The auction will be held on Nov. 8 at 10 a.m. (Photo: WPXI)
Pretty straightforward question, would you buy a firearm that was used in a suicide?
Before you answer that question, I bring this up because the local media is reporting that a western Pennsylvania coroner is actually auctioning off firearms that were used in suicides an accidental gun deaths.
Coroner Ken Bacha of Westmoreland County said that state law permits him to auction off firearms and personal items of the deceased if the family fails to pick them up within a year of their deaths.
The money raised by the auction is then funneled back into county coffers. The next auction is scheduled for Nov. 8 at 10 a.m. and will take place at the Westmoreland County Road Garage on Donahoe Road in Hempfield Township.
“Now as we are a week and a half away, we’re getting more phone calls, several today. I talked to the auctioneer earlier today, and he’s getting a lot of hits to his website and a lot of calls to his office as well,” Bacha told WTAE.
“I know when my dad had the auction in the 80s, there were guns that were valued at $100 brand new that were selling for $200,” he continued. “Was it just the novelty of it, that this gun took a life? I’m not really sure.”
Bacha said the firearms up for sale are linked to any homicides, as those are typically secured in evidence facilities for trials and appeals.
“Most of these firearms that are going to be auctioned are non-homicide firearms, meaning accidental deaths, but most of them are suicides,” Bacha said.
Bacha will be auctioning off around 100 firearms.
While many seem to be okay with the auction, at least one gun-control advocate believes it is highly insensitive.
“I think it’s profoundly sad that Pennsylvania officials would use weapons that human beings used to prematurely end their lives to line their pockets,” said Ladd Everitt from the Coalition to Stop Gun Violence.
“I think it also speaks to the fact that the general attitude of today’s pro-gun movement regarding suicide is, ‘Let them do it,’ as manifested in the NRA’s official position on this topic,” continued Everitt who pointed out this statement from an NRA fact sheet published on Nov. 6, 1999:
Some would suggest that the rate of suicide may indeed be higher among firearm owners than non-owners. Gun owners are notably self-reliant and exhibit a willingness to take definitive action when they believe it to be in their own self-interest. Such action may include ending their own life when the time is deemed appropriate.
“You have to imagine how a loved one of one of the deceased might feel after reading such words,” Everitt concluded.
What are your thoughts? And to ask the question once again, would you buy a firearm that was used in a suicide or an accidental gun death?
For a list of the firearms set to be auctioned off, click here.
YES, I want my gun back!
I am waiting to get my son’s Glock returned to me. He had schizophrenia and after being put on a new antidepressant he killed himself. He was a Marine. I will think of him every time I shoot the Glock but it is now my property and I want the local police to return it to me.
I don’t attribute any evil to the Glock as the doctors could not cure my son and his life was Hell. He would never complain to his doctor as his demons told him “bad things” would happen to him if he told anyone.
As long as the previous owner had committed suicide only once with it or didn’t harm anyone after his suicide…
I would want to buy it even more because of that. Might as well have a gun in your collection that actually did something,
Absolutely! If you are stupid enough to believe an inanimate object can possibly be guilty of Anything, you need to be institutionalized.
Ladd Everitt is a nitwit. The NRA statement says, “Some would suggest that the rate of suicide may indeed be higher among firearm owners than non-owners.” In other words, the NRA was citing what others say about firearms ownership and suicide, not what the NRA says about it.
I buy guns based on price and need, what someone else did with them is none of my concern.
With things like this popping up continually, I’m really surprised to gun control nazis haven’t lobbied their fellow socialists/commies in Congress to build a prison exclusively for those “bad guns” that have done harm to their makers – the humans.
These are inanimate objects. They haven’t a mind of their own. They’re harmless until in the hands of a human, exactly like a car, piece of pipe, ball bat, and many other things about one’s home or workplace.
To attempt to assign free will to an inanimate object is not considered a sane thing to do by any thinking person.
Why hold it against a perfectly good firearm that the last one to use it was a dope. May sound cold hearted but there aren’t to many things I can think of that warrant taking your own life that is a selfish and cowardly act and most problems that seem large enough to kill yourself over in 5 years would be absolutely meaningless so why harm those that care about you as well as yourself
I’m as old as dirt, have been associated with firearms for as long as I can remember; and to think that one putting a gun to their head and pulling the trigger is, well unimaginable. The destruction to tissue, bone, organs or grain is incredible. To call someone that musters up the courage in most situations to actually complete this act a coward is insensitive, irrational and just plain wrong headed thinking.
