The SSAR-15 MOD from Slide Fire Solutions, the inventor of the bump stocks. (Photo:Slide Fire)
Responding to political and public outcry following the Las Vegas concert shooting, the ATF may redefine bump stocks as machine guns. The agency is asking for public feedback before making any changes to their regulations.
After the shooting earlier this year even pro-gun groups like the NRA wanted the ATF to establish bump stock guidelines. Currently there are no regulations on bump-fire devices.
Bump-firing is a shooting technique that has been around for decades. Bump firing uses the recoil from shooting to rock a gun back and forth which allows the user to pull the trigger quickly. Bump-fire devices make it easier to do this without much practice.
The reason these devices aren’t regulated is that they comply with all current definitions of semi-automatic fire. Guns outfitted with bump-fire devices still only fire once for each pull of the trigger.
“The NFA defines ‘machine gun’ as any weapon which ‘Shoots, is designed to shoot or can be readily restored to shoot automatically more than one shot, without manual reloading, by a single function of the trigger,'” explains the agency.
“The term [machine gun] also includes ‘the frame or receiver of any such weapon, any part designed and intended solely and exclusively, or combination of parts designed and intended, for use in converting a weapon into a machine gun, and any combination of parts from which a machine gun can be assembled if such parts are in the possession or under the control of a person.’
The ATF would like to know not only if they should control these devices like machine guns, but also how they could.
“The Department of Justice anticipates issuing a Notice of Proposed Rule-making (NPRM) that would interpret the statutory definition of ‘machine gun’ … to clarify whether certain devices, commonly known as ‘bump fire’ stocks, fall within that definition,” said the ATF in the Federal Register (.pdf). “Before doing so, the Department and ATF need to gather information and comments from the public and industry regarding the nature and scope of the market for these devices.”
“The NPRM is intended as an initial step in a regulatory process to gather information regarding the scope and nature of the market for these devices,” said the NSSF in a statement. “While this step is not proposing a change to current regulations, ATF notes, ‘If, in a subsequent rule-making, the definition of machine gun … is interpreted to include certain bump stock devices, ATF would then have a basis to re-examine its prior classification and rulings.”
The NSSF is asking for all of its members to give feedback on the proposal. They will compile all the comments they receive from members to use in their industry comment letter. For contact info visit the NSSF website.
See Also: Massachussetts First to Ban Bump Stocks
While the ATF may choose to arbitrarily classify bump-fire devices as machine guns, coming up with a clear definition of what a bump-fire device is will be much more difficult. Proposed legislation to regulate bump-fire devices could be used to ban nearly completely unrelated gun parts.
There are millions of bump-fire devices in use today. They vary from high-quality factory-made bump stocks to simple rubber band rigs.
It would be impossible to regulate all the devices already on the market. And of course, with practice a shooter can learn to bump-fire without any devices at all.
List Bump Stocks in class 2 weapon category where a person must meet guidelines for ownership of firearms/devices of that nature.
Choice then becomes the owner/buyers responsibility to comply.
OKAY, this comment removes the language for moderator.
This is ignorant. The one has nothing to do with the other. We need people control, not gun control. Whatever happened to the armed citizenry taking care of their own community, like the days prior to the 20th Century when the era of law enforcement took over. Really, we don’t need this type of gun control. It’s not the gun; we all know that. And we don’t need to redefine the technical definition of automatic fire. A bump stock is not automatic fire; it is repeated semi-automatic fire. If we regulate this, then we may as well kiss all semi-automatic fire goodbye. What needs to happen here, is that this person be found guilty and be HUNG by the NECK until DEAD in the PUBLIC Square. And the body should be left there, exposed, affording sufficient time for the CROWS, BUZZARDS, FLIES, Public, and any other creature to reduce him to nothingness. Now that is just for this case, and it can certainly be applied to others in the future, but something like this is really needed to get the appropriate response from those who have GLAMORIZED killing. And we know who that is — Hollywood; the very same liberals who made it illegal to identify and label these sort of mentally unstable people… because it wouldn’t fair, sniffle sniffle.
We need to ROLLBACK the moratorium on identifying these “mentally challenged” knuckle-heads, so that they can be barred from ever legally owning a firearm. Now recall, it’s the very same liberals in our society who imposed regulations barring the rest of us from “stigmatizing” these unstable people. Well, the evidence of over 60 years indicates the liberal hiding of these people has not worked out at all! We need them unmasked and appropriately labelled, period.
Now, all this is certainly extreme, but look, there are times that extreme measures are warranted? And if not this, then when will killing be DE-GLAMORIZED?
This is ignorant. The one has nothing to do with the other. We need people control, not gun control. To start, whatever happened to the armed citizenry taking care of their own community like the days prior to the 20th Century when the era of law enforcement took over. Really, we don’t need this type of gun control. What needs to happen is that this idiot be found guilty and then he be HUNG by the NECK until DEAD in the PUBLIC Square, and be left there for at least one week, affording sufficient time for the CROWS, BUZZARDS, FLIES, and any other creature to reduce his stupid ass to nothingness. And to hell with anyone trying to interfere with that. He should be left there for all to see for as long as it takes for people to understand that our society will not tolerate this shit under any circumstance.
That would get an appropriate response from those who have GLAMORIZED Killing of Innocents by illegally shooting others.
I for one will drop my NRA membership if they back this! It is my right to own this and even a full auto if I choose. If you morons can read: machine guns were legal and part of the 2nd ammendment protection up until the 1930’s when pussies caved in and made them another class. Dont let them take one more inch or it will never stop!
Those who think they can speak their minds without a 2nd amendment to protect freedom are mistaken! George Washington used force to win America’s freedom from the British, not speech! Last and not least, “When guns are outlawed, I will be an outlaw!” We must fight tyranny with words now, to prevent having to fight it with lead later! Venezuela waited and look what they got!
As in all laws, only the law abiding citizens follow them willfully or grudgingly. The people with criminal intent never follow such trivial laws. And so once again our rights as defined in the constitution do not exist in practice. The 2 nd Amendment is as short and clear as any US law. Yet it does not exist in practice.
Bump stocks are not the problem. The problem is the human equation. You can load a gun put a crazy person behind and now you got news. Ban the reporters that are making these people famous. As i see it the news is pushing unstable people to out do the next crazy person. Put a ban on bump stocks that have NO mechanical function. Hell my thumb in the pocket trick works just as good. NOW I HAVE TO REGESTER MY THUMB AND PANTS POCKET., rubber bands, 2 stage triggers. Whats next??? A fart in the wind.
No matter what the government does if they band your rights to bare arms, there is always a way to get what you WANT, Why is America aways trying to take away are rights, This is apart of our freedom. Hitler did the same thing buy taking your guns you give up your guns I will protect you!!!! Why can’t the government stop TERRORIST from getting them. I have lost all faith in Federal Government because they are not doing there job.
