{"id":154061,"date":"2021-11-05T02:57:00","date_gmt":"2021-11-05T06:57:00","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/www.gunsamerica.com\/digest\/?p=154061"},"modified":"2021-11-05T02:57:00","modified_gmt":"2023-09-07T21:49:33","slug":"how-bad-is-new-yorks-may-issue-licensing-scheme-ask-me-i-know-firsthand","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/gunsamerica.com\/digest\/how-bad-is-new-yorks-may-issue-licensing-scheme-ask-me-i-know-firsthand\/","title":{"rendered":"How Bad Is New York\u2019s May-Issue Licensing Scheme? Ask Me, I Know Firsthand! \u00a0"},"content":{"rendered":"\n\n\n\n\n\n\n

<\/p>\n\n\n\n

The Supreme Court heard oral arguments this week for New York State Rifle & Pistol Association v. Bruen<\/em>, a case examining whether New York\u2019s may-issue licensing scheme is constitutional.  <\/p>\n\n\n\n

The short answer is, no, it\u2019s not.  <\/p>\n\n\n\n

Several of the right-leaning justices on the high court alluded to this during the back-and-forth questioning with the bureaucrats charged with defending the standard that requires one to provide a \u201cproper cause\u201d to a local judge or CLEO before one is allowed to discreetly bear a handgun in public for self-defense.    <\/p>\n\n\n\n

“You can say that the right is limited in a particular way, just as First Amendment rights are limited, but the idea that you would need a license to exercise that right I think is unusual in the context of the Bill of Rights,” said Chief Justice John Roberts to acting U.S. Solicitor General Brian Fletcher, who backs the state\u2019s interest on behalf of the Biden Administration.  <\/p>\n\n\n\n

Justice Brett Kavanaugh was even more pointed in his critique, indicating to New York Solicitor General Barbara Underwood that the may-issue standard is problematic because it allows those in power to arbitrarily deny 2A rights to law-abiding citizens.  <\/p>\n\n\n\n

 “That’s the real concern, isn’t it, with any constitutional right?  If it’s the discretion of an individual officer, that seems inconsistent with an objective constitutional right,\u201d observed Kavanaugh.  <\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n

Kavanaugh made another excellent point about the lack of credible evidence that permissive concealed carry standards, like shall-issue or even constitutional carry, lead to spikes in crime.  <\/p>\n\n\n\n

“Before you impose more restrictions on individual citizens and infringe their constitutional right based on this theory, you should have to show, well, in those other states that have shall-issue regimes, actually there’s more accidents, crime,” he said.<\/p>\n\n\n\n

Given the makeup of the bench (6-3 right-leaning justices), in all likelihood, SCOTUS will strike down the \u201cproper cause\u201d requirement and New York, along with the other 8 or so states with a may-issue scheme, will be forced to switch to a shall-issue system whereby judges or CLEOs are compelled to issue a permit if the applicant meets objective requirements.  <\/p>\n\n\n\n

But the question remains, how hard is it to get a concealed carry permit in New York?<\/h2>\n\n\n\n

I finally got my pistol permit earlier this year.  It took me about 10 months from when I submitted the application to when I was finally issued my permit. <\/p>\n\n\n\n

However, all counties in New York are different.  Some of the more rural counties with pro-gun judges move a lot faster than the more populous counties with big cities.  And, some counties don\u2019t really issue them at all unless one is politically connected or a retired LEO, hence the lawsuit SCOTUS is debating right now.<\/p>\n\n\n\n

Filling out the application paperwork sucks.  In my county, not only do you need to provide a proper cause that is unique to your situation (you can\u2019t copy and paste a generic answer nor can you simply write \u201cbecause the 2A says I can\u201d) but you need to have four character references on your application.  The application must also be notarized and filled out in black ink only.  Blue ink, for whatever reason, is not acceptable. <\/p>\n\n\n\n

Some municipalities take it one step further in that they require all or some of your character references to be in the neighborhood that you reside.  This didn\u2019t affect me because my town didn\u2019t have that restriction.  But you can see how that would be problematic, especially for someone who is new to the area and doesn\u2019t know anyone yet.<\/p>\n\n\n\n

As part of the application packet, you need to prove that you successfully completed a state-approved concealed carry class.  Interestingly enough, there was no live-fire requirement.  My class was about $75 and lasted 4 hours.  It was mainly discussions about the law, the use of force, and best-concealed carry practices. <\/p>\n\n\n\n

One thing to note is that not all permits are equal.  New York offers conditional permits and unrestricted permits. Conditional, for example, would only allow one to carry in the context of hunting or while working a certain job whereas unrestricted allows one to carry 24\/7 in any place or setting where it\u2019s lawful.  I was lucky enough to get an unrestricted permit my first go-round, but I know friends who weren\u2019t so fortunate.  They were issued a conditional permit, and then had to take additional classes and resubmit paperwork to get an unrestricted one. <\/p>\n\n\n\n

Exclusive: Everytown Spent $200K on Losing Democrats Who Flipped Virginia House to Republicans<\/a><\/h2>\n\n\n\n

After you submit your application, you\u2019re interviewed by a local sheriff\u2019s deputy.  He writes up a report following the interview and submits it to a judge for approval. My interview was over the phone and he asked me about my familiarity with firearms, whether I had suicidal ideations, if I consumed alcohol to excess frequently, if I ever committed an act of domestic violence, if I had ever been arrested, among other questions.  <\/p>\n\n\n\n

Oh, and this is where it gets interesting.  When I was a bartender in college, I was cited for serving adults under 21.  I was 18 at the time.  In any event, I was given probation for six months and the incident was purportedly \u201cexpunged.\u201d  Except for that nothing is ever \u201cexpunged\u201d from police records.  So, as part of the application requirement, I had to travel to the town in which I was cited, go to the county clerk\u2019s office, and obtain a copy of the record showing that the charge was, indeed, dismissed following the probationary period. <\/p>\n\n\n\n

That incident happened more than 20 years ago!  Yet, it was still on the record.  Had I not provided the proof of dismissal I would have been denied a permit. <\/p>\n\n\n\n

It’s worth noting that in New York, you cannot even possess a handgun until you have a permit. Moreover, all handguns must be registered with the state. The details (make, type, caliber, serial number, model) of every handgun you own are listed on the back of your permit, and any time you purchase a new handgun you have to pay $5 to update your permit with the new information. Possession of an unregistered handgun is a crime, even if you have a pistol permit. <\/p>\n\n\n\n

Long story short, it’s a major pain in the butt. But that’s by design, of course. New York wants to make it as difficult as possible for responsible citizens to exercise a fundamental right. Let’s hope that the high court puts an end to this madness. A decision is expected sometime this coming Spring. <\/p>\n\n\n\n

***Buy and Sell on GunsAmerica!<\/a>***<\/h2>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"

I finally got my pistol permit earlier this year.\u00a0 It took me about 10 months from when I submitted the application to when I was finally issued my permit. <\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":34,"featured_media":154081,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"_specdata_upc":"","_specdata_placement":"","footnotes":""},"categories":[7,216],"tags":[132,586],"featured":[],"hunt365":[],"class_list":{"0":"post-154061","1":"post","2":"type-post","3":"status-publish","4":"format-standard","5":"has-post-thumbnail","7":"category-gunsamerica-authors","8":"category-s-h-blannelberry","9":"tag-buzz","10":"tag-column"},"yoast_head":"\nHow Bad Is New York\u2019s May-Issue Licensing Scheme? 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