Jim, calling a person who committed suicide selfish and cowardly is just foolish and ignorant. You judge and label people who are dead, when you clearly know nothing about the subject.
I would not hesitate to purchase a bloodied firearm if I had a need for that specific firearm and the price was equal or cheaper then the “acceptable value”. Firearms are not good or evil, just tools used by people with different intentions. Firearms don’t carry Karma, Curses or poltergeist. If your putting pressure on the trigger and hear voices and its not your spotter or C&C; its time for some serious psychological intervention. Lol.
Would you refuse to shop at a building that was associated with a suicide? Would you refuse to ride a subway train that hit a person committing suicide?
Like said before it is not the gun! It was the person that used it like a tool! He or she could had used a rope or gas or jumped so it does not make it bad.
Yes, I’d buy a weapon used in a suicide or accidental death. I’m a Christian, not an animist, so I don’t believe that objects carry bad joss, bad juju, or bad karma. And I certainly would not suicide or kill another person in an unjustified manner with any firearm. So there’s no downside, apart from cleaning brain matter and other organics from the muzzle of a weapon, which I have no trouble doing and as a former biomedical equipment technologist am qualified to do.
I won’t blame the gun but I believe in ghost and karma. Person who committed suicide was tormented soul and he met his end violently so chance was great that his spirit and soul would be restless and attached to the gun. That gun sure might bring bad luck to new owner.
I have purchased a glock 19 from a person who’s brother had used to commit suicide. I am not a fan of 9MM’s so I used it as trading material for a more favorable firearm.
My dad bought a nice S&W model 15. A few months later, he shot my mom (without her knowledge or permission) and then himself. We got the gun back, sold it without comment and donated the money to House of Ruth, a local abused women’s shelter. I’m a gun guy myself and didn’t want to keep it but I wanted it to go to someone that wanted a nice revolver. I would (and have) bought a firearm used in a suicide. A gun is a tool, neither good nor evil.
Surely you have your sentence out of order. He shot her “without her permission”????
I would buy a lightly used and good condition firearm previously used for a suicide….but I likely would not buy a used fork that made someone FAT!
Depends on value, I’m not buying a $100 gun for $200 as quoted in the piece above.
Each persons value is different, mine is determined on condition, interest in the particular firearm and cost relative to new. Starlight specials are of no interest unless it’s an antique with something to make it interesting like some of the small vest pocket black powder pistols from the 19th century. Generally condition means safe to fire anytime with appropriate loads, needs no repair and aesthetically pleasing. Price would generally mean significantly below new retail if out of warranty and of no real collector value.
Looking over these comments, I see some very personal and impassioned stories. Stories of familial pain and loss that lead to opposite reactions. While I personally don’t know if I would buy a gun used in a suicide, I’d want it to be my choice and not a government entity’s. As long as the buying public is informed, I don’t see a problem with the practice.
It’s still better than raising taxes, right?
Unless it was my own family member involved as mentioned earlier, I would certainly buy a gun used in a suicide. if you are pro 2A how could you not.. GUNS DON’T KILL PEOPLE REMEMBER.
Being a collector I’ve always adhered to the old adage of: “Buy the gun – not the story”.
That being aid, having a C&R license has enabled me to buy many firearms that may or may not have been used to take someone’s life.
If someone chooses to use a sweet C96 or a K dated Luger to take himself out of this world and I have the opportunity later to take ownership of that gun – absolutely I would.
I don’t adhere to all this Karma BS many are positing. If that was the case you better only buy new stuff, and get rid (IE burn) anything handed down to you and stay out of antique stores because some of that stuff could have an evil nasty lurking in or around it – waiting to jump on your superstitious back.
David kept the sword that beheaded Goliath, and God never attributed any bad Karma to it: “Uh Dave buddy, you might want to get rid of that in case Goliath haunts the blade that wacked off his head.”
No – didn’t’ happen.
Buy the gun – not the story.
I would have no more concerns about buying a firearm used in suicide or homicide than I would have over buying a car that had been used in a suicide or homicide ! Its just a machine – a collection of plastic & metal parts. Neither the weapon or the vehicle caused any pain or harm of their own accord !
When people buy a used car – I can’t imagine any normal rational person suddenly backing out of the deal & deciding to buy ONLY NEW CARS – because a used car might have been responsible for the death of some innocent victim. Why should it be any different with a weapon.