BAN HIGH SPEED TRIGGER FINGERS ! What’s next triggers ? WHERE WILL ANTI GUN GRABBERS STOP !
KEEP COMPROMISING TILL THERE IS NOTHING LEFT TO COMPROMISE ! NEXT THEY WILL BAN SINGLE SHOT SHOTGUNS THAT SHOOT 12 pellets at a TIME !
“It would be impossible to regulate all the devices already on the market. And of course, with practice a shooter can learn to bump-fire WITHOUT ANY DEVICES AT ALL!”——SO BOYS AND GIRLS AND THE STUPID?? IGNORANT?? NRA FOR EVEN ALLOWING “THEM” TO ENTERTAIN THE THOUGHT——-IF WE EXTROPOLATE THAT STATEMENT OUT TO IT’S OBVIOUS CONCLUSION—WE COME UP AGAINST THE “WALL” OF——if ANY Semi-Auto can be MADE TO BUMP WITH or WITHOUT a “SPECIAL DEVICE” then WHAT EXACTLY makes you think the whole PURPOSE of THAT PARTICULAR “FALSE FLAG” Operation was NOT the BANNING of ALL WEAPONS THAT ARE CAPABLE OF BEING BUMPED???? ATF—-LAY OFF!!! YOU’VE DONE ENOUGH DAMAGE TO THE 2nd ALREADY!!!
Ban the bumpstock outright
The most important part of this article, so I’ll mention it first:
“While the ATF may choose to arbitrarily classify bump-fire devices as machine guns, coming up with a clear definition of what a bump-fire device is will be much more difficult. Proposed legislation to regulate bump-fire devices could be used to ban nearly completely unrelated gun parts.”
That said, bump stocks are a deliberate end-tun around Federal laws restricting access to machine guns by those who are not using them on government business. The carnage at Las Vegas shows why those laws continue on our law books.
The pro-gun community has a chance to be responsible citizens and advise BATFE that we don’t really have a compelling sporting reason to own bump stocks. How we speak out on this issue will determine how the rest of the nation listens to us when we speak out of removing sound suppressors from NFA, repeal of the Hughes Amendment and other worthy causes.
That doesn’t mean we can’t draw a bright line around the Second Amendment in every other way – but we’ve seen why bump stocks aren’t a good idea for citizens who haven’t been screened to minimize the chance of another mass shooter. Legal machine gun owners are among the very most law-abiding group of people in America – it won’t hurt a thing to make people who want to own bump stocks undergo the same checks imposed on those who own machine guns legally.
“loupgarous”
You sir, are ignorant of why the 2A even exists. Many gun owners like me are of the opinion that it’s no business of the government to tell us what we can and can’t put on our guns. The 2A was written and interpreted by SCOTUS to mean that free & peaceable citizens can arm themselves, just as the feds and police do. You are either a plant from the gun-hater’s side pretending to be a “sensible gun-owner”, or you are truly misguided and helping score points for the other team. Either way, please put a sock in your pie hole and log off.
Walleye is right, a policy of allowing BATFE to say “we’ll just ban THIS (for now) but we won’t ban THAT (until next time)” is giving away our rights an inch at a time – until we have No rights left. If you don’t like bump-fire stocks then don’t buy one.
“The NSSF is asking for all of its members to give feedback on the proposal. They will compile all the comments they receive from members to use in their industry comment letter. For contact info visit the NSSF website.”
I went to the NSSF website, there is NOTHING about bump-fire stock legislation, ect. Nothing at all… these organizations do that **** on purpose, they don’t want to hear input from the American people. You can’t be too careful these days, anti-gunners are within our own “ranks” and we choose to ignore it in favor of ONLY attacking the “other side” (left wingers). We need to expose EVERYONE with these gun control ideas, not just go after the people on the left. Political loyalty is only going to hurt us in the end. Stop politicizing the issue of gun control and take down/ expose ANYONE associated with it, even those on the right wing! Molon labe. The right of the *PEOPLE* to keep and bear Arms, SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED.
While I’d like to say DUMP THEM, they are already here and are fairly popular and somewhat easy to build or copy. So let’s deal with it. If full auto still needs to be regulated, then regulate these too. Good luck on getting them all registered. I’m trying to show both sides here, so before you fellow gunslingers get your camo skivvies in a wad (or vise versa) don’t lose your grip on the subject.
I am a life member of nra and I don’t own a bump stock. But one of these days I might want one or something like it.
It looks like it has no practical application for hunting or precision shooting.
BUT I DON’T WANT IT BANNED by some knee-jerk reactionary anti 2A anti gunner or liberal in the event
that some legal shooter wants one
The “Bump Stock” device is an intentional “work around” to produce “rapid like” fire and should be regulated.
Yea, it’s fun to shoot full auto but expensive.
This device can be used only for spraying rounds with no accuracy.
Were it not for the Hughes Amendment, I doubt that they would even exist. Repeal the Hughes Amendment, and they will likely, mostly, go away on their own.
Until then, and until the law is changed, they are simply an accessory, and should not be regulated.
Bear in mind that they have been around for a few years now, with an untold number of them in circulation. A single incident where someone used one in an illegal act, as atrocious as it was, and they should be banned? It’s a good thing that we don’t treat everything that way. We wouldn’t have knives, baseball bats, cars, alcohol, bows and arrows, hammers, screwdrivers, guns of any kind, fireplace pokers, candlesticks, pillows, rope, gasoline, pools, bathtubs, hairdryers, pencils, pens, the list could go on forever.
Absolutely 100% correct. Once these are regulated all other accessories are open for regulation. Enough is ENOUGH!
With practice time equal to the installation time of one of these devices, the same outcome can be accomplished by placing your thumb through a belt loop on your pants. (And it works on ANY semi-auto, not just what the bumpstock product is made for) Following your logic, should belt loops or thumbs be banned next?
Maybe all index fingers should be amputated? This is the type of lunacy that’s so prevalent in the anti2nd mentality today!
Never owned one.. Would not likely own one.. Can think of better ways to waste ammo and money. Of course there is the old attitude adjustment thing. You say I can’t, I say I can. Haven’t fallen for that yet none the less. Guess with age comes wisdom. Thought it to be passe’, wisdom. Bump-firing and or bumpfire stock is a novelty.. Not that far off from a coiled spring snake in a can, or x-ray vision glasses. It is neither machine gun nor a gun. It is for certain, more junk for the junk drawer. Reclassify as ATF/NRA as remedial.
I don’t own a bump stock. Thought about it several times but decided that I would rather send bullets down range with more accuracy than just “spraying”. Having said that, I do not want to see these non-lethal items banned. Once they successfully ban these, they will be back for items like drop in triggers, laser sights, 30 round magazines and the list goes on and on and on. Once again, it is not the particular item in question that is at fault here. It is the person who chooses to use this item to commit an illegal act such as the shooting in Las Vegas a few weeks or months ago.
