, I want what you got so I will take what I want by force of arms! Hell yea!! Anyone out there got a pretty petite woman at home, I’m lonely, I’ll give you a dollar for her, or just take her after I off you from 700 yards! I like this idea!!!
JUST SAY THAT YOUR A MUSLIM. GEESH!
Asswipes like you do more harm to honest gun owners than anything else. Go away, you’re an anti-gun troll.
Yes I am working on this and would also like to restore the gun rights of 330 drug dealers a friend of mine pardoned. I will expedite them back into US neighborhoods ASAP. (But not next door to me) Thanks.
PUT BOUNTY’S ON THEIR SCALPS AND HOLD THE ONE THAT PARDONED THEM PERSONALLY AND FINANCIALLY RESPONSIBLE, WHEN THEY COMMIT ANY NEW CRIME!
Good work on your efforts. Would you kindly consider restoring voting rights to the pardoned felons?
They’re at such a great disadvantage, . Perhaps they ought to be made eligible for unemployment benefits, food stamps, and free cell phones.
They already are eligible for welfare, our State of Massachusetts coaches convicts.who are being released to apply for welfare !
what about the people that served their time for a pot charge he did all his time and peroled out and holds a good job. he still can not vote. and this is from 1990. it is bull he paid his debit
The problem here is less the ATF than the legal structure that regulates alcohol, tobacco, firearms and explosives. As long as the same laws, regulations and enforcement authority remain in place, it won’t make much difference who does the enforcing — and every agency of government is subject to the influence of whatever administration is in power, and likely to be used by politicians to hassle, intimidate, and distort the law to advance their agenda.
What is really needed is a major rewrite of the laws and regulations pertaining to firearms (and alcohol, tobacco and explosives, as well), with the purpose of simplifying and relaxing (and in many instances, eliminating) federal control over firearm manufacture, importation, sales and ownership. Shifting enforcement to another agency solves nothing with regard to the overreach of government power, which is the real problem with ATF — unless their powers are substantially reduced, the next leftist administration will do as Obama and Clinton did, and use whoever is enforcing these laws to push their ant-gun policies.
This is an excellent comment. It is the infringement of our unalienable rights by unconstitutional “laws” that is the problem. Rescind the GCA and the NFA, and the “need” for the BATFE becomes moot. If the right to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed, that must include the inherent, unalienable right to purchase said arms (and accessories). In a free society, to have to fill out paperwork and pay taxes to acquire arms and/or accessories [to buy a suppressor (commonsense hearing protection for oneself and one’s family), for example] is an infringement of our rights as free men as well as an infringement of the U.S. Constitution. Federal government regulation of firearms (arbitrary government infringement) by type of arm, by barrel length, by hearing protection accessory (suppressors), etc. is an outright infringement of Amendment II; it is antithetical to freedom and liberty and will remain a danger to our inherent, inalienable right to keep and bear arms until completely eliminated.
Precisely Bisely. The cure for all the agency abuses and growing Totalitarianism is quite simple, The problem is that the Totalitarian mass mind control agenda that has been up and running strongly for a couple generations, now, has already brainwashed us into accepting anything the government does as long as it’s for ‘public safety’ and extreme ‘crime prevention’ by police state authorities, while it conditions us to licking government ass, instead of Kicking their ass!
The only real solution is to start the REPEAL of all Federal Gun Laws. To wit; because they are ALL unconstitutional. And they serve no real purpose in society other than a means of achieving complete Totalitarian authority by disarming the American citizenry through illegal opposition targeted laws.
The ATF’s original purpose has been intentionally bastardized and actually doesn’t even need to be integrated into other corrupted agencies like the DEA or FBI because it really doesn’t even exist anymore? Every state has its own licensing/taxation/regulating office or department for Alcohol and tobacco regulations and commerce with their own state law enforcement officers for criminal illegality. ATF could never visit another state liquer store in their expensive body armor to do an ‘inspection’ and nobody would ever know the difference and certainly wouldn’t miss the disruption in their business.
Every county Sherriff’s department has Swat Team assets trained well enough in counter terrorism and explosives ordnance disposal and are just as good as any the ATF has. This is supported and backed up by state or large city resources with bomb and arson squads. Most bomb material and analysis investigations already goes to the FBI labs simply because they have the best facility/assets for this.
So what is the ATF good for now? Only to serve as the Nazi Gestapo enforcers for Citizen Disarmament agendas. It’s an American shame and disgrace to keep a criminal agency which does nothing except waste our tax dollars pulling self enhancing illegal raids, finding ways to chip away at our gun rights like banning more than 5 rounds in your shotgun magazine tube, or nit picking short rifle barrel lengths that make no sense at all, or absolutely criminally insane waste of time and money determine what is a pistol or a rifle, or prohibiting people from having (unless they pay the illegal gouge tax toll) a simple metal tube that prevents them from going deaf!!