I personally own some WWII era rifles, I’m reasonably sure that one or more these rifles is highly likely to have been used to take one of more human lives during its days of military duty. It certainly doesn’t keep me awake a night or compel me to sell off any of my retired from duty military arms.
Sure I would sounds like a faulty mind and the weapon seems to work find stop destroying guns and destroy stupid
Absolutely! No reason for them to just lie around when they could be rightfully utilized to defend a responsible citizen. But then again, I’m not a religious zealot, nor unreasonably superstitious.
I would NOT buy a gun used on suicide. That would totally creep me out!
I’m as big a gun fan as anybody, but I don’t need that in my house
As for a gun in an accidental shooting- I probably would not buy it, as it would be hard to tell if there was that rare defect in the firearm that contributed to the accident. For the others, I’d have no problem, esp. if the price were right. Though others might be creeped out so I wouldn’t tell them about it having killed someone.
Absolutely not! My brother took his own life with a hand gun, after he murdered two people with it. The police, knowing I was a legal firearm owner asked if I wanted the gun. I told them I wanted it destroyed! And definitely not put on public display. If anything, the family members should have the first right of refusal. IMHO only.
If the gun was used in the suicide of a close friend or relative I would probably get rid of it or not want it around unless it had some other significance (like once owned by my grandfather, or some historical figure). I just enjoy the collection too much to add a gun that makes me think about the tortured life and death of someone I cared about. On the other hand, if I was buying a gun and the seller told me it was inexpensive because some total stranger had killed himself with it, that info would not change the deal.
why not—at least you know it works ok
Buy? Would depend on what and how much, like any other gun. Have in the house? Yes… When my Dad passes, I’ll probably get the S&W my Mom used to kill herself. Just don’t tell my wife. She’d freak.
If someone else buys the weapon and ends their life as well, would the state be liable? Would it not be like buying a car from auction confiscated due to a crime, then it’s used in another crime? Aside from a moral aspect or superstion, are government actions in the end costing tax payers more money in law suites? Makes you wonder.
Second thought – My wife 1st carry weapon was used successfully by an Officer as his BUG to stop his attacker. My wife was happy the her revolver was proven to be deadly effective. When it broke after a few years the maker replaced it for free and she still feels safer carrying that type of weapon. Of course she hopes to never have to use it.
My Dad was murdered with his own gun I wanted it back but the cops wouldn’t let me have it. A lot of guns kill people look at all the surplus guns sold I’m sure many of those have blood on them. So yah sell them I’ll buy.
I have bought such a firearm from the widow of a friend who killed himself because they were having marital/returned veteran problems.
I wish I could tell him that I admired his taste in firearms, because it’s a nice looking handgun from a prestigious brand.
I bought it from his widow because she needed $ and didn’t need(want) the gun. I got an (ok) price that was below retail for a gun that I know can kill at point blank range…(bad joke?)
I miss the guy who killed himself, he wasn’t a bad guy. I still know his widow.
I don’t see what the “problem” is?
As a C&R collector and having many older guns that have seen combat its part of the ownership of guns, or taking care of it while we have it. What the previous owner did with it is of no concern of mine as long as legally i can perchase it, i wouldn’t buy it for that reason but because someone choose that gun to do what a gun is design to do i.e. Shoot a bullet?
I would buy a firearm used in a suicide. As a collector I have a lot military surplus rifles and pistols from the civil war to WW 2. I am sure many had been used to kill. The guns are just a tool .
I have not read all of the comments,but just in case,have we gun people forgoten “guns don`t kill, people kill peoplle!
After 22 years as a LEO and investigating numerous suicides and a recent one as of last week. I agree that purchasing a firearm used to take a life shouldn’t be viewed as a curse. It’s a tool. Buying firearms from the local government I feel is great public relations. Especially with the anti-gunners in the white house. Local government working with its citizens shows some trust the citizens can count on.
Very well put!
I 2nd that thought. Well said.
A gun is a gun is a gun…if that particular model/cal. fills a need or is something that interests you, then why not? And the money raised by auctioning off said firearm is NOT lining anyone’s pocket. It is going back into the coffers of the county coroner.
I’ve owned quite a few guns in the past. My father used a gun to end his life. I had shot my first squirrels and pheasants with it as a youngster. I didn’t choose to keep it and another family member has it. Would I knowingly buy a suicide weapon? No. That fact would bother me. However, that being said, I have no problem with others buying them, it’s just a little too close to home for me.