PS. I am a Life, Patron & an Endowment Member of the NRA but I am in disagreement with their stance on this issue for the reasons listed above.
If you can’t print my comments as I wrote them, that’s fine but if that is the case, please take my name off your email list.
Get rid of the damn things ..No reason to have xcept to cause trouble or waste ammo….I’m a long time NRA member …
No you are not.
If anything, you’re a plant from HCI or the Brady Campaign.
Reading through many response’s is pretty much dead-on! There is nothing you can do with a bump/ slide fire stock that you cannot do without them…. <– Period(s)
The ATF has it right and they know these stocks do not modify a semi-auto rifle into a fully automatic "machine gun" or anything of the like.
One psychotic idiot does something really stupid and the blame is on the equipment??
CHECK THIS OUT:
Of the 169,395 firearm deaths in the US from 2011 to 2015 (the most recent five years of data available),
105,183 (or 62% percent – 21,037 per year avg./ 58 deaths per day avg.) were caused by "SUICIDES".
64,212 (or 12,842 per year avg./ 35 deaths per day avg.) were caused by HOMICIDES.
VERSES
AUTO DEATH STATISTICS: Nearly 1.3 MILLION people die in road crashes each year,
ON AVERAGE "3,287" DEATHS PER DAY VERSES "58" PER DAY BY GUN HOMICIDE
BUT THAT'S OK BECAUSE WHY???? Mainstream Media doesn't report on Suicides vs Homicides. The Media knows that they can go to jail for vehicular manslaughter right?? Ever heard anyone wanting to Ban "Pushbars" because of the death rate from driving?
All of these comments! Don’t put them here send them to the ATF via the link in the article – if you haven’t already.
Nothing here will make any difference at all!
What’s next the scope? We can’t let the NRA use theirs excuse to throw meat to the wolves. Next time who knows, maybe a trigger assembly? No..
After each Shooting Hoax another aspect of of our Natural Right of Arms is encroached upon by Federal & State Laws. One False Shooting brought Waiting Periods, another a Limit on How Many How Often are Purchased, another so called Gun Show Loophole, another High Capacity Magazines, and another trigger Locks, Cases, Empty of Ammo, Mental Issues, Magazine Ejector Buttons with a Tool, Gun Free Zones, ect. ect. ect. And now useless Bump Stock which are only fun the first day and useless for any and all Offense or Defense situations. Don’t believe the lies of Vegas, Orlando, Dallas, Charlottesville, LAX, Boston, Aurora, Newtown, Watertown, ect.
A MACHINE GUN CONSISTS OF A BARREL, ACTION, TRIGGER ASSEMBLY, FIRING PIN, STOCK AND WHEN THE TRIGGER IS DEPRESSED AND HELD BACK FIRES MORE THAN ONE ROUND, AND WILL CONTINUE TO DO SO UNTIL THE GUN JAMS OR ALL AMMO IS EXHAUSTED. A BUMP STOCK IS A STOCK. IT IS NOT A MACHINE GUN. THE FOCUS SHOULD BE ON CATCHING AND PUNISHING CRIMINALS AND NOT PERSECUTING INNOCENT AMERICANS! THE SECOND AMENDMENT PROHIBITS THE GOVT IN ANY WAY, SHAPE, OR FORM IMAGINABLE FROM PREVENTING AMERICAN CITIZENS FROM OWNING, POSSESSING, CARRYING AND USING FIREARMS FOR ANY AND ALL PURPOSES!
FOCUS ON PROSECUTING CRIMINALS THAT USE WEAPONS IN THE COMMISSION OF A CRIME! LEAVE INNOCENT AMERICANS ALONE! THE VEGAS SHOOTING WAS A FAILURE OF POLICE TO PREVENT A NEW MUSLIM FROM COMMITTING JIHAD.
you are a 1000% RIGHT.
and all ANTI-GUN POLITICIANS NEED ARRESTED FOR VIOLATING THEIR SWORN OATHS TO DEFEND AND PROTECT THE CONSTITUTION.
Need arrested? Omitting the infinitive “to be” makes you sound like an illiterate moron who owns a bump stock.
First of all, bump stocks, for the most part, are a toy. In my experienced opinion, it does not allow a shooter to fire an AR-15 with any kind of accuracy. An experienced shooter can masters a quick trigger finger and have more hits without a bump stock. I agree that they can allow a gun to shoot slightly faster but, there is a lot less accuracy. ARs and AKs are not known for their accuracy when fired in the fully automatic mode in the first place, when fired in the conventional way, let alone when using a bump stock or even a trigger crank. I feel that the Las Vegas concert attendees were very lucky because many lives were saved and many people were NOT wounded because the shooter decided to use a bump stock. If he would have had his weapons mad to fire full-auto there would have been many more killed and/or wounded. Any combat infantryman can attest to that.
Excellent response. Jerry Micelle(sp) can shoot a six round S&W revolver, reload and shoot six more rounds in 2.9 seconds.
Do we now register Jerry as a machine gun??
The current definition is adequate. JUST SAY “NO”.
I’ve wanted a bump stock since the first time I ever saw one.
I don’t want them banned or any other knee-jerk reaction prompted by a criminal or a liberal
who happens to be anti 2A
Once again the person is the one pulling the trigger if they want to kill somebody they will do it with a car a hammer a ball bat or whatever they have. Really!!! Are we going to outlaw every piece of material laying around us. Good luck with that liberal law!
Who cares?! Except for the continuing government reach, the Slide Fire Stock is a joke. I bought one when I was told emphatically that it would work w/ a .22. It doesn’t. My limited experience shows me I can fire faster and more accurately using a semi auto, as designed, than w/ the bump stock.
Whenever anyone proposes a law the cost of enforcing it and the effect enforcement has on individual freedom has to be considered. There are many sophisticated military weapons that 2A or no 2A the population does not want in civilian hands.
What makes the “bump stock” a debatable area is the ease with which one could come up with one. This means someone with relatively minor resources and the will could build something that had a similar effect. In that case, how do you enforce a ban without turning our nation into a police state? The efforts to enforce a ban will fall upon law abiding people who will be harassed to the ends of the earth, while the usual crowd of gangsters ignore a regulation if they think the equipment gives them an edge.
As far as the Las Vegas shooting goes, the bump-fire stock saved hundreds of lives. Paddock was shooting at a massed crowd at 1,200 feet with an AR-15 with a bump-fire stock. If he was aimed properly to have shots hit the crowd mass, his first shot likely hit someone. All remaining shots in the burst went over the top of the crowd. Hand held machine guns ride up after the first shot and effectively become, “anti aircraft guns.” I have fired many M-16’s on full auto and AR-15’s with bump-fire stocks. They ride up considerably after the first shot. Paddock killed 58 people with 1,200 shots fired. If he would have just been firing a properly zeroed AR-15 he would have had a hit probability of at least 50% with his 1,200 rounds. He would likely have killed ten times the number of people in 10 minutes of accurate shooting.