And things like the latest effort to keep guns and ammo from Free American Citizens like what they had to gall to do just recently by changing the classification of wetted Nitrocellulose shipments to ‘high explosives’ so the extra industrial cost for your gunpowders will be trickled down prohibitively for public ammo purchases.
Keeping the BATFE and other useless criminal alphabet agencies in a well managed value producing government is like living with an STD without treatment.
It’s a major insult to the intelligence of a Free thinking egalitarian society trying to make it in a whack job control freak world.
If nothing else, This heroic Congressman’s Bill will serve more importance as a example of what will happen to other tyrannical agencies by being an immediate shake-up in favor of our precious eroding liberties by the hands of these ‘government’ agencies.
Lets all try to help out by donating and bugging our own legislators to go all out to support this bill. They work for us, remember? We just showed them that by electing Trump. I feel empathy for The Donald. For the most part he was a ‘victim’ of a control agenda like the rest of us. It’s going to be rough for him when he gets the ‘real’ inside shit on how corrupt these federal agencies really are?
I’m pretty sure this has a 0 percent chance of passing, but maybe it could effect some changes within the agency. Maybe restructuring, new leadership, and fix some existing problems.
If Trump is truly serious about cutting gov. waste and spending,I think it has a good chance of passing. If this guy is for real and I hope he is, then he is a God send. I am a small gov. guy and all of the unelected bureaucrats need to rapidly be reduced.There are way to many unnecessary,intrusive and un needed agencies in this country. This is BIG BROTHER, and was never intended for a proper democratic republic.
Abolish the ATF, but DO NOT transfer the authority to the FBI. Jeez. What are you thinking? Ruby Ridge anyone?
Dean,
Please keep in mind that the FBI did not get involved in either Ruby Ridge or Waco because of issues related to firearms. The FBI was drawn into both those as a consequence of the killings of members of other federal law enforcement (U.S. Marshal – Ruby Ridge & BATF agents – Waco) agencies. Though both situations were S— Sandwiches, the FBI had no choice but to get involved as the killing (murder) of federal employees does fall under the pervu of that agency. Also keep in mind the true decision makers in those situations. Ultimately, the decision is/was made by the Attorney General who unlike the Director of the FBI can be fired by their President.
NEVER HAPPEN. Big government never gets smaller. All those who would lose their job would also not let that happen. It’s not easy to fire a government employee on a regular day when they screw up bad, think you can get rid of a complete agency? NEVER HAPPEN.
Let’s not forget the ATF shootout debacle at the Branch Davidian compound in Waco too! What a jacked-up enforcement action, eh?
Yeah, all to steal their land when they ran away. Didn’t work tho. I’m soooooooo glad all those ranchers stuck together!! I’m soooooooo proud of them!!! Yaaaay, American spirit!!!!!
dont forget this was eric holders idea as well as outgoing Obama. the cost? one dead border patrol agent. but hey so what one more American is dead, right Hillary?
This has got to be a joke. In all my decades of living in the USA, I haver never seen common sense come out of Washington, D.C.
Besides the purpose of finding a way to suck the tax payers’ money for government power, The BATF was created to make and enforce laws out of thin air while bypassing congress. This is more of a time to act than ever for gun owners to go on the offensive and show our government where we stand on government over reach. I have been waiting for this bill for years and we need to stand together for once, write this down so your brain register’ s the importance of getting involved in this bill. Start talking about it and what you are going to do about it, such as calling senators, congressman and remind people in the military since most them realize what they fighting for. Gun sellers need to remind gun owners in their ads and stores to push it. Don’t forget about all of the harassment over just the last 8 years alone, this our time to strike, especially with this current administration.
It’s well past time to eliminate ALL of the INFRINGEMENT upon UNALIENABLE rights departments.
Great concept ! However, to include getting rid of ATF is dumb…. chance of it passing is 0% because let’s face it….. getting rid of a Governmental organization not going to,happen! Now, go piece meal…. take appproval of suppressor purchase away then go,after another of their functions….. before you know it you effectively have reduces them to nothing…… !
Dan, you can’t go ‘piecemeal’ with these people. They are already masters of the Administratively enforced incremental deprivation of your Constitutional rights and destruction of the 2nd/A. Going ‘piecemeal’ is a sign of weakness to them. Like gripping licking the ATF’s ass just to own a piece of fucking tubing to keep you from going deaf!
You have to take get them under control once and for all by diminishing their autonomous power and making them understand accountability to ‘We The People’ Hoover was the most despicable despotic felon to ever wear a badge. Not much has changed since. They only got better at cover ups.
Yep we only have a four year window.Maybe more, but don’t count your chickens….. too many commies in this country.