NO WAY…bad ju ju..karma..ect. Weird question but when I thought about it …I just thought no way. Weird because I’m always lookin for deals on guns.
I carry such a gun on a daily basis. If I was closer I would be interested in the Ruger Security Six and Colt Detective Special. As stated the families have abandoned the firearms.
Of course. Many of my weapons are of military origin. That they have been used in battle bothers me not at all. A firearm is merely a tool that can be used for good or evil. It has no will or sprit of it’s own.
I think Ladd Everitt is a gun hating, emotion driven idiot.
The firearms didn’t take these peoples’ lives, they did it themselves.
I don’t see him decrying the auctioning of automobiles that people have used to gas themselves, so his outrage is false too.
Would you turn down a brand new Corvette, that you could buy for $10,000 if you found out someone was killed inside it?
Why turn down a good deal just because a previous owner used it for more nefarious purposes? It doesn’t effect it usefulness. Life is far too expensive to get caught up on past uses of an item
We buy guns from ww1 & ww2. So you know what I am saying. Hey I would like a nice 30 carbine!
2 years ago my nephew committed suicide with a NEF Handi Rifle in 243 Win . After the police give the gun back to the family many month later his father asked me to clean it and make sure there was no blood on it.
It was a strange feeling handling a gun that I knew had been used in such a manner but not to the point that it really bothered me.
When I returned the rifle I asked what his plans were for it and he said that he wanted it kept in the family but not under his roof because he new every time he looked at it, it would remind him of his son and the loss.
He asked if I wanted it and I told him I would take but I could not guarantee I would keep it because I demand top notch accuracy from my guns and any that don’t cut it get sold or traded and that I doubt a low budget rifle like the NEF would be very accurate.
I did take the rifle back home and keep it for a few weeks until he found a family member that said they would keep it forever.
So yes I would buy a gun that was used in a suicide.
But I’m not sure I would want to keep one if it was used by one of my children or a grand child to comment suicide .
In looking over the guns and cars for sale , I for one didn’t see anything worth getting out of bed for ! ! ! ! ! AM I MISSING SOMETHING ?????????????????????????
Why ? at least you know it works.
If the emotional family member(s) believed that the gun used in the suicide of their relative should be destroyed, they could have claimed the gun from the coroner’s office and kept it from the public domain. Having failed to do so, they have no standing to complain.
A firearm is a tool. Nothing more, nothing less. One that was used in a suicide bears no more responsibility than one that was used to pop a hole in a paper target. That being said, sometimes a suicide weapon will become etched and discolored from having assorted bodily fluids on them causing an almost “Damascus” like appearance. If this bothers you, don’t purchase the firearm. If it doesn’t, buy it, carry it, and may it help keep you safe. The deceased has other matters to deal with in the next life and their respective families and friends also have their hands full dealing with the loss. IF you make such a purchase be sensitive and respectful to the feelings and needs of the surviving friends/family and stay out of their way.
First off, in the most basic sense, guns are just tools. Was that chain saw that was bought at a flea market used to kill someone? How about that hammer? If the tool fits your need at a price you feel reasonable then yes, buy the darn thing. Next is the auction comment … I attend several a year and at each one I see all type of items going for more than they are worth, I think people get caught up in the “moment” and just go until they either snap out of it and quit bidding; have no more money to continue bidding, or they “win” it.
Back to the original question. If I had a use for a specific firearm and the price/bid was within the limits I had set then yes, I would buy it … I don’t care about past use, I care about the present.
I feel strongly about two things here. First, who would cry if the gun control freak bought one and used it in the same manner? Not I. Second, if the guns bring higher prices than they sell for in stores, the buyers going for the morbidity factor are _sick_ and need help. I see no reason not to allow their sale, though. It would be a shame to destroy perfectly good firearms over emotional factors.
Back in the mid 70’s I was appointed as a deputy sheriff for a job that included serving papers, collecting bad checks and so forth. As this was my first law enforcement related job I couldn’t afford a firearm so the sheriff allowed me to purchase a plus 30 year old Colt revolver from the department for $35.00 instead of it being destroyed. The gun had been used in a suicide.
Instead of being freaked out about it I developed tremendous respect for it as someone had made a difficult decision to use it. I carried that firearm for ten years and eventually purchased a new revolver and sold the Colt. I wish I had kept it.