Slidefire stocks have nearley zero barrel rise due to the 1/2inch motion they use which destroys recoil as well as barrel rise.watch their video including the belt fed 308 cal showing zero rise.once one is used to the push concept it will dump 700 rounds per minute into a target the size of a tv set.Having used these extensively I nelieve unknowleged users misjudge the accuracy of these units.
I’m a retired Marine. I have owned and fired an AR bump stock. They are fun but they don’t fire near the cyclic rate of a m-16/m-4/any full auto AR. They are a high end fun accessory. That said, if we let the bastards take this “SMALL” step, what will they want next, slings? target sights? or any other thing that some NUT CASE would find even if it were banned. Also, I don’t see cars or trucks being considered for regulation as a tool for this type if incident!!!!!!!!!
There are numerous shooters that have the ability to fire weapons at the same speed as these stocks using their finger alone….maybe we should ban the finger????
Bump stock suck and are really b.s. BUT, banning them is pointless.Laws don’t prevent crime they make punishment legal.
NFA weapons are all criminal until big brother gets his $200 then they are a ok. It is b.s. to ban stuff. How about a waiting period and 10 oz capacity limit on pressure cookers? Maybe a $200 tax on automatic transmissions,and no more than 10 gallon gas tank in automobiles(they kill more people every year) If laws prevented crime we wouldn’t be having this discusion .
Murder has been illegal in most states for years now.I say we should ban banning things,that would fix it.
This is about opinions, so here’s mine. The weapons most of us have access to are very capable. Although I recognize the need to fight for our rights, there will always be limits. That’s a fact. I believe, considering the onslaught from the left, our 2A representatives both in government and in our various associations (like the NRA) have done a pretty good job of retaining our rights. Regulating full auto firearms, while not completely effective, is a pretty good place to draw a line. I’ve never met anyone who was really concerned about not being able to own a full auto firearm for a reasonable price. I was really surprised the first time I saw a bump stock. Not shocked, but it really doesn’t make sense. If you’re going to have a rule, have a rule. No bump stocks. They’re not needed. I assume the regulators had to make a decision on these devices and decided to err on the side of not creating a new rule. That’s commendable, but now they’ll probably have to go back and readdress the issue. They’ve got a tuff job, and I hope they can come up with language that makes sense and doesn’t screw things up too much. I’ll still be able to own high powered battle rifles that will fire as fast as I can pull the trigger, and that’s really fast. I can also conceal a firearm and 45 rounds of ammo. I’m not crying over a bump stock. And don’t tell me about the slippery slope. As long as they don’t go any farther than regulating bump stocks, the slope is nowhere in sight.
Slippery slope is in plain sight. You conceded that when you said that you hope they would come up with language that doesn’t screw things up to much. If bumps then why not high grade triggers?
But you can bump with just a belt loop and regular trigger? Hmm, guess we have to do semi autos too. Would be very hard to ban belt loops and fingers…
And the real culprit is “high capacity mags'” if not for those, bump stocks, triggers, technique, etc. wouldn’t be a problem.
Government in action is by nature a slippery slope.
Which “bump stock method” would you like to regulate? Finger trigger pull, rubber bands and thousands of other ways to fire a single pull trigger faster! So, using this idea, if the company that makes “bump stocks” changes the name to something else, that would be okay and they can keep selling them? SOLUTION: PASS THE LAW AGAINST THE CRIMINAL.. Stop turning legal, law abiding citizens into criminals with all these stupid “regulations in the supposed name of “safety”..
This is just crazy. ATF prepares a statement that they are completely fine, a copy of this letter was provided with each stock sold. Now their on the fence, and worse yet the NRA abandons all bump stock owners. If ATF changes its position they should have to buy back all stocks sold; otherwise bump stock owners will end up with $ 300.00 paperweights.
I’ll put it bluntly. I don’t own one, never did own one, and probably never will. I’ve been around guns since I was 12 and have been around everything from flintlock to full auto. I do not see bump stocks as being particularly practical, at semi-auto rates it seems to me, anyway, that the weapon would likely become highly inaccurate after the first shot or two, and more likely would be prone to jamming later. Even an experienced semi-auto operator, familiar with the particular firearm, would probably be able to cycle more rounds than using a bump stock.
What happened in Las Vegas is hard to know because the evidence has never been published and released other than a few photos. If someone has the forensic reports on the guns that were fired, including firing rate, etc., maybe I could blame the bump stocks, maybe not.
In either event I don’t see a need for them, though they are a luxury item to attach to an AR or some other semi-auto weapon just seems to be a waste of good ammunition.
Nobody I know or have known, operating in the field, would use full auto unless they’re in a firefight for their lives. Most weapons are set for 2 and 3 round bursts if they’re equipped that way or selective fire from semi-auto, to burst to full auto or just semi to full. I remember testing an Uzi out for the first time almost 40 years ago, and the selective fire favored bursts with auto being the last click, and then some American imports had semi and full only. The Israeli non-export I tried had four positions, three of them for fire and one for safety. Some of the M16 variants had burst controls on them too. Each weapon is a tool in a tool box used for specific needs.
Bump stocks don’t seem to fulfill any need, so as the author suggested, its for recreational purposes but not very practical.
Now having spoken from a position of ignorance about the bump stocks, I am still not convinced that banning them or regulating them won’t end up with another workaround. People will engineer anything to avoid regs. It doesn’t mean they will be efficient workarounds. And as I said, even in the field, the only time you need full auto is in a particular circumstance. Anything beyond that is a waste of ammunition and leads to an inaccurate firearm.
This is about opinions, so here’s mine. The weapons most of us have access to are very capable. Although I recognize the need to fight for our rights, there will always be limits. That’s a fact. I believe, considering the onslaught from the left, our 2A representatives both in government and in our various associations (like the NRA) have done a pretty good job of retaining our rights. Regulating full auto firearms, while not completely effective, is a pretty good place to draw a line. I’ve never met anyone who was really concerned about not being able to own a full auto firearm for a resonable price. I was really surprised the first time I saw a bump stock. Not shocked, but it really doesn’t make sense. If you’re going to have a rule, have a rule. No bump stocks. They’re not needed. I assume the regulators had to make a decision on these devices and decided to err on the side of not creating a new rule. That’s commendable, but now they’ll probably have to go back and readdress the issue. They’ve got a tuff job, and I hope they can come up with language that makes sense and doesn’t screw things up too much. I’ll still be able to own high powered battle rifles that will fire as fast as I can pull he trigger, and that’s really fast. I can also conceal a firearm and 45 rounds of ammo. I’m not crying over a bump stock. And don’t tell me about the slippery slope. As long as they don’t go any farther than regulatin bump stocks, the slope is nowhere in sight.