This same stupid idea crops up frequently, usually whenever a new Republican president gets elected or after another colossal screwup by ATF, the worst run agency in the world with the dumbest managers. As in 1981 after Reagan was inaugurated and ATF was practically abolished, cooler heads prevailed and the decision was rescinded. Those who had originally wanted ATF gone realized that they’d rather deal with a small, weak and poorly led agency than a big, powerful (and equally incompetent) behemoth like the FBI and its nightmarish bureaucracy. After building up and training the FBI and DEA to handle the additional duties, it wouldn’t save much in the long run anyway. Besides, the FBI has its own very significant history of grotesque screwups and failings that might even dwarf ATF’s (Ruby Ridge and the ensuing coverup, the siege at Waco, etc.)
So how come fwe havent got all the fast and furious especially that scumbag “Holder” in jail hes also an accessory to murder for his part at least. Maybe President trump will reopen the case along with crooked hilary ‘s case and get them all banged up together. We need to fund Guantanamo to keep those radical islamic terrorist in a secure jail off the mainland. Farewell Obama you screwed up our country long enough and now you will have to pay for your own hawaiian vacations yourself …good riddance
Add to that the fact that the ATF itself becomes a weapon with unlimited resources whenever a leftist administration takes over the WH. Same is true of the IRS.
Good idea.
Also need to do same with homeland security and transfer that back to FBI and what ever else depts handled it before 9-11
Great idea, but too many jobs would be lost. Economics are against it. If they just transfer personnel the problem still exists. Tough to put tooth paste back in the tube. However, did I say. GREAT IDEA?
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2016/01/20/rifle-capable-taking-down-helicopter-found-at-el-chapo-hideout-purchased-through-fast-and-furious-program.html?intcmp=hplnws
A .50-caliber rifle found at Joaquin \”El Chapo\” Guzman’s hideout in Mexico was funneled through the gun-smuggling investigation known as Fast and Furious, sources confirmed Tuesday to Fox News.
By Sharyl Attkisson CBS News December 7, 2011, 7:20 PM
Documents: ATF used \”Fast and Furious\” to make the case for gun regulations
Guns recovered by ATF Agents
CBS
Documents obtained by CBS News show that the Bureau of Alcohol Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (ATF) discussed using their covert operation \”Fast and Furious\” to argue for controversial new rules about gun sales.
PICTURES: ATF \”Gunwalking\” scandal timelineIn Fast and Furious, ATF secretly encouraged gun dealers to sell to suspected traffickers for Mexican drug cartels to go after the \”big fish.\” But ATF whistleblowers told CBS News and Congress it was a dangerous practice called \”gunwalking,\” and it put thousands of weapons on the street. Many were used in violent crimes in Mexico. Two were found at the murder scene of a U.S. Border Patrol agent.
ATF lawlessly seizes toy AirSoft Guns! (YOUTUBE MUST WATCH !)
FPS Russia (Kyle Myers) compound raided by 40+ FBI & ATF (FIND NOTHING) (YOUTUBE)
ATF raids gun store despite restraining order protecting customer list March 16, 2014 | Michael Dorstewitz |
ATF Raids US Marine\’s Business – Ares Armor Targeted For Legally Selling AR-15\’s
Mfg name & address + Over all length + Barrel length + model +serial number + $5 or $200 typed into a computer takes AFT
8+ months to do a FORM 4 ! Yet they have 70 agents to raid business WHERE they find NOTHING WRONG !
So you’d rather be at the mercy of an equally incompetent, much larger and bullyish FBI? Don’t be stupid. ATF is small and weak by comparison and they screw up enough it’s easy to keep them backpedaling.
Funny you must not be able to READ ! There is no need for ATF Form 5320.4 transfers to take 8 months to a year is there?
The same back ground check is used as when you buy any guns ( NIC) with the addition of getting your finder prints on file which takes less than a hour at most ! The Automated Fingerprint Identification System (AFIS), S.S. number, drivers license number , credit report all take less than 10 minutes to get ! Bet you are one of those dumbascraps who believe
a GUN FREE ZONE is GUN FREE !
D :Lewis, FBI needs to be cut to the bone also.
What a super idea. Less is always more with government agencies. There is absolutely no reason not to pass this bill!
There are very good reasons not to increase the size and power of the equally incompetent and corrupt FBI, which is also more oppressive. Don’t be so gullible as to think this would make government smaller. The resulting increases in size of the FBI and DEA will undoubtedly dwarf the current size of ATF. Government NEVER makes itself smaller. Never forget that.
Amen to that, D, Lewie
Exactly.
You ever try to get a tick off a dog’s butt? It’s not easy, and it doesn’t want to go. Parasites are like that.
Well put.
Yeah, this bill does nothing but propose to remove that tick (ATF) by making that dog’s already ginormous tapeworm (FBI) and fleas (DEA) even bigger to make up for it. This is SO stupid. That more-powerful tapeworm could end up killing the dog.
The only one stupid is you ! There is no need for all these different agency\’s WHO DON\’T SHARE INFO with the OTHER ONEs ! Who run around wild and do what they want , to whom ever they want !
Super G,who ever said, anything worthwhile would be easy. But with this window opportunity I would say with some work and petitioning our gov.(you know the constitution) It can be done.I know it is frustrating, we have all been Obamatized for so long.