The relatives feeling should only come in play IF one of them is buying the gun. If the price is right, I would not mind where it came from !!!
According to the coroner, these are firearms that have not been picked up by relatives after a year. Apparently the relatves don’t seem to care.
A few years ago I stumbled upon a like new Ruger Blackhawk .357 in a local dealer’s showcase at a very nice price. He didn’t know the story behind it, but from the single burn mark on the front of the cylinder it was obviously fired only once. I’ll never know where that sole bullet went, but it’s intriguing to speculate. Suicide? One shot just to see if it works, then into the bedroom drawer? Or maybe one round of magnum (w/o earmuffs?) and no more for me? Makes a cool conversation piece anyway.
You can’t look it this way. Suicide? Some states have a policy that the fire arm has to be fired at least once to where the empty case is filed with the police department.
“’You have to imagine how a loved one of one of the deceased might feel after reading such words,’ Everitt concluded.”
No. No, I don’t, nor does any organ of government. If there is no reason to prevent these guns from being sold and a reasonable motive for doing it, then the feelings of the deceased’s family are of almost no importance to the decision. I’m sure I might have strong feelings against such a sale if I were a family member of the deceased, but I can objectively say that an emotionally agitated person should not be put in a position to make policy.
Well said, Dr. I would like to add that we, as human beings, like to assign meaning to objects, where there is no actual inherent meaning. It is just in our makeup. Therefore, there will certainly be some social cost associated with purchasing such a firearm given that most people actually can’t make the distinction. And, I would agree that those feelings and “agitated” biologies certainly have no place is making policy. Unfortunately, this is no different than the opportunistic, vacuous windbags in our government that pass laws NOT based upon objective, rational thought, but on the backs of the fear and emotion of the populace.
Why blame the gun? It shouldn’t matter, either sell it or have them destroyed, so why not let them go and help the state. It’s funny how people see things. If you go to a gun store and purchase a relic WWII rifle do you ask how many people it killed? You have passion that’s all it. I would hate to see these guns get destroyed
People are so superstitious.
It wasn’t the gun that did it, it was the finger on the trigger. If they are cheap enough I will buy every one.
Absolutely ! imagine how much the Tommy Gun is worth used in the Valentines day Masscre? BOOKOO BUCKS
Absolutely ! Imagine how much the Tommy Gun is worth used in the Valentines day Massacre? BOOKOO BUCKS
No I would not buy also passed up on a good real estate deal because suicide committed in house. Don’t believe in much but i believe in Karma!
My son was an avid shooter throughout his life. I began teaching him to shoot at about age 5 and it was one of the activities that we enjoyed together. He was a Paramedic. Overwhelmed in the end by PTSD, he chose to exit this life via his Glock (.45 ACP) in the summer of 2012 at age 33. Following the attendant legal investigations (autopsy, police reports, etc.), the police returned the firearm to me.
As you can imagine, that pistol carried significant baggage for me. I debated what to do with it – a perfectly new pistol with all its accessories – a couple of spent shell casings with flecks of blood – and, finally decided that it all should be buried at sea. Consequently, I deposited everything at the bottom of Puget Sound during a ferry crossing.
One can drag out the canard of “superstition” – sneer at people who profess belief in anything beyond this plane of existence – but, IMO, it is simply bad karma to sell such a weapon – or, even use it or give it away, for that matter.
That all having been said, this is an individual choice and it should be left to surviving family members to decide. If none exist, then I think that such firearms should be destroyed by the coroner’s office and not profited from. Period.
Robert,
I am so sorry to read of the loss of your Paramedic son. I too am a firefighter in the NW, and a father of two sons; PTSD is such a terribly destructive thing. I can only imagine the pain of losing your boy. My heart truly goes out to you and your family for your loss. May God bless you.
My brother took his life 9/6/15 and were going to have a ( 45 cal judge) melting party
I have bought a pistol that was used in a suicide. Didn’t think anything of it and it helped the family deal with a problem that was causing stress. The real question, since guns change owners so often, is whether you would buy a gun that you knew was used in a suicide. If you’re that superstitious I guess there are no military surplus rifles in your gun safe.
Sure, It’s a working firearm.
People who attach morality to inantate objects make me nervous!!
Is the gasoline used by a hit & run driver guilty of a crime? Should we sue Exxon for producing it!’ Give me a break!!
The guns should be sold but the money should go to suicide prevention and awareness, not to the pocket of the coroner.