I’ve never seen or heard a report from the investigating agency that said bumpstock equipped weapons were used in the Vegas shooting. The only thing I’ve read or heard, is that they were in the room. If there is info contrary to that, please point it out to me. Are we also going to ban all the other “types” of weapons that were in that room? If not, then why not. The people that got killed by them are just as dead. Once again, blame is being put on an object, rather then a person.
I noticed that most comments are left by people who have not owned or even fired a bump stock. I have one and fired an AR with it. IT IS NOT THE SAME RATE OF FIRE AS FULL AUTO! While it does fire faster than normal semi-auto, we tested it against someone who is experienced in rapid fire of semi auto weapon, which comes very close to bump fired rate. Regulation of a device like that would open the door to other gun controls. A bump stock fire arm does have a tactical use but is mostly recreational. The Las Vegas incident was extremely terribly unfortunate, but the photo shown of the weapon also showed that it had a bipod. Anyone who is familiar with bump-fire stocks knows that the bump fire does NOT work when the weapon is used on a bipod. It would have been extremely difficult to use. So questions do exist relevant to the Vegas shooting. Like any law or regulation banning or whatever will only apply to LAW ABIDING citizens…not criminals…
By the way, anyone who thinks bump-fire stocks should be banned or controlled, should also be in favor of banning Rental trucks…or at least requiring a background check before rental is provided….
what a stupid statement like comparing apples and oranges I am a member of nra and I have plenty of guns .all loaded, even including an ak 47. but I am not in favor of bump stocks, don’t need them.
Your, or any other person’s, definition or opinion of anyone else’s ‘need’ is irrelevant.
Stupid why? Make your argument, if you have one.
OK Mike V. Here is my argument – A stock for a firearm is not a firearm ,doesn’t matter what it does or looks like.
You obviously haven’t done much research on bump stocks if you think they don’t function off of a bipod… they most certainly function and I would argue it is much more effective and accurate than shooting without one. There is a Full30 video called “poor man’s saw” where it demonstrates exactly that. As far as same rate of fire on full auto, it most certainly can be. You need a very nice single stage lightweight trigger and a lightweight skeletonized bolt carrier group and a melonited gas tube so you don’t blow it out shooting a lot. Play around with different buffer weights and you can reach 800 RPM hell I’ve seen videos with 1100 RPM. It is doable.
In regards to the law they cannot ban bump stocks without redefining semi auto and/or banning any accessories like: Aftermarket triggers, lightweight bolt carriers, muzzle devices, etc. If that passes you can say goodbye to your gun rights in general. As many people before have stated you cant legislate a trigger finger. If you are against bump stocks I don’t really care but if you give them an inch they will take a mile and eventually they will come for something you do care about.
Since pretty much any “self loading rifle” (and even some pistols) can be “bump fired”, what’s next?
I know, all firearms capable of bump firing either have to go, or get a 25# trigger pull installed to make it impossible.
The line in the sand was 1934, but the public thought only “gangster weapons” were being “taxed”, it didn’t effect most people. Then the next one was in 1968, when “affordable handguns” were allegedly the “target” but suddenly “big scary guns” and “guns that aren’t taken to the woods to shoot Bambi” were added to the list…along with a permanent punishment for people who had served “Time”. But that was apparently okay too because nobody took to the streets to oppose it. The next line in the sand was in 1986, when some states were harassing gun owners for having the nerve to pass through so “a law was passed to tell them quit it” (yet most of these states still do the same thing anyways…good luck invoking the 1986 FOPA in NY or MA or NJ) and somehow an “amendment was added” declaring some of the firearms already “taxed” in 1934 were now capped at a fixed number. But nobody cared about that either, that was just fine because if you asked most people those guns weren’t legal anyways, they heard it on the news. Then in 1989, more guns were restricted from import because they looked like machine guns, and then in 1994, the final “line” was passed…suddenly magazines were capped at 10 rounds. Oh sure, you could have any made prior to the “ban”, but like that pesky 1986 “Law”, due to economics costs went up. And up. They dropped a touch in 2000 when a bunch of ones which should have been legal were allowed in…but that was temporary. Suddenly “low capacity magazines” were the norm. But that was fine, because unlike the last few “lines in the sand” the 94 one was allowed to expire.
The only reason people “bump fire” at all is because machine guns are fun, and due to the 1934, 1968, and 1986 “Laws” they got hard to buy (if your local CLEO wouldn’t sign your paperwork, well, none for you), then suddenly they started appreciating like antiques in 1986. Seriously, there isn’t really any other market in the world with such an artificial price jump yearly. Sure, a Bren from WW2 wouldn’t be $300 nowadays, but it would likely not be $40,000 to purchase if the “Hughes Amendment” hadn’t passed. And a Sten wouldn’t price like a “used car”, it’d cost more like the “muffler on a used car”.
But hell, I’m rambling. Let them ban bump stocks, it’s “all they want”…this time. Maybe next time a new “ban” is proposed it’ll effect something “you” do care about.
Me, I say hell no, but my experience with “bump firing” is precisely why the 1986 “Hughes Amendment” and the 1934 “National Firearms Act” need to go.
Back in…what, 2001 or 02, a guy in a “MySpace” gun group was at a friend of his house actually nearby, and he invited me up to shoot some guns. I brought a few of mine, and got to shoot a few of his. Then he pulled out one of those Musket length Yugoslavian SKS model 59/66 rifles. Loaded up the magazine, then said, “watch this!” and hooked his finger in his belt loop. “BRRRRRAP!” it went. We were in back of his house, there was a hillside about…probably 75 feet away or so. And while it looked cool, it had no accuracy. But it looked cool…he did it with a couple more “10 shot magazines” then put the rifle aside so we could fire some pistols.
And about 20 minutes later, a car pulls in the driveway.
Sheriff Deputy.
2 of them get out.
“We got a report of machine gun fire coming from this house. Also a report of their house being shot at.”
After the whole “bump firing” thing got explained, and the backstop was shown, and whatnot, the Deputy said, “well, okay, but that bumpy thing you did with the rifle sounds like a machine gun. And while I don’t know who called in to report it, I bet if you did it again they’ll call us again. And at some point the decision might decide to send backup just in case there’s an actual machine gun that I didn’t notice, or just in case there is…”
Okay, sue me, I didn’t record the conversation, but it was along those lines. I did find out later there was an ongoing dispute between the house owner whose backyard we were firing in, and a neighbor who didn’t like him.
To outlaw the bump stocks will mean shortly down the road there will be a demand to ban semi-autos. I have seen way more people bump fire guns WITHOUT a device than I have with. So the anti’s will catch on to this fact and direct the ATF to rule any semi-auto can be bump fired so all semi’auto’s now need to be banned. I find it utterly shameful the NRA got involved in this in the first place. The NRA did the same thing back in 1994 by figuring they would throw one group to the wolves and try to save the declining part of their organization. They got back to the business of SUPPORTING the 2nd amendment and their numbers flourished, now they have decided to re-interpret the 2nd amendment again at a time when their numbers need to hold or increase for the next election cycle. I have been supportive of the NRA for 30 plus years even thru their dark years after 1994 and crapping on probably 75% of their members but this may be the last straw for me. There are plenty of other 2nd amendment supportive groups that are not re-defining the meaning of the 2nd amendment to be more PC.
I too have decided not to renew my NRA membership over their stance regarding this issue.
Stupid best way to take the accuracy out of any gun look at any website and see how many uppers they are selling my a r never gets more than a few rounds at a time NO hot gun I take cayotes at 500 yards
Ban! I love shooting, not hunting and though I would enjoy the shooting of a full auto AK or AR. I am a realist when I shoot and wasting of ammunition is just a waste. I can not see an instance where I would need a inaccurate firing situation that would require the wild spraying of bullets down range. I can bump fire an AK and get just a little thrill when it happens and it only happens when I attempt to make is happen. Sorry, no logical, cost effective, useful reason for the bump fire stocks, in my mind.
Be careful. In order to ban bump stocks, congress is likely to ban match triggers as well.
It isn’t a coincidence that Paddocks hard drive is missing. There is no such thing as a mad man in these events. If they plan it, he is not insane. It was a political move by somebody smart. He probably had the Clintons get rid of his hard drive.
Paddock didn’t shoot anyone.- not even himself. The video/ audio footage clearly reveals an M240 belt fed was firing uninterrupted at 600 RPM.
Bump stocks are wildly inaccurate. Their only value to the law-abiding is to simulate a full-auto.
However, Bump stocks were recently proven to be the accessory of choice for murdering many innocents tightly packed in venues such as concerts, or football games, or weddings, or funerals, or graduations, or, or, or!
I say outlaw possession of bump stocks
You have no clue what you are talking about. I have shot using a bump stock and it is as controllable if the person using it knows how to do it. The “accessory of choice” used in the majority of all shootings is a semi-automatic handgun, are you proposing that they too be outlawed? The bump fire stock is an accessory and not a firearm. The ATF has no jurisdiction or authority to regulate accessories.
Amen demonic people who are inspired by the devil is the ones who (clinton)kills people not law abiding citizens back off ATF quit getting paid off by the anti gun people an keep your nose out of our business an our 2nd amend rights
I haven’t seen any proof that the bump stock weapons were actually shot.
I’ve read that he had two “real” automatic weapons.
Show us the proof. Show us anything about Vegas as they have been quiet for several months now.
Shall Not Be Infringed! The NFA is an infringement. The GCA is an infringement. The Hughes Amendment is an infringement. The myriad of import bans are an infringement.
The right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.
in·fringed
past tense: actively break the terms of (a law, agreement, etc.).
synonyms: contravene, violate, transgress, break, breach;
act so as to limit or undermine (something); encroach on.
“his legal rights were being infringed”
synonyms: restrict, limit, curb, check, encroach on;
Anyone that feels otherwise is either ignorant or a coward.
I like my bump stock(s). That being said, don’t throw around a word like “ignorant” so quick when you consider that a stock is not a firearm…in other words, it’s not protected under the 2nd amendment. They can infringe on stocks all they want
Here are a few other things that are not firearms, are you okay with them also being banned?
1. Rifle scopes
2. Red Dot sights
3. Reloading brass
4. Reloading bullets
5. Reloading dies
6. Reloading presses
I fully with Ken W. The 2nd Amendment needs to be re-enacted as written without all the PC and vote grabbing alterations that have been made. If people are crazy, that’s the problem to deal with. Leave the law-abiding people alone. I’m sick and tired of being denied my rights because some nutjob decides to act out. Let’s use some root cause analysis here and take care of the real problem, whatever it may be. The gun does not fire itself.
If all gun laws are an infringement then guns of all types should be allowed. They should also be sold in vending machines and at convenience stores and gas stations. Age restrictions? Another “infringement”! Down with all infringements on the beloved second amendment. Are you starting to see how stupid the “shall not be infringed” argument is yet?
IMO bump stocks are range toys for affluent Walter Mitty types with an unlimited ammo budget, and would have a doubtful role in situations where a civilian is lawfully defending self or other people.
That said I AGREE with those who say NO don’t get the gub’ment involved in their regulation. What’s next? Banning recoil pads? Registering your trigger finger? This is just another (sigh) slippery slope.
I suggest all shooters that have opinions ofbumpfire stocks and their accuacy and rate of fire take a very close look at Slidefire’s video that will answer any and all comments including accuracy, rate of fire and barrel rise….case closed.
I see no useful purpose for the bump stock in civilian use. Even the military discourages use of full automatic in many situations. Full automatic, in military use, encourages waste of heavy ammunition and promotes inaccuracy. That’s why a three-shot selector was made available. It takes the weapon completely out of the category of hunting, which will lose a lot of votes. As ex-military, ex-law-enforcement, and an ex-hunter, I find the term “fun”, used in describing guns and gun paraphernalia, to be offensive.
Wow, At what point did you become indoctrinated, with all those ‘ex’s’ ?
I find your post and lack of logic offensive, and inane.
Loss of “votes” is a concern in hunting by an “ex-hunter”? Then why would you care?
And if you have no more fun with guns, why the hell are you here? And why would you care?
Do you know the definition of a “Troll”?
The point at which all those “ex’s” occurred was probably when he was convicted of a felony or he has gone full blown Liberal, those are the only two choices to pick from.
You’re easily offended then?
Nothing wrong with enjoying your rights.
What you see a purpose for is irrelevant. The last I checked the military still uses and relies on full auto weaponry like the SAW quite heavily. The 2nd Amendment was not written for hunting firearms, so whether or not an accessory can be used for hunting is also irrelevant. I am former military, retired LEO and a hunter, I consider a day at the range teaching others proper firearm safety, handling and use to be fun. I also consider a day spent hunting wild hogs with my daughter to be fun. Finally, as an ATF licensed firearms collector, I consider collecting and learning about firearms and their history to be fun. I find your lack of knowledge on the 2nd Amendment and your willingness to allow a Constitutionally guaranteed right to be taken away to be offensive.
I’ve perused the Constitution, and I find no mention of “hunting” in the Second Amendment. Or anyplace it says “guns suitable for hunting fowl or game with the appropriate permits are the only things covered”.
I also find the Preamble to the Bill Of Rights to be enlightening, about how they are to “further restrict the government”.
But I bet you didn’t read that either.
Alan, Mike V, Chuck, Andrew; All well said. Jeff, get a life. Troll elsewhere.
I vote to BAN bumpstocks and REINSTATE fullauto weapons to the public. Purpose built fullautos are actually easier and safer to use than bump stock workarounds. Fullautos also give the people the ability to stand against the a Government which clearly refuses to acknowledge the boundaries they’ve overstepped. In short, fullauto prevents the entire nation from becoming New York, California or D.C. areas where the Gov’t is safe from the people but the people are at the mercy of Gov’t and other evildoers!
Must have missed the part about full auto when I was reading the second amendment. Stop with the regulations, bans etc. I haven’t seen or heard of one incident of criminals using the bump stock. As with all the regulations I abide, but a criminal doesn’t care and will not comply.
Personally, I do not care for the bump stock. It seems rather useless to me. I machine gun, a real machine gun that is, does not belong in the hands of the public. However, anything else should be fine and the government should leave us all alone. The liberal agenda of suppressing and or erasing the Second Amendment is becoming tiresome.
Which part of the 2nd Amendment gave the government the right to regulate machine guns?
It says it right at the end.
” except machine guns, weapons of war, silencers or short barreled rifles.”
At least I think it says those things…cant imagine our government violating the constitution right?
The issue is not bump-stocks. The issue is the incrementalism of ‘banning’ any item associated with a firearm and its possession and operation. If you can ban the nuts, bolts, springs and other parts one at a time, you eventually get to the point the firearm is useless–which is precisely the point of the effort of gun banners. If you cannot support other firearms owners, then you are greasing the slope to loss of Second Amendment rights. This is no time to be demure. No banning…period.
So we have laws so imprecise that when they need to,
they just look at it again and pull a rabbit out of their hat?
Can that really be considered rule of law?
NRA I believe went in this direction as a strategy. Unfortunately they may have provoked the bear when they poked it.
I never believed bump devices and similar would survive this crisis. Too many supposed second amendment supporters didn’t even know they existed, and their introduction was this.
Bumps wouldn’t even exist if the NFA wasn’t so preposterously draconian.
Sad, it wont effect me, but it’s the principle we’re conceding. We’re throwing them a bone, but eventually you run out.
Although I have no interest in owning a bump stock I support law abiding enthusiasts who do. The Las Vegas shooting is the only instance I’ve ever heard of a bump stock being used in a crime and I would guess that many gun owners never even knew what a bump stock was until the media and democrats tried to make it such an issue after that shooting. Handguns are used for murder far more than targeted semi auto rifles yet the left comes after what they refer to as assault rifles and military weapons of war, which they are not. Now they are targeting bump stocks which, to my knowledge, have been used in a mass shooting once on record. Maybe more but I’ve never heard of it and I take in a lot of info on the subject of guns and accessories. Bump stocks have been around a long time and didn’t hurt anyone and the majority of people never heard of them. Just like he supposed “anti Muslim” video that Democrats blamed for the Benghazi attacks. Again, most people never even heard of it until the Democrats made it an issue for their political agenda. It may have been offensive to a few people but most were unaware it even existed to be used for offense. Bump stocks can be used for nefarious purposes but most people didn’t even know they existed as an option for criminal use. Of course, now they do because the Democrats have plastered info on how they can be used for deadly purposes all across media and the internet. Leave the bump stocks alone and start enforcing existing laws.
It’s stupid you can bump fire without the stock anyway as good if not better
Don’t think you shoot as good or better. Now that said yes you can for about 15 maybe 20 seconds. Now if you are Jack The Bear you might make 30 + seconds.
First of all the full auto, bump stock etc. one must have way more Ammo and money than they know what to do with it.
Don’t get me wrong, if you can afford it more power to you. Get A full auto or bump stock or A binary trigger. Me I love to shoot and more than probably 75% of the gun owners, but I reload ALL my Ammo. 9 different pistol and 13 different rifle calibers and 12 and 20 gage shotgun shells.
This takes time and money to get the equipment to do this. That is why I do not have A bump stock or binary trigger or full auto. I still work for A living by the hour.
Just my 2 cents worth!!
Keep it loaded at all times, keep your eyes moving st all times and know your surroundings!! Because he who IS EXPECTING will not be deceived!!
🔫🇺🇸🇨🇱🤠
MURICA!!!!!! the bump stock don’t look like a AUTOSEAR , D I A S or a LIGHTNING LINK . the brown nosing ass grabbers must hop in spotlight! I bet most of the people involved in the bump stock ban don’t like fun or own more than 2 guns
Bumpstocks turn a semi-auto into a functionally fully automatic weapon. They should be controlled same as class III firearms.
Actually, they do not.
If you actually read the ATF description of what a machine gun IS, you will see the phrase “with a single pull of the trigger”.
Bump fire or Slide fire stocks allow the weapon to oscillate forward and backward, but each round fires with a single pull…one pull, one shot.
They will violate their own definition if they move forward with this.
FACT… ATFE classifies ANY TRUE… TRUE FULL AUTO weapon as being a gun you PULL THE TRIGGER AND HOLD IT thr gun will RUN UNTIL EMPTY, JAM, OR REMOVING YOUR FINGER! FYI… ALLLLLLL guns that REQUIRE A SINGLE PULL OF THE TRIGGER TO A A SINGLE SHOT ISSSSSS A SEMI AUTO weapon and NOT A CLASS THREE ANNNNNY THING! FACT is EVERY PERSON WORRIED about these bump stocks are COWARDS AND EXPECT… EXPECT our WORTHLESS COPS to PROTECT YOU ALWAYS when they are NEVER AROUND WHEN YOU NEEEEEEED THEM! HOW ABOUT getting YOURSELF A LEGAL CCW PERMIT AND PROTECT YOOOOOUUURSELVES!!!! And SORRY… BUT IF YOU HEAR A GUN GO OFF AND THEN SAY “that’s a gun” AND THEN KEEP STANDING RIGHT OUT IN THE WIDE OPEN NOT EVEN MOVING… Well that’s called BATTLE OF THE FITTEST OR IN MY EYES DUMB SHIT CONTROL!!!!! STUPID PEOPLE LIKE YOU THAT DONT OWN A SINGLE GUN DO NOOOOT GET A SAY ON WHAT USSSSS GUN OWNERS GET TO DO!!!!! It’s NOT YOUR BUSINESS WHAT WE MAY OR MAY NOT HAVE SO WHY ARE YOU HERE ON THIS PAGE?!
Don’t say “we” when you’re throwing an anti government tantrum because you didn’t like what someone else wrote in your “safe space.” You don’t speak for me.
I’m a STRONG second amendment supporter. The BUMP STOCK is NOT really a 2nd right. Full auto guns were put under MORE strict rules to keep these weapons out of the wrong hands…NO ONE really protested this…..BUMP STOCKS are a way to GET AROUND the law…..The Las Vegas shooting SHOWED, what PRACTICING can achieve……ADD the use of suppresser on those weapons and the argument of regulating suppressers comes up……They, TOO should be closely regulated……..I’m all for protecting hearing….But to strongly state that suppressers are MORE hearing protection and should not be regulated is a wrong.
Have you ever used or been around someone using a supressor?
You don’t have a clue what you are talking about . You have been watching to many James Bond movies . Silencers don’t silence a firearm . Most European countries require them to be used when shooting . Have you ever fired a firearm with a suppressor attached.
You sound like a guy named BlueDog that trolled these posts. Your opinion on what should or should not be regulated is just that- your opinion. We don’t even know conclusively what happened in Vegas & have not heard any substantive updates. Machineguns were tightly regulated but are now banned. Bump-firing is a technique & not a stock alone. Anyone can bump-fire a semiautomatic with practice. Do you want to ban ways in which people shoot semiautos?Maybe we should ban semiautos & go back to lever actions, as those can’t be bump- fired. Suppressors are also heavily regulated already. Hearing Protection Act would still have suppressors regulated as firearms with the same background checks a rifle or handgun would require. Maybe that’s not enough regulation for STRONG 2nd Amendment supporters.
This bump stock thing is nothing more than another infringement of “We The People”s rights! The ATF has bounced around rules changing their minds back and forth on many things and needs to be shut down. The bump stock is not a machine gun any more than my other firearms I can bump fire are machine guns. This is just the start of more regulations for law abiding citizens, triggers that fire too fast will be next!
I owned a bumpstock for about three mths , maybe used two -three times, then it wasn’t as fun anymore. But one of the problems here is , this is the first time ever that I know of that this device is used in a crime and they want to ban it already, what the hell people. NO,NO,NO, this is not right. Like others have said , next they will want to ban who knows what. This is not acceptable. Another problem, the media and others will not talk about, the guy who commited this crime , turned into a muslim and decided he doesn’t like America and Americans anymore. That is the bigger issue here !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
THANKS LEE FOR THE INFORMATION. MANY OF US HAVE DONE THIS FOR FUN FOR YEARS. NEXT THEY WILL OUTLAWS BELT LOOPS AND THUMBS
Just think of the ramifications of making bump fire devices designation as fully automatic weapons. All trousers and shorts will have to be re designed minus belt loops which will make anybody investing in the manufacture of suspenders instant billionaires. I of course being old and rotund of stature am already in possession of suspenders and am prepared for the transition as are most firemen.
Thank you for being the one person keeping a sense of humor about this today. It was refreshing.
When the ATF had already ruled the bump stock does not meet the criteria for the NFA definition of a “machinegun.” the NRA should have kept their mouth shut. Calling for something to be regulated that already meets the laws requirements is idiotic at best. I am an NRA member but do not agree with them on this one. They can regulate or ban it if they want, but it would be very easy to 3D print them. If this goes through they will be banning these, so many things will go with it, triggers below a certain pull weight etc., that it will be one of the biggest back door gun control laws ever made.
I think it’s silly to call a bumpstock a “machine gun”. It’s a way to make politicians feel good about themselves for the “Greater good” they say. Sure nonsense! We still don’t know what really happened in Las Vegas, but most logical Americans know that the LVPD & the FBI aren’t telling the truth to America people because they are in a major cover up mode, which is pathetic for the families that lost their loves ones in that horrific incident. It’s a fact, more guns in the hands of law abiding citizens to protect themselves lowers crime. Leave the bumpstocks alone period!
Personally have no use for bump stock. But would not support erosion of others right to the technique.
+1…one of the smartest comments on this subject I’ve read.
The link for the NSSF just goes to their splash page. I tried searching their site and couldn’t find the page where they are asking for comments. If you can, please post another link – thanks!
I see 3 outcomes: Do nothing, regulate it, or ban it. The ATF has already ruled the bump stock does not meet the criteria for the NFA definition of a “machinegun.” The ATF could likely reverse itself and deem it needs to be regulated. I think an out right ban would need Congress to amend the law to ban it.
I see it as a novelty item, on the other hand, it has been demonstrated in the commission of violent crime with a firearm with devastating results.
While I’m indifferent to a bump stock, I think if it comes to regulation or ban, that would constitute another assault on infringing a right conveniently vailed as a necessary action to protect people from “gun violence.”
Nonetheless, the Federal government has been chipping away at rights with the passage of: National Firearms Act of 1934, Gun Control Act of 1968, Brady Handgun Violence Prevention Act of 1993, and the Omnibus Crime Control Act of 1994, and all the state and local laws concerning firearms.
First You may be right to a Point but to say it was used in a Violent crime we have yet to see proof of that!!!! As far as I know There is zero PROOF that it was used in Vegas and the ongoing COVER UP of the VEGAS shooting is in its self a CRIME Now the Feds have sealed all Documents on this SHOOTING which lends me to believe that Steven Paddock was a GUN RUNNER for them and was supplying guns into the Philippines for the FEDS. To many loop holes and LIES going on here and remember never let a CRISIS go to waste. If we trade off FREEDOMS Granted us for a little Security well not a Rabbit hole I am willing to go down!!!! I say no to any INFRINGEMENT PERIOD
Folks really misread into the NRA’s stand on that, and the media left saw an opportunity to divide and weaken and ran with it…
We need to stop the knee jerk reaction to legislate our rights away. Bump firing is a technique… not a stock. A stock is nothing more than an accessory to accommodate the technique. Making bump fire stocks is a slippery slope. Technically every pair of pants comes with an integrated bump stock… called a belt loop… No seriously, think about the legal ramifications and how things have to be defined and precedented in court. Its a bad idea, and it won’t solve anything. Frankly its an answer to a nonexistent problem. Just another excuse for a larger agenda to chip away another piece of the 2A pie.
@ Lee: The NRA gets bashed quite a bit and I notice it’s mainly by people who are not members and especially non-voting members. It’s just like politics, if you don’t vote, STFU while everyone else protects your rights.
Benefactor voting member here…back in the 1990’s I told everyone NRA stood for “No Real Action” because it was true at the time. As State and local level “Assault Weapons Laws” dotted the landscape they did very little.
They cleaned up their act and have done a fairly respectable job over the past decade, but when it came to this issue they stepped on their dick again. Just one voting members opinion, not looking to throw the baby out with the bath water just yet, but let’s keep it real.
Criminal misuse is criminal misuse, whether its a stock or magazine, car, truck, or? I personally don’t have any firearms that could be fitted with a bumpstock, but Based on the Gov. approach to regulation, it would appear that the first group of persons banned from having these devises should be millionaire Nevada gamblers.